Safe Haven

DionysusToast said:
NR mentioned deflation. This is one school of thought. The problem with the deflationary cycle is that it is fairly easy for governments to overcome it. Simply print & spend.

Others talk about 'the end' - I am not thinking of 'the end', I am thinking of countries inflating themselves out of debt. I did give hyperinflation as an example because it seems just regular inflation doesn't seem to get anyone's attention.

If REAL inflation was at 10% a year - that'd already be a HUGE worry to me and something I'd need to protect myself against BUT not with products issued by someone that could default (i.e. a government) or paper products that might not really be backed up by the commodity (i.e. various forms of Gold investment).

Let's face it - governments main focus is staying in power, everything they do, they do badly. As for the financial industry - you simply cannot trust them at all. Merril have already been caught charging people holding fees for Gold that didn't exist (which they'd also sold), so I still feel the need for a more solid footing...
Click to expand...

Damn almost forgot to mention it but you could put your "nest egg" in the very capable hands of that good looking, highly competent, honest as the day is short fellow ....er...you know ...what's-his -name....oh yes.....well ME actually :whistling
 
The mind drools at the very thought of how to invest your piggy bank, but believe me Toastie it would be in safe hands.
Would I invest "our money "in a new super car or luxury yacht I ask myself, with a no expenses spared bicycle for your goodself ?
And just suppose the Mayfair tarts don't get to hear of it...........aaaaah the alternatives are endless.

PS If its less than 6 figures don't bother, more chicken feed ain't needed
:p
 
Sounds about as tempting as that guy trying to get me to buy into Arga wood trees in Thailand...

I remember him saying - "it's safe - even if the company goes bust, you have a legal lease on the land, so you'd still have the trees"...

Now - I have a house that's proving hard to shift but I shudder at the thought of any investment that sees me having to cut down treess myself in order to cash it in..
 
DionysusToast said:
NR mentioned deflation. This is one school of thought. The problem with the deflationary cycle is that it is fairly easy for governments to overcome it. Simply print & spend.

Others talk about 'the end' - I am not thinking of 'the end', I am thinking of countries inflating themselves out of debt. I did give hyperinflation as an example because it seems just regular inflation doesn't seem to get anyone's attention.

If REAL inflation was at 10% a year - that'd already be a HUGE worry to me and something I'd need to protect myself against BUT not with products issued by someone that could default (i.e. a government) or paper products that might not really be backed up by the commodity (i.e. various forms of Gold investment).

Let's face it - governments main focus is staying in power, everything they do, they do badly. As for the financial industry - you simply cannot trust them at all. Merril have already been caught charging people holding fees for Gold that didn't exist (which they'd also sold), so I still feel the need for a more solid footing...
Click to expand...

deflation is not easy to fix, at all(tell it to japan). inflation is far easier to combat and much preferable to deflation.

Central banks can print money, they cant MAKE banks lend. withdrawing money from markets is much easier than trying to inject it. Hence the fed is losing the fight against deflation.
 
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N Rothschild said:
deflation is not easy to fix, at all(tell it to japan). inflation is far easier to combat and much preferable to deflation.

Central banks can print money, they cant MAKE banks lend. withdrawing money from markets is much easier than trying to inject it. Hence the fed is losing the fight against deflation.
Click to expand...

I completely agree.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Trading is not Gambling.
http://www.myfxbook.com/members/ultimateForex
 
After reading some of the posts on this thread, I had a look into wines as an investment. Very interesting area and I started fantasising about having my own little cellar portfolio! Then on Tues evening there was a report on 'The One Show' about wines as investment. Don't they say once the masses know about it, its time to get out or something?! Maybe NR is right and it is just a boom period?

Actually it was quite funny on 'The One Show' - Phil Tufnell was doing the report and it cuts back to the studio, where he has a bottle of wine that had gone from £700 odd quid to £23k and he had special insurance just to handle the thing... Then he reaches over for his glass of water and knocks the bottle on the floor and it smashes to the complete shock of the presenters... Turns out it was just a fake. It was hilarious - the look on the presenters faces was priceless! Anyone see it?

