Addendum2:Why do so few succeed?

[SOCRATES]

The funniest thing is Socrates thinks the best and most informative posts were his!

And it is even funnier to think that you think you know what it is I really think and why.

 

[SOCRATES]

There's no shame in not being able to "Cut It" in "Real Time" Socco. I'm sure if you adopted a more conciliatory tone on these boards, traders would come forward to assist you in you quest. Until we see a complete turn around in attitude, i'm afraid you may have a very long wait.You will need to do all this by yourself, with no help from the people who could possibly assist you.

It's one thing knowing the theory of everything under the sun , but quite another when it comes down to the practical.As of today, we have seen no practical evidence that you can actually trade.

If you carry on banging your head on the table like you do in your Avatar in your personal profile, you will do yourself an injury. The best advice I can give you is not to do that, but instead to inwardly reflect and consider your own problems. I haven't any, that is why I can permit myself the luxury of telling you what you yourself, despite many proddings, are not able to realise.
They are patently obvious to me and I fail to see why they are not patently obvious to you by now.

 

[Kunal]

Ahhh, just what I was waiting for.

>You believe you can come here and pick everyones' brains, just like that, as if we were all here to render you the service of educating you.
I do not view these boards in the way you do , not at all.

Nobody has the slightest interest in reading your posts, as you have contaminated this forum continously with verbal dysentry, so stop pretending you have anything useful to say.
As I said earlier, the more you post, the faster you are exposed. How fast has it already started to become true?

>>These boards are for discussion amongst traders, not information beggars.
I completely agree, so after you start trading, come back. The board is also not for attention beggars and habitual bulls**tters or ancient pretenders.

>>I am not here to educate you, I am here to discuss what interests me and occasionally to drop a gem of information here and there, but you yourself have to do the graft, as no one can do it for you.
Since you have zero knowledge, which is the consensus opinion, why not educate yourself first?
When it is so blatantly obvious that you know absolutely nothing, and you very well know that you know absolutely nothing about what you are trying to pretend to show, nobody wants it.

The hard undeniable fact is that 70% of ruined threads are your posts. I'm sure the mods are noting this and will take appropriate action to set things right.
Do you realise that you are fighting 7 different people?
All over again?
As usual?
Do we need to rename T2W as the Fight Club?

 

[SOCRATES]

Ahhh, just what I was waiting for.

>You believe you can come here and pick everyones' brains, just like that, as if we were all here to render you the service of educating you.
I do not view these boards in the way you do , not at all.

Nobody has the slightest interest in reading your posts, as you have contaminated this forum continously with verbal dysentry, so stop pretending you have anything useful to say.
As I said earlier, the more you post, the faster you are exposed. How fast has it already started to become true?

>>These boards are for discussion amongst traders, not information beggars.
I completely agree, so after you start trading, come back. The board is also not for attention beggars and habitual bulls**tters or ancient pretenders.

>>I am not here to educate you, I am here to discuss what interests me and occasionally to drop a gem of information here and there, but you yourself have to do the graft, as no one can do it for you.
Since you have zero knowledge, which is the consensus opinion, why not educate yourself first?
When it is so blatantly obvious that you know absolutely nothing, and you very well know that you know absolutely nothing about what you are trying to pretend to show, nobody wants it.

The hard undeniable fact is that 70% of ruined threads are your posts. I'm sure the mods are noting this and will take appropriate action to set things right.
Do you realise that you are fighting 7 different people?
All over again?
As usual?
Do we need to rename T2W as the Fight Club?

Yes, you are right. But the 7 are here because they are on a futile mission, despite prompts, yourself included. I have given you some constructive advice, which you choose to ignore.
That is your problem not mine. As an aside, and not connected with any difficulties you may or may not have, I am enjoying all of this immensely.

 

[the blades]

Yes, you are right. But the 7 are here because they are on a futile mission, despite prompts, yourself included. I have given you some constructive advice, which you choose to ignore.
That is your problem not mine.

the problem with your "constructive" advice is that nobody sees it. For people to spend time to unravel your riddles, they would have to bee convinced that it's worth the effort. I'm only convinced that the vast majority of members have NO belief that you're anything other than a talker.

Almost 3,000 posts later, the same indirect, boring, always rude, waffle. Your message is that it's hard and you can't succeed without tonnes of hard work (that's the only bit I'm clever enough to decode anyway). Well we've got that message. But we all know there'l be 3,000 more (delayed by the odd dummy spitting session by yourself)

You've turned into nothing more than a figure of fun now. Why not stop clogging every other thread with your waffle. If there's an audience for your rubbish, they aren't leaping to your defence.

