I'm sitting on the 'Holy Grail' system - How can I fund this?

BSD

Veteren member
3,819 985
He looks at whats moving at the time, Dax, always volatile and giving out plenty of opportunities per day, plus Bund and some currency futures.

Did he look at oil too, cl, don't remember offhand.
 

Billy Gates

Active member
161 14
I just cant agree here, from personal experience and what ive read.
You give 10 good traders a system has made good money over the last 2 years, they are just told to go and trade it as per instruction.
I be almost certain that after a year of trading it (time involved, size all being equal etc) youd get 10 different results along with 10 different explanations of why xyz did or didnt work. Why?
Or the trader is trading his own perfected method, and xyz happens to destabilize him emotionally, it doesnt have to be market related, actually imo, it doesnt have to anything related. If he is unaware of his instability, or is aware but chooses not to address it (self sabotage). Jesse Livermore (sorry random) would be the example.


The psychology is different for each individual, the goal is the same, their own process of thinking about and working it out unique to themselves. All this in search of finding a method that works.

After all the soul searching and psychological application, they may come full circle to exactly the same method that was put before them in the beginning. They just didn’t believe it then.

The markets just are, they are the same regardless of whether you are a successful trader with a method or an unsuccessful trader without one. The only thing that creates a different perspective is the psychological aspect.


English maybe? ;)
 
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darktone

Veteren member
4,016 1,084
The psychology is different for each individual, the goal is the same, their own process of thinking about and working it out unique to themselves. All this in search of finding a method that works.
Agree

After all the soul searching and psychological application, they may come full circle to exactly the same method that was put before them in the beginning.
Agree

They just didn’t believe it then.
Maybe this would be more realistic.

They believed it because the method is proven and they traded it, but during its execution, results differ because each of them has a different view of what the market is, and what its actions means to them.
Ie the method might have a 10 losses in a row limit, but trader 8 pukes and pulls the plug at 5 losses. Or whatever, insert any situation that could cause emotional stress, each one would an impact of sorts on the results

The markets just are, they are the same regardless of whether you are a successful trader with a method or an unsuccessful trader without one. The only thing that creates a different perspective is the psychological aspect.
They are also the same if you are an unsuccessful trader with a successful method.
 
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tonynox

Newbie
1 0
This guy is incredible!

According to my calculations if you invested £1 in your system at an annual rate of return of 750% it would be worth £4,479,215,103,533.80 in 5 years! However you don,t seem to be able to scrape together £1 to invest in it even after 10 years of trading and studying Forex? Don,t worry though because if it’s the "holy grail" i’ll give you £1( stock market has been good to me this year!) Give me a ring. Cheers
 

tar

Legendary member
10,443 1,313
According to my calculations if you invested £1 in your system at an annual rate of return of 750% it would be worth £4,479,215,103,533.80 in 5 years! However you don,t seem to be able to scrape together £1 to invest in it even after 10 years of trading and studying Forex? Don,t worry though because if it’s the "holy grail" i’ll give you £1( stock market has been good to me this year!) Give me a ring. Cheers

It seems that your calculation is way off !
 

Fugazsy

Veteren member
3,661 677
First: I'm not soliciting investors - rather seeking to get assistance in brainstorming the different ways I can get this business off the ground.

Second: I have 0 interest in going in to any revealing detail about my strategy, even in the highest level. As far as I'm concerned: I'm holding on to a billion dollar ticket and in this trading game, the value of a market advantage deteriorates rapidly if it becomes well known. I will discuss the success of the system a bit to explain why I am so anxious to get off the ground with this full time and so it's understood why even with (relatively) minimal capitalization, getting this going ASAP makes so much sense.

Third: I am not a rookie or a kid. I have studied the markets for over 10 years - traded Forex as an under-capitalized full time trader full time for part of it, and for the other part have been battling with the masses like everyone else while working a straight job.

Fourth: No, I am not joking - Everything contained within is 100% factual and again, I am no rookie.