Anyway, I'd be worried if I invested in wine that I'd come home drunk and think its a good idea to crack open a bottle. I'd almost definitely do that! Or I'd probably store the things wrong. Look at some of the prices for these bad boys - http://www.finestandrarest.com/

As for buying metals. I use this website to buy mine - http://www.goldline.co.uk/ Click on 'Investment Products'. I particularly like Palladium which has doubled since I started buying. I also like buying silver but that's cos I can afford the big bars. I'd get something the size of a finger nail if I was buying Gold or Platinum!

Sam.
 
Easy to spot the hide-outs of the rich and famous

They are the best and most expensive areas - they don't stint themselves when it comes to comforts e.g.

The Hamptons
Beverly Hills
South of France
Greek islands
In winter the posh ski resorts like Sun valley, Klosters etc
etc.

In fact anywhere where the sweaty masses aren't
 
Pat494 said:
Easy to spot the hide-outs of the rich and famous

They are the best and most expensive areas - they don't stint themselves when it comes to comforts e.g.

The Hamptons
Beverly Hills
South of France
Greek islands
In winter the posh ski resorts like Sun valley, Klosters etc
etc.

In fact anywhere where the sweaty masses aren't
Click to expand...

the great unwashed to give them their formal name
 
DionysusToast said:
All

I was wondering what you'd consider to be a 'safe haven' nowadays. I have some dollars. Quite a few dollars and am a tad concerned that they are soon going to be worthless. So - I'm looking for a safe haven.

Cash - well that seems screwed. The dollar seems risky, the Euro appears to be in a bit of trouble too and central banks seem to have revealed that they are totally incompetent. I guess I could move into Swiss Franc but then my luck would see the dollar bouncing back and me taking a hit anyway.

Govt bonds - Of course, there's all sorts of government bonds that profess to be safe havens but seeing as governments themselves could be facing bankruptcy, it's not that comforting any more.

Gold - Whilst the physical commodity is fine, I don't have anywhere to store the gold securely - I could buy a gold fund but let's face it - 'electronic' gold is going to be the next financial embarrassment - Merril have already been sued for charging people storage fees for Gold that they'd sold but didn't actually own. My opinion is that much more gold has been sold electronically than actually is held by the sellers.

Stocks – not that bad to be honest, especially exporters and companies in industries where a breakdown of society would be needed to make your investment worthless – energy, agriculture, property (long term) etc.

Property – not so bad but illiquid and to be honest I have 2 houses and don’t want any more.

I’m obviously missing a lot – what do you guys consider as safe places for your ‘stored value’ ?

DT
Click to expand...

I think this may be the answer. safe haven become a supplier of safes.
http://www.safesrus.com.au/
 
N Rothschild said:
safe makers must be making a killing selling safes to all the morons with there 1oz of gold bullion. bit like selling spades back in the day
Click to expand...

Yep exactly :). It was said back in the day that the only one's who made money in the gold rush were the suppliers.:LOL:
 
Going into serious mode, I do actually take DT's concerns seriously.

Inflation sucks, let's face it. I don't mean hyperinflation, which really sucks, but which is relatively rare, and QE1 didn't lead immediately to it as some thought (although maybe it could be argued it has sowed the seeds for it at some future time).

But just ordinary common or garden 2-5% inflation sucks, and that's more or less what we've got in the UK, and if you are a saver you have to work hard to beat it.


Investment funds should be one way of doing this. Shouldn't the average fund manager easily be able to beat normal inflation after costs are taken into consideration?
But for the average investor, choosing one of these is a gamble; not quite as bad just putting it on the horses, but not as safe as sticking it into a cash ISA (where he will lose some money, but maybe not as much as with the fund).

You should be able to do better by just being a conservative trader.

hmmm.
 
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