Gold - Commodity or currency?

[new_trader]

Well, the 1 pound coin and a quarter in the US don't say such a thing. Does that mean they're different from a 5 quid note and a dollar bill? And no, paper money isn't a "promise to pay", regardless of what it says, and it's important to make that distinction. But that's a discussion for another day.

Which brings us back around to the Coinage Act of 1792. It didn't need to say "promise to pay" because the money was made from gold and silver so it had intrinsic value.

 

[Atilla]

But you're not addressing the issue and you're describing a situation that is precisely NOT allowed to occur... Money supply and all that will affect the mkt value of assets and ccies in the traditional manner. However, that's not the point. We're not talking about mkt mechanisms here. We're talking about an artificially engineered arrangement where the yuan cannot appreciate against the dollar. So it doesn't matter what Sam and Wang do, it doesn't matter what "real" price changes need to happen, they cannot happen. And yes, the US is playing a bluffing game, but so is China. Both know they need the other guy, but are waiting for them to blink first.

And on that note, time for bed...

This is where we differ.

Artificial engineering is US printing dollars to pay for its way whilst other countries have to work. Do you not see this?

Why should the Yuan appreciate against the dollar? Says who?

Pegged rates provide certainty - facilitate trade. Move away from uncertainty and political bias. Gold also provides for this mechanism.


One of the biggest threats facing the world right now is Banks have no transparency in terms of assets and liabilities and derivatives market is a bubble the size of Jupitor. Nobody can manage risk inherent in derivatives. Everything is so highly geared that there isn't enough zeros on calculators. 3 trillion of money came off the presses.

As NT says - I'm afraid you do not understand real goods and services and nominal money and real value or what tangible goods are.


I repeat - how can the world global economy deal with $3 trillion whilst real output of goods and services fall?

Who is to blame? Those who fight wars adn print money and plunder otherr countries resources or those people who work hard to produce real goods and services.

There is no obligation other than one of your own making as you see the world in a very bizarre distorted and twisted way.

My country - my currency - there is no artificial about it. You tidy up your own house up before you tell your neighbour to mess up theirs to look like yours. Geeezzz you are hard work Martin.

 

[Martinghoul]

Been busy, boyz 'n ghurlz...

You wanna keep going with this here discussion? Or shall we just agree to disagree?

 

[Atilla]

Been busy, boyz 'n ghurlz...

You wanna keep going with this here discussion? Or shall we just agree to disagree?

Agree to disagree does it for me.

5 more years before people seriously looking at changing system
10 more years before people adopt pegged currencies
15 more years when gold becomes new standard as oil reserves depleted

Time will tell... :smart:

 

[Martinghoul]

Indeed... Agree to disagree it is then. Amen.

 

[DashRiprock]

It isn't balanced. America sends China dollars and China sends the USA tangible goods. The dollar is an IOU, which is debt.

just FYI fiat money was invented by the chinese, they (SAFE) know exactly what they're doing.

and anyway Gold is a soft yellow metal that you can dig out of the ground.

 

[new_trader]

Indeed... Agree to disagree it is then. Amen.

Yes, me too, (Although it's more a case of I give up). If you think the world is working wonderfully with the current system of money that's fine, invest accordingly. I don't, and I am investing accordingly.

 

[TheBramble]

Martin, you out posted them.

 

[Atilla]

Martin, you out posted them.

Hehe - fftopic:

 

[new_trader]

Agree to disagree does it for me.

5 more years before people seriously looking at changing system
10 more years before people adopt pegged currencies
15 more years when gold becomes new standard as oil reserves depleted

Time will tell... :smart:

Hey Atilla,

You might be interested in these. Ron Paul for president, at least he understands economics.

http://www.forbes.com/2010/01/13/gold-standard-fed-intelligent-investing-ron-paul.html

 

[new_trader]

More intelligent talk from Ron Paul, the gold standard in politics and economics!

 

[Atilla]

More intelligent talk from Ron Paul, the gold standard in politics and economics!

Absolutely - Ron Paul talks perfect sense to me.