NOW:

I have developed a 100% mechanical strategy (meaning, the signals are easily seen coming in advance, perfectly defined, and my favorite part - personal discretion is eliminated making back testing 100% legitimate. I don't care if every piece of news and technical analysis says to short the Euro, if this simple system says long - I do it with absolutely 0 regard for anything else) . This strategy is back testing absolutely unreal results; I have never seen anything like it.

The results: after THOUSANDS of trades, over several years, looking at most major currency pairs (and also looking at stocks and futures - I have yet to find an instrument that causes this system to fail but I will stick to FOREX as It's what I know): this system produces consistently greater than 83% win percentage. The losses are capped as a maximum of the win (meaning seeking a 100 pip profit, the maximum loss is 100 pips): but since most losses are actually smaller -the average loss is 65% the size of the winning trade target. Again: 83% wins where the wins are 154% larger than the losses, where the MAXIMUM loss is equal to ONE winning trade = you do the math. I have, and the result is effectively unlimited profits as a function only of what is invested. Trading any given currency pair in my testing resulted in an average of 750% annual return from approximately 100 trades per year (per instrument) and my desire is to trade 4-6 pairs simultaneously and target returns which will only serve to make this post seem even more outlandish to all.

FAQ: backtesting? Meh... tons of systems backtest well but don't work!
Answer: YES, but this system seeks gains large enough and with enough foresight that limit orders are easily used so entry and exit at or within pips of the targets is all but guaranteed. Also, this system is like I said, 100% mechanical meaning the biggest variable in backtesting is eliminated (the human element: errors, emotions, judgement calls, etc). I can say with 100% confidence that this system will trade EXACTLY as it backtests (this statement is no doubt very stinky to many of you as with what most know that isn't possible - it is with what I am doing). I can say with confidence that if this system were traded over the past 365 days, the result would have been +750% trading the EUR/USD alone on 115 trades. Add in additional currency pairs and you can begin to feel my excitement.

What you're describing isn't possible! You sound like a naive idiot. I agree. If myself of 2 months ago were to be reading this I'd think the same. It isn't possible with what I knew from 10+ years of playing in the market; but long story short - I've had a revelation and am staring at unlimited free money. No, not possible with the systems and charts probably everyone is staring at and I stared at for over a decade. I've shifted my entire mindset and the results are staggering.


I provide that back story so that my request is taken seriously. I am 100% committed to getting this off the ground ASAP. I am working full time but need to find the capital to get this off the ground so I can make these 300 trades a year and produce the 1000%+ return.
BACK TO THE POINT OF THIS THREAD::::

Where can a trader, like myself, who is sitting on absolute gold, go to get off the ground. Please help me evaluate the ideas currently in my head, and I'm hoping someone has a better one:

1)Rich friends. I have them. Rich people love nothing more than to invest in ideas like this and I'm 95% confident I can get more than enough money with fairly minimal effort through this avenue. The downsides: 1) they are friends, I don't like discussing finances with friends 2) since I would be managing their account, understandably, the majority of the profits would need to go to them 3) I hate convincing people of things. Ideally, I find a way to finance this thing on my own accord. The idea of having to talk someone into 'investing' in me is wholly unappealing to me. Nonetheless, this remains a possibility and as I consider the alternatives, it may be the most realistic.

2)Piece it together from my own finances. Tax return coming in, I have some home equity, my brokerage takes $5k per month credit card deposits, 401k, etc. I could probably piece together about 50k which is enough clearly with the 750% returns to make a living but ultimately that isn't a lot of money and being undercapatalized in such a way would adversely affect my risk:reward tolerance making 750% alot less likely. This is a possibility, but I don't like it. If i could piece together 100k I'd feel alot better about this option. 50k just feels a little tight, even with the gold I'm sitting on.

3)slow and steady wins the race. Take a piece of #2, say 10k and over the course of 2 years turn it into 100k by trading in the evenings and on the weekends. This is my absolute last resort: a) that is an incredible amount of patience when again, I'm sitting on solid gold. and b) I've done the full time trading + full time working game for years - it's a hellish workload that is a drain unlike what I want to experience again. If I'm going to be trading for 50 hours a week, that's my job. I've got a family and I've put them through enough Full time job + full time trader for one lifetime. So, while this remains a viable last resort option, it is definitely 'last resort'.

