binary options?

[rsh01]

Hi
It's not a question of open mindedness. It's a question of why compare 2 different products that don't offer the same people the same solution. It's like trying to compare a Jeep with a race car. Both are different products. The risks may outweigh the reward by trading with what you call a dodgy broker. But who are you to say that an exchange is really any better?

have to agree with moka2, you are consistently maneouvering around the points raised. i agree that exchanges are not transparent, and are rigged in favour of the big players, and that regulated brokers have failed many times, but thats not the argument if i have understood correctly. it is, to reiterate moka2s latest post, would you rather trade:

1. an unregulated product with an unregulated entity, or
2. a regulated product with a regulated entity

Do you you agree, (1) is more risky....yes or no?

If yes, your payoff for that additional risk is what exactly? A simple product, good platform? And you are happy with just that as compensation for your additional risk?

The quality of the regulatory bodies / products is not relevant, in moka2s opinion, but if you think 1 & 2 are equally risky then i guess you deem this relevant. i wld assume you are in a minority if that's the case.

 

[davidfielder]

The question is nonsensical so of course I changed the answer to fit a question that can be answered
The question he asked is like asking:
1. Do you prefer rotten pizza, from a garbage or
2. a 5 star meal at a 3star michelin restautant
Hmmmmmm
Tough question


So the answer is stupid cause the question is nonsensical

The question should be:
Do you prefer or even think that
1. there is too much risk involved in trading with an unregulated broker using OTC products offered therein OR
2. Less risk in a regulated broker offering exchange traded products

And the stupid answer to this question 1 and 2 again
If I want to trade bianries I AM NOT GOING TO TRADE AT OE !!!
If I want to buy and sell vanilla options, I AM NOT GOING TO TRADE AT GOPTIONS.COM !!!

That's obvious

It's a question of product - not regulation or risk
I want a new but possibly riskier product, so yes, I will take a risk to attain it
I want an antiquated product with low risk, so yes, I will venture off to am exchange

 

[rsh01]

The question is nonsensical so of course I changed the answer to fit a question that can be answered

its taken you 3 pages to admit you were purposefully ignoring mokas question. moka2 was asking why at almost every post.

so the political digression was just to fill the time along the way. ok then.

 

[davidfielder]

Um - I hope you are joking

 

[moka2]

Dvid says "The question is nonsensical

You keep ignoring the risks witth such a product and on top of that pretend to be friend of "retail Trader" this remin me of teh promoters of CFDs in Australia specially teh Market Maker model and only when regulators and general public got more savvy the DMA or STP model started coming in

I think all you have is vested interest why don;t you doisclose if you get fianncial benefits also from that industry through your blog?

 

[davidfielder]

I DID DISCLOSE that 100% completely
AGAIN ILL SAY: I PROMOTE BINARY OPTIONS BROKERS

I have said this countless times. I am not hiding anything

 

[mpetters60]

David-
At the end of the day what does it matter. Regulation does not really mean much at the end of the day.
It just means if they company steals your money or goes out of business you have someone to complain to. This is excellent but it does not prevent your money from disappearing and it definitely does not keep them from rigging the system.

Ultimately you are gambling on stock markets. Trading contracts, CTFC regulations, over-sight comity or not. You are making bet on if an asset is going up or down and there is a great payoff.
In order to make money you need to have money to lose and be ready to lose it.

Try out different brands or don't it really doesn't matter. But you do not need to argue for trite reasons on why not to invest in Binary Options.
I can tell you from years of experience (or maybe just common sense) that its is just as risky as any other form of investment, that 90% of losers pay for 10% of winners, and that the house will do whatever they can to win; other wise these companies would not exist.

BUT.... If you know what you are doing. If you find a good broker. If you do not treat Options trading like a slot machine. You will and can make money.

Did you know options trading like this has been around since the 70's? Before you could only do call options its wasn't until the mid 80's when put bets were available as well. It only has been over the last few years that options trading has blown up online because there is now the bandwidth to handle the platforms.

 

[pboyles]

Hi
It's not a question of open mindedness. It's a question of why compare 2 different products that don't offer the same people the same solution. It's like trying to compare a Jeep with a race car. Both are different products. The risks may outweigh the reward by trading with what you call a dodgy broker. But who are you to say that an exchange is really any better? I can tell you first hand what I've seen stock market makers do to ECNs. They literally raped traders on the other side of trades by acting as the "market maker" on EXCHANGES. So I have no idea what you're talking about.

