Spread betting, a viable option to make a living out of?

[Black Swan]

Exactly, so make a favour to newbies and shut up, my dear!

SB firms will work against you. You know AVAFX? I won't copypaste the story here since it's written in spanish, but to summarize:

Not a long time ago, there was a guy who began to play some money with these guys. Fortunately very soon he began to win some money. No problem, everything worked like charm.

With the time, this boy began to earn more and more money. A nice sum of money actually.

Time to make a withdrawal. Time to buy a new car. Time to enjoy the fruit of his efforts. :clap:

But... surprise, surprise!!!!!

AVAFX regret to inform you that you have no available that money. Actually you have no gains. :whistling

How comes? It's impossible! What happened?

Your orders (several months of work) never reached the market. They where never executed, they told him.

But that's impossible. I've the confirmations of every order, and my account shows that profit.

So sorry, son. The operations never occurred. You have nothing. Good bye.

Urban myth, never happened...

 

[Black Swan]

Well said. We can to and fro about whether SB companies tilt the playing field, and whether DMA gives a better bottom line after tax, and this could go on for ever. But what is worrying is that nobody has come on here and replied to Alexbabwa and said, 'Yes you can make a living from SB and I am doing it'.

Any volunteers?

Yes. If you swing trade with spread betting you can make a v. decent living.

 

[tomorton]

Yes. If you swing trade with spread betting you can make a v. decent living.

I'm not (yet) but please tell me you are.

 

[gamma]

I make a good living from spreadbetting,

But I know for sure it will not make me millionaire
Trading as little as 3 pounds a point should give you a return of 100 to 150 a day
Once you go out of the 10 a point mark, there are other issues that come about mainly psychological that retail traders are unable to cope with

 

[Paul71]

I make a good living from spreadbetting,

But I know for sure it will not make me millionaire
Trading as little as 3 pounds a point should give you a return of 100 to 150 a day
Once you go out of the 10 a point mark, there are other issues that come about mainly psychological that retail traders are unable to cope with

Good point. Being able to trade for a profit doesn't come easy, i don't care what anybody says. But whilst all the learning is going on the individual is creating a mental comfort zone, and that is a hard place to break free from. Trading only for a living, with ones own money, is totally out of most peoples comfort zones, SB or DA, it doesn't matter.

Some speculators don't have to worry about paying mortgages, if it's already paid for. Some speculators don't have young children to care for, some do. Some have debts up to thier eyeballs, some don't.

Some speculators need 20k a year, some need 60k etc etc. Trading for a living can be done through SB or DA, but like most things in life nothing is ever totally black and white.

 

[arabianights]

I make a good living from spreadbetting,

But I know for sure it will not make me millionaire
Trading as little as 3 pounds a point should give you a return of 100 to 150 a day
Once you go out of the 10 a point mark, there are other issues that come about mainly psychological that retail traders are unable to cope with

?

 

[Black Swan]

I'm not (yet) but please tell me you are.

After close on one year of dedication, previous year playing around/working on my knowledge base, I'm now consistently profitable and making more than a decent living wage. I have an edge.

The naysayers need to take on board the fact that (unless you're scalping when you'll potentially kill yourself, without any 'extra' help from the SB company anyhow) if you cannot make a living from SB you're unlikley to make a living wage by simply switching to DMA, that 1 pip better quote and better execution aint gonna make you successful, and this is from a guy who uses IG and FXCM/Alpari.

If you scalp then yes, level 2 info and dma is essential, only an opinion but IMHO scalping/or working off a 3-5 minute TF with an SB firm is a mugs game. Not saying you cant make it work but you can save yourself a lot of grief by simply moving up to/trading off longer term TFs, at least 1 hour.

Oh, and whilst on that subject the prices and 'chart behaviour' and overall behaviour from firms are 99% good. If there's a spike/whipsaw I'll generally see it in the market on whatever platform. On my ten pairs I havn't experienced significant slippage for a year and on average I take one trade, on each currency pair, per day.