WHAT ELSE IS THERE?
Prop Shops - I know very little about these but could this be the answer I'm looking for?

Banks - maybe not a traditional bank like US Bank or BOA, but are there any financial institutions that might be something I should look into?

Private funding - (again, not soliciting here), is there any organizations I should look into which fund ventures like this with private equity?

Anything else I am not considering?

83% win percentage with an RR 1:1 based on 100 pips?

NO WAY.

83% win percentage with an RR 1:1 based on 5 to 10 pips ?

I believe it is possible, but you have to be really good, you have to trade with not mind at all........:whistling

60% win percentage with an RR 1 :2 based on 5 pips risk will be a more realistic option in my view .
 

mr_cassandra

Well-known member
349 36
one way to gather paying customers

First: I'm not soliciting investors - rather seeking to get assistance in brainstorming the different ways I can get this business off the ground.

Second: I have 0 interest in going in to any revealing detail about my strategy, even in the highest level. As far as I'm concerned: I'm holding on to a billion dollar ticket and in this trading game, the value of a market advantage deteriorates rapidly if it becomes well known. I will discuss the success of the system a bit to explain why I am so anxious to get off the ground with this full time and so it's understood why even with (relatively) minimal capitalization, getting this going ASAP makes so much sense.

Third: I am not a rookie or a kid. I have studied the markets for over 10 years - traded Forex as an under-capitalized full time trader full time for part of it, and for the other part have been battling with the masses like everyone else while working a straight job.

Fourth: No, I am not joking - Everything contained within is 100% factual and again, I am no rookie.

NOW:

I have developed a 100% mechanical strategy (meaning, the signals are easily seen coming in advance, perfectly defined, and my favorite part - personal discretion is eliminated making back testing 100% legitimate. I don't care if every piece of news and technical analysis says to short the Euro, if this simple system says long - I do it with absolutely 0 regard for anything else) . This strategy is back testing absolutely unreal results; I have never seen anything like it.

The results: after THOUSANDS of trades, over several years, looking at most major currency pairs (and also looking at stocks and futures - I have yet to find an instrument that causes this system to fail but I will stick to FOREX as It's what I know): this system produces consistently greater than 83% win percentage. The losses are capped as a maximum of the win (meaning seeking a 100 pip profit, the maximum loss is 100 pips): but since most losses are actually smaller -the average loss is 65% the size of the winning trade target. Again: 83% wins where the wins are 154% larger than the losses, where the MAXIMUM loss is equal to ONE winning trade = you do the math. I have, and the result is effectively unlimited profits as a function only of what is invested. Trading any given currency pair in my testing resulted in an average of 750% annual return from approximately 100 trades per year (per instrument) and my desire is to trade 4-6 pairs simultaneously and target returns which will only serve to make this post seem even more outlandish to all.

FAQ: backtesting? Meh... tons of systems backtest well but don't work!
Answer: YES, but this system seeks gains large enough and with enough foresight that limit orders are easily used so entry and exit at or within pips of the targets is all but guaranteed. Also, this system is like I said, 100% mechanical meaning the biggest variable in backtesting is eliminated (the human element: errors, emotions, judgement calls, etc). I can say with 100% confidence that this system will trade EXACTLY as it backtests (this statement is no doubt very stinky to many of you as with what most know that isn't possible - it is with what I am doing). I can say with confidence that if this system were traded over the past 365 days, the result would have been +750% trading the EUR/USD alone on 115 trades. Add in additional currency pairs and you can begin to feel my excitement.

What you're describing isn't possible! You sound like a naive idiot. I agree. If myself of 2 months ago were to be reading this I'd think the same. It isn't possible with what I knew from 10+ years of playing in the market; but long story short - I've had a revelation and am staring at unlimited free money. No, not possible with the systems and charts probably everyone is staring at and I stared at for over a decade. I've shifted my entire mindset and the results are staggering.