And to save you the bother of typing it again - I'm not after your help. I'm happy with what I do, but still visit to learn - but not from you.

UTB

 

[SOCRATES]

the problem with your "constructive" advice is that nobody sees it. For people to spend time to unravel your riddles, they would have to bee convinced that it's worth the effort. I'm only convinced that the vast majority of members have NO belief that you're anything other than a talker.

Almost 3,000 posts later, the same indirect, boring, always rude, waffle. Your message is that it's hard and you can't succeed without tonnes of hard work (that's the only bit I'm clever enough to decode anyway). Well we've got that message. But we all know there'l be 3,000 more (delayed by the odd dummy spitting session by yourself)

You've turned into nothing more than a figure of fun now. Why not stop clogging every other thread with your waffle. If there's an audience for your rubbish, they aren't leaping to your defence.

And to save you the bother of typing it again - I'm not after your help. I'm happy with what I do, but still visit to learn - but not from you.

UTB

It is not waffle.
You are also in a fog like the others.
I am simply stating the facts.

Success depends upon
Ability, Merit and Conduct

and not

Inability, Demerit and Misconduct.

Is that plain enough for you to understand ?
I mean to say, it is obvious, is it not ?
It cannot be more obvious than that now can it, eh ?

If you do not understand you should not be trading, or even reading this thread for that matter.

 

[Bigbusiness]

What's the cyberspace equivalent of a glass of hemlock? That did the trick with the real Socrates. This one seems more like David Icke. He gets more angry and frustrated at the ignorance of others but doesn't realise it is his own stupidity that is the problem. This endless cycle of the same routine is getting tedious. Isn't there more interesting things to do at the weekend than monitor how much time someone looks at a thread?

 

[the blades]

It is not waffle.
You are also in a fog like the others.
I am simply stating the facts.

Success depends upon
Ability, Merit and Conduct

and not

Inability, Demerit and Misconduct.

Is that plain enough for you to understand ?
I mean to say, it is obvious, is it not ?
It cannot be more obvious than that now can it, eh ?

If you do not understand you should not be trading, or even reading this thread for that matter.

Of course I understand that. But it's like saying if you want to save money you've got to stop spending it. It doesn't lead to any action / direction that wouldn't have been taken anyway. And 3,000 more repetitions wont lead to anything more, so why bother?

You've now constructed thousands of lenghty posts in a relatively short space of time. You claim to be able to predict the market with deadly accuracy - so you must be rich. Is the childish banter the best use you can make of your time? Can you not see why these situations seem to contradict one another?

And when you insert your regular insults, talking about "they and "them" may get you around the mods, but it is still rude, none the less.

UTB

 

[Kunal]

>>Addendum:~
Kunal, I have observed that you first logged on to this thread at 4.09 pm. It is now 4.34 pm.
You say in your post above that threads like this one are ruined by monotonous BS.
Then why are you doing the opposite of what it is you ought to be doing, and wasting 25 minutes reading here ? I do not miss a thing and I am very curious as to how you reason, if at all.

Yes, I was hoping for a reply and I got my opportunity by waiting.
You need to stop judging people by your own standards. BTW, verbal diarrhoea causes reasoning ability to spontaneously drop to zero.

>>Yes, you are right. But the 7 are here because they are on a futile mission, despite prompts, yourself included.
You do mind reading too. How do you know that the 7 aren't already successful and are here because they want to be more successful?

 

[SOCRATES]

What's the cyberspace equivalent of a glass of hemlock? That did the trick with the real Socrates. This one seems more like David Icke. He gets more angry and frustrated at the ignorance of others but doesn't realise it is his own stupidity that is the problem. This endless cycle of the same routine is getting tedious. Isn't there more interesting things to do at the weekend than monitor how much time someone looks at a thread?

You don't discern the difference between ignorance and stupidity, you just blurt out these words without really understanding their proper meaning and the context in which they can be used.
I recommend you get yourself a good dictionary and refer to it carefully before you make the sort of uninivited. vapid and irrelevant pronouncements you are apt to regularly make, Bigbusiness indeed.

 

[the blades]

You don't discern the difference between ignorance and stupidity, you just blurt out these words without really understanding their proper meaning and the context in which they can be used.
I recommend you get yourself a good dictionary and refer to it carefully before you make the sort of uninivited. vapid and irrelevant pronouncements you are apt to regularly make, Bigbusiness indeed.

From T2W's "funniest poster", to the role of an unpaid Internet bulletin board thesaurus. Times must be hard Soc

 

[Chicken Curry]

Socrates

What worries me about you is why you spend so much time prowling this website iterating and reiterating the same old stuff over and over again ad nauseam.

Is it a compulsive need to insult people and convince yourself that you are more intelligent than everyone else ?

