Who would you vote for?

[poborsky]

I am no expert on politics, but I have noticed that during my lifetime when a labour govt leaves office or is about to do so, then it goes with the economy in ruins leaving the conservative party to sort out the mess. I have a feeling that this particular mess will be too big for any democratic party to put right unfortunately.

 

[Pat494]

I am no expert on politics, but I have noticed that during my lifetime when a labour govt leaves office or is about to do so, then it goes with the economy in ruins leaving the conservative party to sort out the mess. I have a feeling that this particular mess will be too big for any democratic party to put right unfortunately.

Too right. Many Socialists are well meaning folk but their ideas are usually impractible.
Social engineering is incredibly expensive and the end results are of little use. They promote incompetence and give inflated ideas to the people better suited to following rather than leading. They invariably forget that people, families and even countries need to be profitable to survive.
Do-gooders and bleeding hearts that really should be in some church or other not on the practical side of things at all. Cant and hyprocracy is the norm. Lies that obscure the harsh realities ( Blair ). Spin by charlatans and endorsed by pompous asses ( Brown ).

 

[poborsky]

Too right. Many Socialists are well meaning folk but their ideas are usually impractible.
Social engineering is incredibly expensive and the end results are of little use. They promote incompetence and give inflated ideas to the people better suited to following rather than leading. They invariably forget that people, families and even countries need to be profitable to survive.
Do-gooders and bleeding hearts that really should be in some church or other not on the practical side of things at all. Cant and hyprocracy is the norm. Lies that obscure the harsh realities ( Blair ). Spin by charlatans and endorsed by pompous asses ( Brown ).

Totally agree, and particularly about the need for countries to be profitable. A welfare state needs to be sustainable and any country eventually has to live within its means. The boom and bust economic cycle, living off borrowed money then inflating the debt away eventually will to come to a very sad end. The massive debts now being built up by this govt and the printing of more money to pretend that things are ok will lead to massive interest rate rises to try and curb out of control inflation when the gilt markets and sterling implode. Any remnants of industrial production will be taken with it. North sea oil revenue diminishing rapidly, the financial sector shrinking and being driven abroad. This govt has pushed the UK to the brink and another economic calamity could sink the boat.

 

[Block_king]

If we're going to stick with capitalism then I would like to give the Liberals a go - I read Vince Cable's book and IMO he is the only politician that is not full of **** and knows what he is talking about.

At the moment I will take anyone that will sort out our economy and provide jobs and housing for people - I am guessing this is how Germans in the 1930s felt, probably not a good thing.

 

[Atilla]

There is some kind of inherent belief system that somehow the Tories (if we can label them - capitalists) have a better handle on managing the economy than socialists (if we can perhaps label them Labour - I know bounderies not very distinguished these days).

I don't think parties make any difference at all. It's all a kind of one big business or silly game which ever way you look at it.

If the elite and the rulers (mostly wealthy capitalists) didn't get us here to where we are today than who did - the trade unions or your common man???


I think if we look at the down fall of British Leyland as an example - it wasn't down to trade unions or strikes but essentially down to management processes and methods.

The Japaneese were investing in testing and reliability coupled with 4 different bodies on the same engine cheaper than BL could develop one engine and one body.

This was purely management / design / R&D process about bringing new models to market. It had absolutely nothing to do with trade unions or your averag worker who I'm sure were all well intentioned and motivated.

Stuck up knobs thought they ran the country and BL and they knew it all. The labour and trade unions were scivers and good for nothing loathers who didn't deserve anything. Management deserved all the bonuses and company cars - they created the wealth and ran the big corporations.

Fact and fiction - big difference. But people somehow hold trade unions to account and skip on great big British management (the elite mess ups)... Look at all our great decision makers now - all the fat cats. Blameless. In fact the FSA head has said in time of crises we need the best minds and people to stear us out of this mess.

I'm sure the fat cats will want a bonus for getting us out of this mess on top of all the bonuses they got for getting us into it in the first place. Hillarious stuff...

I'm not a politician. I consider my self more of an economist and I look at reasons - advantages disadvantages - cons pros - cost benefit analysis of action and results.

I consider my self an economist. I would say Alan Sugar is my idol - who I hold in high esteem for his no nonse, shrewd, pure business acumen. Sound common sense.

Dare I say I'm a big fan of Atilla the great for his leadership skills. He wasn't a socialist either. He rewarded results. Status was based on ability not blood line or some daft title. The need to deliver - not consume resources.