Exchanges are just the arena. They have no intrinsic value beyond setting up the rules of a game. If those rules can be exploited for profit, then someone will - and does.

A broker is the same thing. Nothing in the world will protect you from a broker out to screw you. It didn't help customers of Gain, FXCM, PFG, Refco, WorldSpreads, and many many others. This has nothing to do with whether the company defrauds big or steals little. Whether they get caught or not. You are choosing to hide behind the word "exchange" as if it stops the problem.

Well, OTC is not the problem seeing as how BANKS (yeah, those entities that all crashed out in 2008) were and still are offering binary options as an OTC product via their dealing rooms.

So really, just think outside the box.
Think whether the product you have is really any better. Certainly not just because of regulation.

Sure, transparency is very important if you are moving serious volume, but otherwise - what's the real difference. If you are pushing anything under 100 mio a day, this whole conversation is moot.

The companies that were scamming people were doing so on 'off exchange' products ie forex. In a roundabout way you have actually given a perfect example of why your argument is totally wrong.

Where no exchange exists there is no way of determining whether a price is genuine or has been manipulated in favour of the broker. That's why there are so many forex,SB and options scams.

 

[pboyles]

I DID DISCLOSE that 100% completely
AGAIN ILL SAY: I PROMOTE BINARY OPTIONS BROKERS

I have said this countless times. I am not hiding anything

I think you should give up now. It's clear what you're up to with all that crap you've put on the Internet.

 

[moka2]

David-
At the end of the day what does it matter. Regulation does not really mean much at the end of the day.
It just means if they company steals your money or goes out of business you have someone to complain to. This is excellent but it does not prevent your money from disappearing and it definitely does not keep them from rigging the system.

Ultimately you are gambling on stock markets. Trading contracts, CTFC regulations, over-sight comity or not. You are making bet on if an asset is going up or down and there is a great payoff.
In order to make money you need to have money to lose and be ready to lose it.

Try out different brands or don't it really doesn't matter. But you do not need to argue for trite reasons on why not to invest in Binary Options.
I can tell you from years of experience (or maybe just common sense) that its is just as risky as any other form of investment, that 90% of losers pay for 10% of winners, and that the house will do whatever they can to win; other wise these companies would not exist.

BUT.... If you know what you are doing. If you find a good broker. If you do not treat Options trading like a slot machine. You will and can make money.

Did you know options trading like this has been around since the 70's? Before you could only do call options its wasn't until the mid 80's when put bets were available as well. It only has been over the last few years that options trading has blown up online because there is now the bandwidth to handle the platforms.

SO Mpetter60
What exactly are you saying? the Binary Options offered by these companies ias as transparent as the products offered on large established true exchnages????

LOL

 

[davidfielder]

I think you should give up now. It's clear what you're up to with all that crap you've put on the Internet.

What did I put up?
Crap?
What in god's name are you talking about?

I think that the idea of a regulator has everyone with a hardon. It ******** !
Show me a single case where the regulator did something that wasn't intent on either adding funds to the regulators own coffers or providing more security to tax income?

I am sure you are going to go and find that ONE case. My point is that they are very few and far between. The idea of a regaultor is great. But in practice it's meaningless. For exchanges, it's a completely different issue and can't be compared. Forex is OTC, but regulated. Does that mean that if it were UNregulated but strictly exchange traded, that it would be a better product for the consumer? I don't know to be honest. What I am certain of is that in the last 14 years, since the internet blew up - spreads have dropped by an average of 70% (from a norm of about a 5 pip spread on the new EUR). I don't think that has anything to do with exchange traded forex, do you? I don't think that has anything to do with regulation, do you?

Bottom line: what has regulation done for YOU lately? Not the idea behind it or in theory. IN PRACTICE ?

Jack &^#$ I am assuming

 

[pboyles]

What did I put up?
Crap?
What in god's name are you talking about?

I think that the idea of a regulator has everyone with a hardon. It ******** !
Show me a single case where the regulator did something that wasn't intent on either adding funds to the regulators own coffers or providing more security to tax income?

