SOCRATES
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Dear Rodenvald,
Yes, very witty.
No, I am not a reincarnation, but I have adopted this name in honour of a Greek philosopher who was determined to help people less fortunate than himself, because for him it was very easy to enlighten others through a process of training them to think correctly, because for him to think correctly, that is to be able to logically deduce and reason was not difficult either, in contradistinction to others who interrupt with nonsense and irrelevant flippant comments.
It happened that in ancient Greece there were two schools of philosophical pursuit. The first was that started by Aristotle, who was Socrates's tutor and mentor, devoted to the pursuit of intellectual excellence, in which any idea or statement had to stand up to the application of reason.
The other school of philosophical pursuit was that of Plato.
Plato postulated the hypothesis that it did not matter if people were given the opportunity to be educated or not, or whether they were instrumental in preventing others from being educated, provided that even if they chose not to logically deduce and reason, anything was acceptable provided that they enjoyed themselves.
Now sir, what next unfolded was a tragedy.
Socrates, being seen by hidden vested interests to be active in sweeping away the cobwebs of belief and superstition and other intellectual evils was accused and charged with attempts to corrupt the young. He conducted his own defence in a Greek open court in which he failed to overcome the guile and wickedness of his accusers, since all he asked was for them to act in a moral fashion within a framework of logic and reason, which it will be no surprise to you but it is to me that this they were both unwilling and unable to do.
As a consequence of this Socrates was sentenced to death, by taking a potion of Hemlock. Aristotle and others tried in vain to persuade him to recant, and if he did, hid life would be spared.
Socrated flatly refused, on the basis that he would not lower, let alone abandon his principles to satisfy his critics. He then proceeded to drink the Hemlock, because he preferred to be remembered, as he knew that if people later in history were to hear and learn from this event, it would do a lot to persuade thinkers not to succumb to what seems plausible and easy, but to choose to examine, to apply reasoned judgement, and to logically deduce for themselves. I have no intention of putting myself or any of my people in a situation fraught with dangers that sadly, even 2404 years after the event still exist, but I am going to have a jolly good crack at helping people that need help,by informing them of what they ought and need to know but are prevented from so doing, rather than what they want, or think that they want.
Yes, very witty.
No, I am not a reincarnation, but I have adopted this name in honour of a Greek philosopher who was determined to help people less fortunate than himself, because for him it was very easy to enlighten others through a process of training them to think correctly, because for him to think correctly, that is to be able to logically deduce and reason was not difficult either, in contradistinction to others who interrupt with nonsense and irrelevant flippant comments.
It happened that in ancient Greece there were two schools of philosophical pursuit. The first was that started by Aristotle, who was Socrates's tutor and mentor, devoted to the pursuit of intellectual excellence, in which any idea or statement had to stand up to the application of reason.
The other school of philosophical pursuit was that of Plato.
Plato postulated the hypothesis that it did not matter if people were given the opportunity to be educated or not, or whether they were instrumental in preventing others from being educated, provided that even if they chose not to logically deduce and reason, anything was acceptable provided that they enjoyed themselves.
Now sir, what next unfolded was a tragedy.
Socrates, being seen by hidden vested interests to be active in sweeping away the cobwebs of belief and superstition and other intellectual evils was accused and charged with attempts to corrupt the young. He conducted his own defence in a Greek open court in which he failed to overcome the guile and wickedness of his accusers, since all he asked was for them to act in a moral fashion within a framework of logic and reason, which it will be no surprise to you but it is to me that this they were both unwilling and unable to do.
As a consequence of this Socrates was sentenced to death, by taking a potion of Hemlock. Aristotle and others tried in vain to persuade him to recant, and if he did, hid life would be spared.
Socrated flatly refused, on the basis that he would not lower, let alone abandon his principles to satisfy his critics. He then proceeded to drink the Hemlock, because he preferred to be remembered, as he knew that if people later in history were to hear and learn from this event, it would do a lot to persuade thinkers not to succumb to what seems plausible and easy, but to choose to examine, to apply reasoned judgement, and to logically deduce for themselves. I have no intention of putting myself or any of my people in a situation fraught with dangers that sadly, even 2404 years after the event still exist, but I am going to have a jolly good crack at helping people that need help,by informing them of what they ought and need to know but are prevented from so doing, rather than what they want, or think that they want.
Salty Gibbon
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2P=N
10P = E
10P = E
Sorry, did not mean to dis Saint Mark, I will just go back to trading well without him. Should anyone be struggling with inner demons, I can tell you what got me on top of all the greed, discipline, mental control stuff and into profitable trading - something called The Sedona Method.
Salty Gibbon
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Mark Douglas's book is good for propping up my laptop.
My copy is mostly unread and is in mint condition. Any buyers ?