I'm no socialist do gooder...

 

[Mr. Charts]

Britain can't be too bad since people are queueing up in Calais to get to britain.

It's the freebies, neil.
Half of them are so poor anything is an improvement for them.
The other half are jihadis from Pakistan.
Richard

 

[Mr. Charts]

Still only one vote out of 34 for Labour.
C'mon Gordon, tell your Darling pet poodle to vote.....double your support in one fell swoop.

 

[Trader333]

I think if we look at the down fall of British Leyland as an example - it wasn't down to trade unions or strikes but essentially down to management processes and methods.

I agree with this but I don't agree with it on a larger macroeconomic basis. There is never just one reason as to why things are as they are and yet that is what people always try and look for. British manufacturing and raw materials industries were clearly inefficient but then so were the French at the same time. One factor that has not been included here is that the French were very clever in the way they used protectionism. Unlike the UK the French had very strict limits on imported cars and yet at the time their cars were as bad as anything British Leylend were producing. What they did was give their industries time in which to become more effective and efficient which they duly did and as a result have managed to keep their farming and manufacturing almost intact.

In my view if the UK had done the same we could well have had a thriving manufacturing base today instead of an economy built on house price inflation and financial services none of which are true value added activities.


Paul

 

[montmorencyt2w]

Thatcher's government systematically and deliberately set about destroying what she and it thought were inefficient, dead industries, presumably in the hope that the clean sweep and the hidden hand of free enterprise would miraculously conjure up new, efficient ones. And of course to defeat the unions. It didn't work very well, but that didn't matter because their real heart was in the financial sector, as it always had been.

When "New Labour" was elected, they had no more interest in industry than the Tories did. This wasn't the Labour Party of Clement Attlee, Harold Wilson, Jim Callaghan, or even Neil Kinnock. This was the new breed of smart Alec "third-way"-ers. The thought of someone like Mandy Mandelson in charge of trade and industry is laughable. He clearly has never had his hands dirty in his life.

 

[Atilla]

I agree with this but I don't agree with it on a larger macroeconomic basis. There is never just one reason as to why things are as they are and yet that is what people always try and look for. British manufacturing and raw materials industries were clearly inefficient but then so were the French at the same time. One factor that has not been included here is that the French were very clever in the way they used protectionism. Unlike the UK the French had very strict limits on imported cars and yet at the time their cars were as bad as anything British Leylend were producing. What they did was give their industries time in which to become more effective and efficient which they duly did and as a result have managed to keep their farming and manufacturing almost intact.

In my view if the UK had done the same we could well have had a thriving manufacturing base today instead of an economy built on house price inflation and financial services none of which are true value added activities.


Paul

Yes very true indeed. I distincly recall reading about one elderly gentleman Pierre who was solely responsible at one time for opening every single JVC VHS recorder checking box and sealing up and passing it through customs.

It was very clever ploy to stay within European legal requirements whilst stalling Japaneese invasion.

Protectionism was shunned at the time. But very valid point - if management / government recognised the British sickness they may well have dispensed the correct medicine.

Massey Fergusson tractors & Raleigh bikes were world class leaders. All went down the same route.

I would - in these hard times - make it a government priority to re-establish manufacturing. Give all the yobs on street corners some chance of becoming an apprentice and working with their hands again rather than the service industries which produce nothing at all. They can then have some aspiration to becoming good at something. Have pride and dignity. Take an interest in science and physics and producing better faster trains. Stop freaking playing PS3 & XBox games - scratching their balls all day long in front of the telly.

Bring back the good old days of outdoor activities and invention.

Bring back to old industries. Have deflux out of big cities. Establish cottage industries and scrap the scourge of big cities sprawling out and producing ghettos. It's like a deadly disease consuming everything in its path.

Core blimey as Sidney James would say... That would be a dream come true... :clap::clap::clap:

 

[Pat494]

Britain will go on being the losers that we have been for decades while:-

1. greedy 2nd rate management often more interested in filling their own bank accounts
2. stroppy unions insisting on the usual annual pay rise, even when the company is in dire straights.
3. overspending politicians who think social engineering is more important than the economy.

So my friends, greed and self interest is killing the golden goose bequeathed to us by our parents. We are getting our just deserts !!

 

[bhavin]

think about it why did BNP only won in a muslim majority area

If Muslims became peaceful the world would be a better place

 

[Hotch]

If mankind became peaceful the world would be a better place

fixed