If so, despite your great trading abilities, you would appear to have a social disorder that might be remedied by one of those new fangled modern quacks - otherwise known as counsellors. Personally I have no time for these over-hyped ex hippies, but you may find solace and comfort and a solution to your personal problems by entering into a number of interlocutory sessions with one of these strange beings.

 

[SOCRATES]

>>Addendum:~
Kunal, I have observed that you first logged on to this thread at 4.09 pm. It is now 4.34 pm.
You say in your post above that threads like this one are ruined by monotonous BS.
Then why are you doing the opposite of what it is you ought to be doing, and wasting 25 minutes reading here ? I do not miss a thing and I am very curious as to how you reason, if at all.

Yes, I was hoping for a reply and I got my opportunity by waiting.
You need to stop judging people by your own standards. BTW, verbal diarrhoea causes reasoning ability to spontaneously drop to zero.

>>Yes, you are right. But the 7 are here because they are on a futile mission, despite prompts, yourself included.
You do mind reading too. How do you know that the 7 aren't already successful and are here because they want to be more successful?

How do I know ? By the quality of comment, that's how. It is very very simple and obvious.:cheesy:

 

[Bigbusiness]

You don't discern the difference between ignorance and stupidity, you just blurt out these words without really understanding their proper meaning and the context in which they can be used.
I recommend you get yourself a good dictionary and refer to it carefully before you make the sort of uninivited. vapid and irrelevant pronouncements you are apt to regularly make, Bigbusiness indeed.

LOL. Look up "Walter Mitty" in your encyclopedia.

 

[SOCRATES]

Dear Barjon,

that is precisely it.

All this snapping is a diversion from the strong unpalatable medicine required to cure the inabilities from which most people suffer that they have to overcome, not jus to succeed, but even to survive in the world of trading.

I will tell you that on my part I am not irritated at all, I am dismayed to see how it is that when something is obvious and necessary is presented all sorts of attempts are made to corrupt what is needed.

This is the mechanism of the human condition, which seeks to justify, even in the face of brutal reality, as the human condition is apt to view the excercise as either not necessary, or irrelevant or even in some cases as a personal affront to the sensibilities of the most vulnerable.

Ironically it is the most vulnerable that are in need of self applying the medicine, as no one else cares for their own well being, least of all the markets which are not constructed to cater for weaknesses, whether collective or individual.

In this connection, there is no alternative for participants but for them to embrace the correct protocols or perish. If they perish, there is always a new crop of victims waiting to take their place.

This can so easily be avoided by putting in place the correct way of going about things in an environement which is cruel, impersonal, and irrevocable. It is not an environment that can be played about with, as it does not lend itself to this kind of treatment, very much to the contrary.

In this regard, therefore the route to success is not to try to modify the environment to suit the entrant, but for the entrant to modify his or her attitude. This alteration and modification of attitude is crucial to success. It requires effort. It requires revision and modification of all values held up to that moment in time.

This constitutes a radical and dramatic change for people to undergo. The question is they have to cause themselves to undergo these changes in order to arrive at the ideal state for success.

The criteria required are Ability, on Merit, and by Conduct, nothing more, nothing less. I am not saying you have to be a genius, but I am saying you have to change the way you think, the way you act, the way you percieve, the way you think, they way you behave, and, ultimately the way you are, that's all.

Now we will see what comes of this.

I am now going to take a break away from this forum to see how it is and whether constructive and interesting dialogue develops. I hope so.

Kind Regards.

 

[barjon]

db and kunal posts split to http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showthread.php?t=18911

 

[Quenkish]

The Socrates debate yet again

Dear Barjon,

that is precisely it.

All this snapping is a diversion from the strong unpalatable medicine required to cure the inabilities from which most people suffer that they have to overcome, not jus to succeed, but even to survive in the world of trading.

I will tell you that on my part I am not irritated at all, I am dismayed to see how it is that when something is obvious and necessary is presented all sorts of attempts are made to corrupt what is needed.

This is the mechanism of the human condition, which seeks to justify, even in the face of brutal reality, as the human condition is apt to view the excercise as either not necessary, or irrelevant or even in some cases as a personal affront to the sensibilities of the most vulnerable.

Ironically it is the most vulnerable that are in need of self applying the medicine, as no one else cares for their own well being, least of all the markets which are not constructed to cater for weaknesses, whether collective or individual.

In this connection, there is no alternative for participants but for them to embrace the correct protocols or perish. If they perish, there is always a new crop of victims waiting to take their place.

This can so easily be avoided by putting in place the correct way of going about things in an environement which is cruel, impersonal, and irrevocable. It is not an environment that can be played about with, as it does not lend itself to this kind of treatment, very much to the contrary.