I am sure you are going to go and find that ONE case. My point is that they are very few and far between. The idea of a regaultor is great. But in practice it's meaningless. For exchanges, it's a completely different issue and can't be compared. Forex is OTC, but regulated. Does that mean that if it were UNregulated but strictly exchange traded, that it would be a better product for the consumer? I don't know to be honest. What I am certain of is that in the last 14 years, since the internet blew up - spreads have dropped by an average of 70% (from a norm of about a 5 pip spread on the new EUR). I don't think that has anything to do with exchange traded forex, do you? I don't think that has anything to do with regulation, do you?

Bottom line: what has regulation done for YOU lately? Not the idea behind it or in theory. IN PRACTICE ?

Jack &^#$ I am assuming

If the broker goes bust and he's not regulated you're screwed.

If the broker goes bust and he is regulated then you are covered up to whatever financial limit applies in your country. For most people this will be the vast majority of their funds.

Which is better?

 

[davidfielder]

That has nothing to do with regulation, although you are correct that they generally go together (western world anyway - you are correct).So in this regard - no argument. But it's not the issue and never was

I can certainly respect that if you are trading with few 10s of thousands of USD
But for the guy who's looking to blow off some steam and trade with 500$ tonight, that's a load of crap and he won't go that route cause compliance is a nightmare

So all I am saying is that unregulated doesn't necessarily mean EVIL !
It just means you need to be MUCH more careful- there is no disagreement. It's again, a question of WHAT PRODUCT for WHICH PERSON

 

[moka2]

Look Mr Fielder although one can understand that regulators have not been 100% effective in stopping fraud ...your consistent bashing them simply means no matter what you want this thinly regulated OTC market to flourish giving birth to more crooks!
What has regulators done for average consumer today in Practise....

Have put financial crooks in JAIL
Searching: ASIC & MoneySmart
Australian Securities and Investments Commission - 11-222MR Former Sonray CEO jailed

Australian Securities and Investments Commission - 11-222MR Former Sonray CEO jailed
more than once
Also
read
Australian Securities and Investments Commission - 12-260MR Report on the Australian OTC Derivatives Market – October 2012

and more important - Stop many crooks from opening dodgy investment schemes and products.
Imagine if there were no regulations whatsoever then anybody and everybody can start Managed funds/ Investment advice firms and gambling dens with no regard to
Transparency
Client money safety
Mr Fielder why don't your beloved Binary option brokers earn some respect by being in the main jurisdictions? rather than attacking the notion of regulation
You know why because there will be lot more scrutiny ! which your pals don't want because that will expose them

How on earth anybody can ignore the broker risk + Product Risk is beyond me


For once and all if you are game see if you can answer these questions without going on tangent
Q1 FOr each following reasons show why Binary Options and other similar OTC is better than Exchange traded products

- Price transparency
- Client money safety ( SIPC, ASX, FSA attached insurances do not protect OTC at all they don't even protect Futures traders let alone dam OTC)
- Clarity of product definition which can be independently verified ( look at any definition of and Index CFD,, is it based on on Index or the Future on the Index.. the definitions are muddled ... even with a so called quality operator like IG)
- Can you see depth of market
- Variety of products ( one can build thousands of Binary option by using ETOS)

Any blind Freddy can see the risks.... you just don't want people to see the risks and pretend to educate the people.. what BS if you were that interested in educating people First thing you would do is compare the risks
Stop feeding BS

 

[moka2]

That has nothing to do with regulation, although you are correct that they generally go together (western world anyway - you are correct).So in this regard - no argument. But it's not the issue and never was

I can certainly respect that if you are trading with few 10s of thousands of USD
But for the guy who's looking to blow off some steam and trade with 500$ tonight, that's a load of crap and he won't go that route cause compliance is a nightmare

So all I am saying is that unregulated doesn't necessarily mean EVIL !
It just means you need to be MUCH more careful- there is no disagreement. It's again, a question of WHAT PRODUCT for WHICH PERSON

WHAT PRODUCT for WHICH PERSON
DOES NOT TAKE AWAY THE FUNDAMENTAL RISKS.. whcih you want people with small accounts to ignore

WHY do you say for $500 account people are not going to bother about regualted or unregulated..
Reason you say that is becasue all these Binary pals want popel to put in $300-$500 and not wory about Broker risk