This subject (SB v DMA) repeats itself ad nauseum on 'ere. There is so much nonsense spoken it's staggering...

 

[oildaytrader]

The naysayers need to take on board the fact that (unless you're scalping when you'll potentially kill yourself, without any 'extra' help from the SB company anyhow) if you cannot make a living from SB you're unlikley to make a living wage by simply switching to DMA, that 1 pip better quote and better execution aint gonna make you successful, and this is from a guy who uses IG and FXCM/Alpari.

.

That is not correct!

I tested about 20 expert advisors on euro/usd using a 2 pip spread on one set of tests and 3 pips spread on a second Set of tests.

One was far more profitable than the extra spread.Statistical tests over 8 years are more reliable than whaT people may guess.

I work on statistical evidence.

O D T

 

[Black Swan]

That is not correct!

I tested about 20 expert advisors on euro/usd using a 2 pip spread on one set of tests and 3 pips spread on a second Set of tests.

One was far more profitable than the extra spread.Statistical tests over 8 years are more reliable than whaT people may guess.

I work on statistical evidence.

O D T

Perhaps I didn't explain it fully/correctly, I totally accept that If you are going to trade off short TFs, looking for lots of 10-15 pip net retained profit, then the extra spread/lack of speed of execution/lack of level 2 pricing will potentially kill your spread betting trading, no debate/argument needed.

However, if you're looking to swing; for example trading off 4 hours, using in tandem 3, 2hr and 1 hr for entry/exit decisions, then that extra 3-5 pip overall cost is irrelevant to my overall plan and spread betting is perfectly acceptable as a means of market access, for both parties.

I repeat, anyone trying to scalp, or profit of short term TFs with spread betting is mostly trading noise. Anyone making good profits trading that way must be exceptional and should logically turn to DMA.

I'm talking from experience re SB, I tried shorter TFs and scalping and it left me shattered. Physically and mentally taking 40-60 trades a day, whether retaining 100-200 pips on a day is irrelevant, it's just not for me, leaves me cold recalling it tbh. ..

 

[Splitlink]

Perhaps I didn't explain it fully/correctly, I totally accept that If you are going to trade off short TFs, looking for lots of 10-15 pip net retained profit, then the extra spread/lack of speed of execution/lack of level 2 pricing will potentially kill your spread betting trading, no debate/argument needed.

However, if you're looking to swing; for example trading off 4 hours, using in tandem 3, 2hr and 1 hr for entry/exit decisions, then that extra 3-5 pip overall cost is irrelevant to my overall plan and spread betting is perfectly acceptable as a means of market access, for both parties.

I repeat, anyone trying to scalp, or profit of short term TFs with spread betting is mostly trading noise. Anyone making good profits trading that way must be exceptional and should logically turn to DMA.

I'm talking from experience re SB, I tried shorter TFs and scalping and it left me shattered. Physically and mentally taking 40-60 trades a day, whether retaining 100-200 pips on a day is irrelevant, it's just not for me, leaves me cold recalling it tbh. ..

I've never done it, but I can imagine. Rarely, if ever, do I trade more than one instrument at a time. I'm not quick enough on the uptake and I don't mind admitting it. My aim is to do one trade per morning session. That doesn't often happen, either, but it's what I try for.

 

[Black Swan]

I've never done it, but I can imagine. Rarely, if ever, do I trade more than one instrument at a time. I'm not quick enough on the uptake and I don't mind admitting it. My aim is to do one trade per morning session. That doesn't often happen, either, but it's what I try for.

TBH bud handling 10 pairs with swing trading is not that taxing.

 

[oildaytrader]

Yes. If you swing trade with spread betting you can make a v. decent living.

Unfortunately ,this belief is the very reason why 95% lose money.Spreadbetting and the gambler's fallacies are related subjects , there is no way to convince the addicted.

My own tests conduced over 8 years of data on all major pairs revealed no swing strategy on forex has ever survived THE TEST OF TIME.

Facts: All swing traders losts consistently in forex in 2002 and 2003 .They are all in forex cemetry.

