154% in 4 days ?

juanbyte

Well-known member
332 10
There were a couple of doubters that did not believe that I made 24% in one week, so I decided to see how long it would take to double my balance.

It took only 4 days to make 154%

see results http://homepage.ntlworld.com/c.kobewka/new_page_1.htm

Yes it was risky and I do not advise people to work with such a low margin.

At the moment there are 17 consecutive winning trades.
What this does show is the imoprtance of one of my favourite quotes

"There are just 2 rules for successful investing.
Rule no 1 Don't lose money
Rule no 2 Follow rule no 1"

The results show several small wins, it is better to take small wins rather than letting them turn into a loss.

What it does show is that it IS possible to make money from spreadbetting, I have read many threads where people have said that they can't make money spreadbetting because the spreads are too wide and they are changing to futures as the spreads are lower.

Sorry it is not that the spreads are too wide, it is your trading methology. Although the spreads on futures are smaller there is more slippage and they may not be that much different.

I read a thread where a newbie was advised to put £2000 into a trading account so that they could claim tax back on losses.

Would it not be better to spreadbet with £200 and if you lose it forget about trading.

Well that's my moan for the day
 

anley

Senior member
2,730 229
Listen anyone can make 24% in a week, or 154% in a week or even 1000% in a week.

But I'm sorry to say that the people who do this and think that these results are impressive know absolutely nothing about successful trading or investing. They think it's all about making money when it's actually all about risk adjusted returns.

The fact that you made 24% in one week and then 154% in another week simply means that the chance of you lasting in this business are ZERO. With a probability of 1 it is just a matter of time before you lose all your account or such a significant proportion of it that it's impossible to get back to square one.

Finally if anyone here wants to test their understanding of this game then if you're not 100% shocked (in a negative way) by these kind of results then you know you've got a lot more reading, studying and practical experience in front of you.
 

donaldduke

Experienced member
1,665 257
"There are just 2 rules for successful investing.
Rule no 1 Don't lose money
Rule no 2 Follow rule no 1"

Since you never lose why not start with just £1 then you can
say you made 18000% in four days..
 

anley

Senior member
2,730 229
juanbyte said:
Although the spreads on futures are smaller there is more slippage and they may not be that much different.

[/B]

Careful Chris, it's statements like that that tell us you don't actually have a clue or any experience of trading futures.

Stick to selling your get rich quick books, it's easier and safer money.
 

juanbyte

Well-known member
332 10
DD

Last page of individual trades published.

Anley

I do wish you would read my original post, I said it was risky.
The risk is less than half it was than when I started. As I have used the same stakes.

All I was saying is that it IS possible to make money spread betting and people who say that they can't because the spread is too wide are wrong.

Did you read about the stops at 1 or 2 points, it is when you let losses run as you have admitted to that are the killers.

18 in a row now.

What would you consider is a good/safe risk ratio.
 

bracke

Experienced member
1,286 12
Anley

You have really confused me, I had always thought that the objective of speculating or investing was to make money.

If you can continually make 154% gains each week you must surely be a winner.

I appreciate that there will be occasions when you lose but if the net gain is 154% whats the problem?

Perhaps you can give me and others who are also confused an idea of where risk adjusted returns fit into the picture and negate the 154% return

Regards

bracke
 

donaldduke

Experienced member
1,665 257
bracke,

The 154% is a joke, look he could had 1000 pounds in his
account to start with and the return would have been 10%
or he could have started with £20 pounds and the return with
have been almost 500%.

Basically you can just make the figure up.
 

anley

Senior member
2,730 229
Bracke

You have a lot to learn, this is why you're so impressed by these kinds of returns.

But the question that you should be asking is how much did he risk in order to make that sort of money.

And before Chris or anyone pops up and says 'oh I only risked 1% on each trade' I'll say it right now, don't insult my or anyone else's intelligence.

It is simply not possible and also I reckon against the laws of physics that people can consistently over a series of trades risk hardly anything to make a bundle.

Of course all the amateur traders, system sellers and get rich quick authors like Chris will tell you it's possible. But anyone who's been in the markets for a few years and traded properly will tell you it's all but impossible (over time).

Why is there such a discrepancy between these two groups?
 

anley

Senior member
2,730 229
Bracke

Here's a quick question for you.

Trader A made a return of 78% last year and 89% the previous year.

Trader B made a return of 13% last year and 9% the previous year.

Who is the better trader?
 

grubs50

Well-known member
408 0
Trader A in my book cos of his consistency over a period of 2 years.............the capital should not be an issue cos of the length of time............and i think Juanbyte can be proud of his returns cos it could have gone the other way i.e a total loss of his starting capital.
 

Grey1

Senior member
2,186 178
Quote " They think it's all about making money when it's actually all about risk adjusted returns . "

An awesome statement.. I wonder if any member appreciate the weight of your statment.

This statement was emphasised by myself in our live trading room to day ..
 

ChartMan

Legendary member
5,580 46
The real clue here is the number of points, not how many %. Sure, it's an impressive return. It's also reckless. At a £1 a point, a safe capital sum would be in the order of £2K.( Trading the Dow). I won't tell you why, you'll have to figure it out yourself. Skim did a similar thing..... A theoretical exercise. I do take my hat off to Juan for the number of consecutive winners, whatever their size, and for the fact that it is with Spread Bet. Juan is rightly excited and proud of his achievement, when you compare it to statements like " you can't make money Spreadbetting". I know you can. He knows you can. It's not for everyone.
Juan, if only you had shown the consistency of the points gained, instead of the %'s no doubt people would be knocking your door down. It happens here all too often. Someone does/shows /whatever something good, an all that happens is that people are so blinkered they only see the downside. WAKE UP. You need to see both sides!!!!
 

rossored

Senior member
2,103 54
What I'd like to know is what is all this about "slippage" on futures? Doesnt exist as far as I'm concerned.
 
 
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