I provide that back story so that my request is taken seriously. I am 100% committed to getting this off the ground ASAP. I am working full time but need to find the capital to get this off the ground so I can make these 300 trades a year and produce the 1000%+ return.
BACK TO THE POINT OF THIS THREAD::::

Where can a trader, like myself, who is sitting on absolute gold, go to get off the ground. Please help me evaluate the ideas currently in my head, and I'm hoping someone has a better one:

1)Rich friends. I have them. Rich people love nothing more than to invest in ideas like this and I'm 95% confident I can get more than enough money with fairly minimal effort through this avenue. The downsides: 1) they are friends, I don't like discussing finances with friends 2) since I would be managing their account, understandably, the majority of the profits would need to go to them 3) I hate convincing people of things. Ideally, I find a way to finance this thing on my own accord. The idea of having to talk someone into 'investing' in me is wholly unappealing to me. Nonetheless, this remains a possibility and as I consider the alternatives, it may be the most realistic.

2)Piece it together from my own finances. Tax return coming in, I have some home equity, my brokerage takes $5k per month credit card deposits, 401k, etc. I could probably piece together about 50k which is enough clearly with the 750% returns to make a living but ultimately that isn't a lot of money and being undercapatalized in such a way would adversely affect my risk:reward tolerance making 750% alot less likely. This is a possibility, but I don't like it. If i could piece together 100k I'd feel alot better about this option. 50k just feels a little tight, even with the gold I'm sitting on.

3)slow and steady wins the race. Take a piece of #2, say 10k and over the course of 2 years turn it into 100k by trading in the evenings and on the weekends. This is my absolute last resort: a) that is an incredible amount of patience when again, I'm sitting on solid gold. and b) I've done the full time trading + full time working game for years - it's a hellish workload that is a drain unlike what I want to experience again. If I'm going to be trading for 50 hours a week, that's my job. I've got a family and I've put them through enough Full time job + full time trader for one lifetime. So, while this remains a viable last resort option, it is definitely 'last resort'.

WHAT ELSE IS THERE?
Prop Shops - I know very little about these but could this be the answer I'm looking for?

Banks - maybe not a traditional bank like US Bank or BOA, but are there any financial institutions that might be something I should look into?

Private funding - (again, not soliciting here), is there any organizations I should look into which fund ventures like this with private equity?

Anything else I am not considering?

there is a web site called collective2.com where you can showcase your system and have your trades publicly audited in real time. This website will let thousands of people see your real-world results.

It will cost you very little to list there and as the months go by and your successful real-time trades get recorded, you will gain paying subscribers from your publicly audited results.

Please be aware that if your results are bad, that also.....will be publicly displayed.
 
Last edited:

Oshabu

Newbie
4 0
I'd love to learn a bit more about trading

Hello!

I'm a beginner in the field, Only heard about the option of making money online by trading Binary options recently and I'd love to get some tips and ideas how to it without losing everything I've invested in to it :confused:
 

gerryg

Established member
900 7
Hello!

I'm a beginner in the field, Only heard about the option of making money online by trading Binary options recently and I'd love to get some tips and ideas how to it without losing everything I've invested in to it :confused:

:D Lol trading can be a money making machine but it won't generate tons of money with hands down. Check this forum broker sections as well as newbie folder you will definitely find a lot of useful stuff you can start with. Check FPA military school and and babypips pip school
 

Oshabu

Newbie
4 0
:D Lol trading can be a money making machine but it won't generate tons of money with hands down. Check this forum broker sections as well as newbie folder you will definitely find a lot of useful stuff you can start with. Check FPA military school and and babypips pip school

thanks I will check it out. :)
BTW have you heard about the option of writing your own options and trading against other traders?
 

mstrathern

Newbie
8 3
I have only quickly scanned through this thread so sorry if I'm repeating what someone else has posted. But have you considered Kelly Criterion betting. This is the fastest way to compound your money in the long run. However you need nerves of steel as using Kelly bets can be hairaising to say the least.
 

Pat494

Legendary member
14,621 1,578
There are MT4/5 programmers who will code up your system BUT you have to pay them.
 
 
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