Go give me another fallacy. You can B S the amateurs.

O D T

 

[Alexbabwa]

I scalp if you can call it that. I don't do 40 - 60 trades a day, more like 10 if that. I aim for a minimum of 10 pips and maximum of 20 unless there is a good reason to stay in the trade. A trade for me lasts at least a minute and as long as 10. I don't know if that is frequent and short enough to be scalping, but its certainly not swing trading.

I prefer to scalp just because it keeps me busy and i don't get bored.

Interesting what is being said about the extra psychological stresses past £10 a point. I wonder how i will cope at that point. If its too much il just stay in my comfort zone.

 

[zupcon]

My own tests conduced over 8 years of data on all major pairs revealed no swing strategy on forex has ever survived THE TEST OF TIME.

Facts: All swing traders losts consistently in forex in 2002 and 2003 .They are all in forex cemetry.

I just love the use of the term ALL.

Obviously you've tested every possible permutation of every possible strategy known to mankind but are you sure there wasnt perhaps one, or even two traders who just about scraped through this period ?, I mean just by pure luck of course, they probably hit the buy key when they meant to sell.

 

[Black Swan]

Unfortunately ,this belief is the very reason why 95% lose money.Spreadbetting and the gambler's fallacies are related subjects , there is no way to convince the addicted.

My own tests conduced over 8 years of data on all major pairs revealed no swing strategy on forex has ever survived THE TEST OF TIME.

Facts: All swing traders losts consistently in forex in 2002 and 2003 .They are all in forex cemetry.

Go give me another fallacy. You can B S the amateurs.

O D T

tbh you are so bitter your views on anything trading related are rendered irrelevant. Swing trading forex, via SB works...the fact that you can't make it work profitably is your failing, good luck with you issues...:whistling

 

[oildaytrader]

I just love the use of the term ALL.

Obviously you've tested every possible permutation of every possible strategy known to mankind but are you sure there wasnt perhaps one, or even two traders who just about scraped through this period ?, I mean just by pure luck of course, they probably hit the buy key when they meant to sell.

Its not for me to hand it to you.The ball is in your court . Which one?

 

[Black Swan]

I scalp if you can call it that. I don't do 40 - 60 trades a day, more like 10 if that. I aim for a minimum of 10 pips and maximum of 20 unless there is a good reason to stay in the trade. A trade for me lasts at least a minute and as long as 10. I don't know if that is frequent and short enough to be scalping, but its certainly not swing trading.

I prefer to scalp just because it keeps me busy and i don't get bored.

Interesting what is being said about the extra psychological stresses past £10 a point. I wonder how i will cope at that point. If its too much il just stay in my comfort zone.

I lost/missed out on trades on Friday that could have, should have netted me 200+ pips...I bagged other trades, circa 200 pip movements, throughout the week. Average pip retention (on the winners) was 46. Last week I took 42 trades..across 10 pairs..Repeat and rinse this week would make for a great month....

 

[oildaytrader]

tbh you are so bitter your views on anything trading related are rendered irrelevant. Swing trading forex, via SB works...the fact that you can't make it work profitably is your failing, good luck with you issues...:whistling

I am being serious.I don't feel bitter ,sometimes when a poster gets carried away I have to throw in the bitter pill.

My views are based on logic, I trade and I don't gamble with bookies.

Don't you think a gambler's views on trading are rendered irrelevant?

O D T

 

[Black Swan]

I am being serious.I don't feel bitter ,sometimes when a poster gets carried away I have to throw in the bitter pill.

My views are based on logic, I trade and I don't gamble with bookies.

Don't you think a gambler's views on trading are rendered irrelevant?

O D T

it's very difficult to take you seriously and yes your bitter statements are very transparent. This childish stance; spread betting = gambling, dma = trading, is pathetic...Ooh look, let's get as 'deep' as you can handle, heh dude it's all gambling...

 

[tomorton]

So far we only have two visitors who claim a living income from SB. Any more takers?

For that matter, does anyone wish to claim a living income from their DMA?