Notice how the media kept going on about what would you do about China. His reply was on the nail. Sort out ones own production issues.

Why would anybody work if they could print money?

He also mentioned that the US could not fight any wars if not for borrowed money.

He said he wouldn't convert to the gold standard to avoid a hot potatoe in politics but everything else points towards it.


Pegged currencies will be the first step towards a gold backed currency implementation in the near future as flexible exchange rates will not be sufficient to rescue the world economy from glut of dollars.

 

[Atilla]

5 Signs Gold Has Peaked

http://financialedge.investopedia.com/financial-edge/0611/5-Signs-Gold-Has-Peaked.aspx

My gold target is still 1650 - financial crises is not over by far. On the contrary consequences about to hit us with inflation / stagflation.

Talk of rise in interest rates somewhat funny - how will governments finance their debt otherwise.

Inflation is about the only solution with long term negative interest rates.


Soros - has got it badly wrong this time. Somebody should tell him. Or better if we don't. What goes round comes round... :cheesy:

 

[new_trader]

This man understands that sound money=strong economy.

Forbes also thinks the US should immediately go back on the gold standard, before more damage is done to our currency.

The ability to print money, Forbes says, encourages the government to spend money, even when it has to create this money out of thin air. Returning to the gold standard, therefore, would rein in government spending.

http://finance.yahoo.com/blogs/dail...y-cut-taxes-back-gold-standard-124742916.html

 

[Martinghoul]

Hahaha, you guys crack me up ! Luv it!

 

[Atilla]

Hahaha, you guys crack me up ! Luv it!

Ignoring all the nonsense Martin, do you not find it interesting that more and more people are prepared to talk about reverting back to the gold standard?

Publicly on national TV etc etc...

Just an observation... :idea:

 

[Martinghoul]

Ignoring all the nonsense Martin, do you not find it interesting that more and more people are prepared to talk about reverting back to the gold standard?

Publicly on national TV etc etc...

Just an observation... :idea:

Not, I don't find it all that interesting, to be brutally honest with you.

Do you remember how many people in 06-07 were talking publicly on national TV about how houses could never go down in value and how subprime was not an issue? Have you not noticed how nowadays more and more people in the US are prepared to talk all sorts of bullsh1t, generally? For God's sake, Donald Trump was gonna run for friggin' president! So, no, given the increasing number of coconuts on TV these days, nothing really surprises me.

People on national TV are often spectacularly wrong. Sometimes they pursue their very own ulterior motives. Sometimes they're just idiots.

 

[DashRiprock]

martinghoul if you dont mind me askin what kind of trader are you? like a prop trader or local or MM or flow or in a hedge fund?

because sometimes you say thing that obviously mean you are well clever in the maths side of bonds, also you have sort of disdain on threads like this one, and the euro one that doomplonker just did the other day.

I dont mean it in a nasty way to you, it makes me think that you are a serious operator. Anyway all this is leading up to would be if you would think about doing an example of one of your trades? like the pre-trade analysis, the management, yadda yadda yadda. I rekon it would be well good reading for the rest of us chumps

bisous

Dash

 

[scose-no-doubt]

Good luck with that, Dash. I've been humping MGs leg for nigh on 2 years with no joy
Anyway I have a sneaking suspicion the resulting thread would comprise of more numbers than words and that's not something I need in my life atm. Do you?

 

[DashRiprock]

if it was proper trade I would do the numbers if data was free. But instead if just avoided the numbers and was like "the sums that I done here are these and the results are this and it means that " then even better. prolly easier to do as well

but honest i thing he will say he can't show because against the rules. I think that is also a bit exaggerating the truth, like he could show a trade from a year ago and not give anything away right? or like when there was all subprime mess and yen graph was falling from sky and emergency fomc cuts and erything? I wonder even if he keeps a journal of his trading?!?! Even just exerpt from that would be way cool i rekon!!

anyway yeah it would be well good if he would say about a "proper" trade, and like does he research them all for ages? or is he like a frog in market pond just hopping and swimming about until SNAP! he gets a fly? It would be cool to see what he does and how he does it