In this regard, therefore the route to success is not to try to modify the environment to suit the entrant, but for the entrant to modify his or her attitude. This alteration and modification of attitude is crucial to success. It requires effort. It requires revision and modification of all values held up to that moment in time.

This constitutes a radical and dramatic change for people to undergo. The question is they have to cause themselves to undergo these changes in order to arrive at the ideal state for success.

The criteria required are Ability, on Merit, and by Conduct, nothing more, nothing less. I am not saying you have to be a genius, but I am saying you have to change the way you think, the way you act, the way you percieve, the way you think, they way you behave, and, ultimately the way you are, that's all.

Now we will see what comes of this.

I am now going to take a break away from this forum to see how it is and whether constructive and interesting dialogue develops. I hope so.

Kind Regards.

Welcome back Socrates to the forum from your self imposed exile, T2W was certainly less exciting without your presence.

The problem that most contributors have is that you have deemed yourself to be a “guru” trading a level so high that most other traders can only aspire to trade at. If you are a “higher level” (I have met some very very rich traders and have not heard one of them mention “higher level”) trader would it not be advisable to give your critics some evidence of your success, you may add that it is none of their business, in your case it is. The reason why it is their business if you want them to take you seriously and show you the respect you aspire then evidence is needed of your trading greatness.

Other successful traders have provided evidence and have received respect from other traders until you provide evidence I am afraid that your critics have ammunition to attack your every post.

It seems that you spend a lot of trading writing on this forum when you should be trading or doing your research for your next trade.

If you are a brilliantly successful trader as you claim then you have my respect if your are not them you need to have a look at yourself, I hope that the former is true.

 

[barjon]

db and kunal posts split to http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showthread.php?t=18911

whoops - when I split the thread to the above link I lost my post the important bit of which was..........................


.......................Unless things move on constructively - maybe by some discussion on what you mean by merit, ability and conduct - I will finish it. In any event, I will delete all posts that are not properly on topic from now on...................

So from now please guys and gals.

jon

 

[SOCRATES]

i must say in my attempt to get people to focus on what winning traders do rather than avoiding what losers do, people may want to take a look at the posts made by victor niederhoffer (well known fund manager and george soros protege) under the name profturf, and also the legendary don bright (under the name don bright) over on et.

niederhoffer, in his few posts, always emphasised the need to be courteous when addressing those who are knowledge rich, but time poor. i should point out, that niederhoffer was always in a positive mindset to state genuine helpful advise and findings that people could tangibly incorporate into their strategies if they so wished - and thought about what was being mentioned. topics discussed were very much tangible rather than mystery. whether one agreed with his approach is another matter, but i imagine he has made (and lost) more money than most of us! here was a real 'wizard' giving away a few ingredients out of his 'magic book'.

the same could be said of don bright as well to a lesser extent. a proven trader giving genuine useful help and advise (although knowing don, i would have thought he would be way too humble (as most good traders are) to be thought of with the likes of victor).

im just thinking of this attitude, merit and conduct thing, and something doesnt seem to be sitting right somewhere, especially when i think of those proven traders and their attitude, merit and conduct!

I am not surprised that you are baffled and confused. It is very easy to explain, because again it is obvious.

You are looking at it back to front, I am sorry to have to tell you.

I have highlighted in RED Victor Neiderhoffer's idea.

His attitude is the correct one.

But here he mentions only one side of the story and one specific group of people,
those that are knowledgeable but time poor (and by implication, polite and respectful)

He does not mention the other group who are the opposite, those who are Ignorant, time rich and disrespectful and rude.

I bet you his response to both groups is NOT equally the same, because if it is, then it shows he is not able to differentiate at all, which would be disastrous for any trader, because trading, by its very nature depends on decisions, that is, the ability to differntiate and act accordingly.

Therefore individuals have to be dealt with according to how they merit, according to their conduct, therefore all else is a mistake.

For this reason I am not willing to give people what they want, I stubbornly give them what they need, what they truly need, which is to make them think, and reflect, for them to be able to progress.

I will not be in the least surprised if this again stimulates a rash of rudeness and ill considered aggression, but it does not change my posture one iota.

 

[SOCRATES]

Something to consider:

"One thing that I have found true, is that when a person actually knows what they are talking about, they are able to describe it in simple declarative sentences, without jargon, and in a way that all of us can understand and make use of."

And you again, despite your elevated education, miss the point again.

For this reason, you ought to read Charliechans post again, this time with more care, and ensure you understand where the flaw lies, which I have pinpointed.
(insult removed by JumpOff)

You really ought to know better than to misdirect readers of these boards in the way you do.