My copy is mostly unread and is in mint condition. Any buyers ?
Salty Gibbon
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That's " Trading in the Zone" by the way which is another unintelligible treatise by this seasoned waffler.
Salty Gibbon
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Spot on Schoe
Rognvald
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Socrates,
I am not a classical scholar but am sufficiently educated to know of the Aristotelian/Socratic and Platonic schools of thought and so I have some idea where you are coming from.
I do, it is true, take refuge from time to time, in what may be seen as nonsensical and irrelevantly flippant comments and what is almost certainly low quality wit. When I do so I try to provoke a reaction to tease out a little more information to lay on the table.
Quote:-
"As anyone who has read Plato's dialogues will tell you, Socrates was so annoying in his persistent questioning that anyone would sympathize with an interlocutor who throttled him after a frustrating bout of dialectical discussion. Part of the problem was Socrates's claim of ignorance--Socrates never answered questions (at least in the early dialogues), he just asked them of his victim and showed the victim's answers to be sadly wanting."
I appreciate the sincerity of all you have said and I do not question your motives. I was and still am curious though as writing styles are very individual and bear the same similarities as music by the same composer - often leitmotifs appear and reappear
I asked in all seriousness whether you were a reincarnation - I meant of a previous poster on this site who appeared to have many of your qualities. The question should not be interpreted as anything other than a desire to know.
Best wishes
Rognvald
I am not a classical scholar but am sufficiently educated to know of the Aristotelian/Socratic and Platonic schools of thought and so I have some idea where you are coming from.
I do, it is true, take refuge from time to time, in what may be seen as nonsensical and irrelevantly flippant comments and what is almost certainly low quality wit. When I do so I try to provoke a reaction to tease out a little more information to lay on the table.
Quote:-
"As anyone who has read Plato's dialogues will tell you, Socrates was so annoying in his persistent questioning that anyone would sympathize with an interlocutor who throttled him after a frustrating bout of dialectical discussion. Part of the problem was Socrates's claim of ignorance--Socrates never answered questions (at least in the early dialogues), he just asked them of his victim and showed the victim's answers to be sadly wanting."
I appreciate the sincerity of all you have said and I do not question your motives. I was and still am curious though as writing styles are very individual and bear the same similarities as music by the same composer - often leitmotifs appear and reappear
I asked in all seriousness whether you were a reincarnation - I meant of a previous poster on this site who appeared to have many of your qualities. The question should not be interpreted as anything other than a desire to know.
Best wishes
Rognvald
Mr. Charts
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Trading in the Zone
I have coached many who have read it and they still have had problems afterwards. However, in all fairness, a few found it helpful.
I suspect lots of people enjoy recognising and reading about their own weaknesses -"ah, so it's not just me!"
Practical advice from someone who has walked the walk rather than merely talked the talk is what was necessary.
So yeah, as a trader you need to understand many things about yourself, but too much navel-gazing is very unhealthy, especially in the trading business.
Of course, only my opinion.
I have coached many who have read it and they still have had problems afterwards. However, in all fairness, a few found it helpful.
I suspect lots of people enjoy recognising and reading about their own weaknesses -"ah, so it's not just me!"
Practical advice from someone who has walked the walk rather than merely talked the talk is what was necessary.
So yeah, as a trader you need to understand many things about yourself, but too much navel-gazing is very unhealthy, especially in the trading business.
Of course, only my opinion.
SOCRATES
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Navel gazing is not unhealthy, navel reflection is...
I started taking an interest in the topic of Stock Markets at the age of 9 or 10. I bought my first block of shares at the age of 15, and then in my father's name because I was too young. I am now 59, and I am still at it., and during all these years I have devoured everything I could get my hands on with regard to this topic, and I have encountered some books that are truly door stops, and this one is one of them. Sorry, that is a view.
I also have a stockmarket chum, who is also a successful veteran who is even older than me who also says he is baffled, but his is an opinion, because he is upset at not being able to crack it, whereas I am not, so there !
What is very unhealthy is to blunder along expecting to find a "system" that exonerates the blunderer from grafting first at the market, and secondly at himself.
Blunderers dabble in "systems" - grafters evolve "methods". If you do not understand this, you should not be trading or coaching, because it is obvious that a method can be applied to a system, but not a system to a method, please !
Mr. Charts said:
I started taking an interest in the topic of Stock Markets at the age of 9 or 10. I bought my first block of shares at the age of 15, and then in my father's name because I was too young. I am now 59, and I am still at it., and during all these years I have devoured everything I could get my hands on with regard to this topic, and I have encountered some books that are truly door stops, and this one is one of them. Sorry, that is a view.
I also have a stockmarket chum, who is also a successful veteran who is even older than me who also says he is baffled, but his is an opinion, because he is upset at not being able to crack it, whereas I am not, so there !
What is very unhealthy is to blunder along expecting to find a "system" that exonerates the blunderer from grafting first at the market, and secondly at himself.
Blunderers dabble in "systems" - grafters evolve "methods". If you do not understand this, you should not be trading or coaching, because it is obvious that a method can be applied to a system, but not a system to a method, please !
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SOCRATES
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Of plain speaking........
Yes, very good, plain speaking, blunt, to the point. But, even when something is explained very clearly many people do not understand it, because they are not accustomed to this.
They now proceed to look for a catch. Of course there is no catch. They persist. They do not find it. Now they get they get frustrated.
Now they begin to invent difficulties......and no sooner does a genius appear, than all the dunces in the world conspire against him, don't you find ?
chump said:
Yes, very good, plain speaking, blunt, to the point. But, even when something is explained very clearly many people do not understand it, because they are not accustomed to this.
They now proceed to look for a catch. Of course there is no catch. They persist. They do not find it. Now they get they get frustrated.
Now they begin to invent difficulties......and no sooner does a genius appear, than all the dunces in the world conspire against him, don't you find ?
SOCRATES
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A bit of nonsense can also be fun sometimes
Yes, thank you very much for your explanation. Yes low quality wit also has value in the same way as a very vulgar tart can be very entertaining for a short period of time, but an extended welcome could prove to be somewhat tiresome if there are important/interesting matters to discuss at a higher level of understanding.
Now sir, if you wish to ask a question of me please do so directly and if I have the answer I should be pleased to let you have it, as I am accustomed to being asked questions.
You will find in this topic I seldom ask one, also those I have trained to the highest levels astonish speakers because they are prone to listen very politely, and not ask any questions either. This is not because they are dull, it is because they don't have to, unless they spot something so irritating that needs dealing with immediately.
This misinterpretation by the casual observer not privy to the above can have most entertaining and comic consequences as several very important gurus have found to their embarassment,
when confronted by exactly the conduct you mention in my namesakes tecqnique but in front of thousands, not to show their answers to be sadly wanting, but to be proved completely wrong,indeed asinine, not just as the consequence of a view, but one that can stand up to the most ferocious testing, from any angle, anywhere, at any time, under any circumstances, in any context.
This is not done with the object of belittling people, but with the purpose of exposing nonsense, of which a lot of is talked in this business.
It may be that the previous poster having been seriously grounded and trained by me may have adopted phrases
that I use, as a matter of habit. And if that is the case
perhaps he may come back and give us some more.
Good Wishes, Kind Regards,
Rognvald said:
Yes, thank you very much for your explanation. Yes low quality wit also has value in the same way as a very vulgar tart can be very entertaining for a short period of time, but an extended welcome could prove to be somewhat tiresome if there are important/interesting matters to discuss at a higher level of understanding.
Now sir, if you wish to ask a question of me please do so directly and if I have the answer I should be pleased to let you have it, as I am accustomed to being asked questions.
You will find in this topic I seldom ask one, also those I have trained to the highest levels astonish speakers because they are prone to listen very politely, and not ask any questions either. This is not because they are dull, it is because they don't have to, unless they spot something so irritating that needs dealing with immediately.
This misinterpretation by the casual observer not privy to the above can have most entertaining and comic consequences as several very important gurus have found to their embarassment,
when confronted by exactly the conduct you mention in my namesakes tecqnique but in front of thousands, not to show their answers to be sadly wanting, but to be proved completely wrong,indeed asinine, not just as the consequence of a view, but one that can stand up to the most ferocious testing, from any angle, anywhere, at any time, under any circumstances, in any context.
This is not done with the object of belittling people, but with the purpose of exposing nonsense, of which a lot of is talked in this business.
It may be that the previous poster having been seriously grounded and trained by me may have adopted phrases
that I use, as a matter of habit. And if that is the case
perhaps he may come back and give us some more.
Good Wishes, Kind Regards,
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Salty Gibbon
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Yawn Socrates. You are getting tedious man.
TheBramble
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Rognvald said:
Yes. An irritating style of discourse which some feel intimidated by, others feel is rather clever and many feel is tosh. It also allows some practitioners to appear lofty and wise while hiding their own real ignorance.
It is (as all things have to be) an offshoot from the Aristotelian school of thought which defines us as existing within a dichotomous universe - 'A or B', 'YES or NO' - which although useful in many rational endeavours, has hamstrung civilisation's loftier aspirations for a couple of thousand years.
There was and is a place for these characters, their rationale and style. Study of them will reap immeasurable rewards. But their approach and style is not (IMHO) particularly useful for traders of in the 21st century.
This is not a poke at SOCRATES the t2w member - I am enjoying the game.
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