Price Patterns.

[Olipro]

let's not waste time discussing the mechanics of the topic and discourse of speech... and instead, let's discuss the topic

 

[dbphoenix]

...my truce is still on db......your just making me feel like i cant post anything without saying its already be done....if i start a new thread will you post the same again...serious question.no need to go to war over this.this isnt about whos right or wrong...its about allowing others to post also.thanks.apologies if my last post showed frustration....

Post what you like, marcus. I was pointing out a resource. And if I hadn't been asked direct questions, I wouldn't be posting at all.

You and Albert are a real pair.

 

[firewalker99]

let's not waste time discussing the mechanics of the topic and discourse of speech... and instead, let's discuss the topic

I'll second that.
(But I wouldn't bet on it happening :|)

 

[firewalker99]

If there are known laws, then maybe everything could be known in advance.

Price is the consequence of buying and selling, therefore price is a reaction and delayed.

Any thoughts?

If I decided to buy 100.000 shares tomorrow, of a company that only trades around 200.000 shares daily, well... that would influence price to say the least. Would those laws be able to predict that? So how can everything (or anything) be known in advance?

 

[firewalker99]

Or price can practically standstill ( narrow spread) while large volume prints go off, which is a good hint of mischief especially at tops....

I'm inclined to follow that thought Bez.

... or volume can have little peaks without price moving around.... which often hints at accumulation imho...especially at relatively low price levels...

 

[firewalker99]

Are the standard supply and demand theories just plain wrong now because:

1. Price is moved more by direct manipulation now than in the past
2. More participants now than in the past conceal their true motives in their trading action
3. More participants now than in the past are stupid, ignorant, inexperienced, etc.
4. Enough participants know enough about classic supply/demand theory and have enough computing power to be able to predict price action and so it is traded out before it has chance to happen, thereby disrupting price action to the extent that you can't apply standard supply and demand theories anymore
5. The population of participants is sufficiently diverse in terms of motivations, tools, methods and inter-instrumentedness now compared with in the past to nullify a simple, single-market supply and demand analysis
6. More trading now than in the past is by computers than humans
7. More trading now than in the past is technical/short term than fundamental/long term
8. A combination of these
9. None of these
10. Anything I ticked would be wrong in order to retain my lottery ticket so I might as well tick here

Maybe we should define "the standard supply & demand theories" first, before discussing whether we believe they are wrong or right or outdated or... :?:

 

[sandpiper]

Post what you like, marcus. I was pointing out a resource. And if I hadn't been asked direct questions, I wouldn't be posting at all.

You and Albert are a real pair.

DB,

Rather than resorting to attempting to get other players sent off why not let other members have their say, express their opinions, etc. The unfortunate aspect to your posts is they suggest that everything that isn't expressed according to your own limited frame of reference is 'put down' as a 'diversion' or 'off topic'. I'm sure it will come as a shock to you, perhaps to others as well, but the PV thread is not the font of all knowledge.

Lastly. I would issue a plea to the membership at large (before any ban kicks in . When is anybody other than the big boys going to have the b a l l s to stand up to this insidious little sh1t. If the membership at large are content to be led down the garden path continuously by said sh1t then fair enough..... you probably can't be helped by anyone and deserve what you get.

And yes, before the sh1tty one points it out, I do know Marcus (actually I am proud and privileged to know him). I would like to think that people could look beyond this affiliation and appreciate that I am only resorting to behaviour as this because I feel desperate situations require desperate measures.

Good people of T2W. FFS...... WAKE UP and smell the coffee here...

 

[SOCRATES]

Post what you like, marcus. I was pointing out a resource. And if I hadn't been asked direct questions, I wouldn't be posting at all.

You and Albert are a real pair.

Yes, exactly we are a real pair and I will tell you why we are exactly.

Because we know the topic back to front inside out and whatever, so we get irritated easily by dunces. What is more we know who is who in the zoo so to speak.

The difference is that my friend is willing to be more openly generous and kind with his hard earned knowldedge as he is still under the illusion everyone is like him. and me.

I am battle hardened and I understand the carbunklery such as yours very clearly.

For this reason you ought to know your place and not interrupt and gladly accept what he is willing to give you, that I am not, and not because I cannot but because whereas he thinks everyone is worthy, I know this not to be the case.

 

[andycan]

linesiniffer
all markets have a structure, buying and selling is a result of what the intentions of the players are, buying happens on accumulation equally buying occurs during distribution, one has to recognise the difference and which perspective one is exploring,
take note of counter trend moves these tend to be moves in the opposite direction to the perceived trend, its not unusual to see those move short lived but also faster than the trend moves, one needs to understand why this phenomenon happens, this one can argue is a pattern of sorts or a contribution of a pattern, or a pattern within a pattern,
a market is made up of millions of players they all have one goal, make money!!
if everyone was to buy simultaneously then there would not be a market at that moment
so a buyer needs a seller, and because of this fact misdirection is a game that is played now think about that and that may kick start you into really thinking at the core level

 

[firewalker99]

.....nope....price is not a reflection of volume.its good to ask questions....but how about giving your own thoughts and ideas.....and bottom line if you dont develop your own ideas and thoughts how do you know the information being presented to you is correct?your asking huge questions which dont take 2 minute answers...not correct ones anyways.and if your were just plated the correct ones they would mean nothing to you without walking the journey for yourself.anyone who insists the answers are easy to derive...ask to see their trading results ..i can guarantee they wont be that impressive.to arrive at the destination takes a shed load of work and free thought.your questions are very good btw.....each one deserves a thread in its own right.happy hunting.

so how does one start working on developing something of his own then, with "free thought"? what is it that he should leave behind for him to truly see the logic or psychology behind patterns? and are these patterns really there or do we just like to see them?

"Our need to find patterns in complete randomness actually causes us to do much poorer than if we — like the rats — simply pursued the best long-term strategy no matter how much it hurt in the short run." is a quote from an (well, parts of it at least) interesting article that can be found at http://www.russell.com/ca/Education_Centre/Professor_Portfolio/Psychology.asp

Anyway, I've done my share to get this thread back on topic... .

 

[firewalker99]

WAKE UP and smell the coffee here...

I'm going to sleep now but when I wake up, I hope to read some interesting thoughts!

 

[Bez]

To follow up firewalkers post 117.....

I use the old effort versus results...

Effort usually is seen in the spread, so if volume is high with but the effort shows no result, ie narrow spread, its a big warning flag that all is not as it seems.....

 

[Bez]

I remember posting some basic charts on the US daytraders thread..:?:


http://www.trade2win.com/boards/showthread.php?p=284718#post284718

Its only some simpple scribbles and they misses alot of info off, but it gives an idea :?:

 

[Bez]

Oh DOM....

They create bush fires in that too

Fun to watch in Zeroline

 

[rainman2]

DB,

Rather than resorting to attempting to get other players sent off why not let other members have their say, express their opinions, etc. The unfortunate aspect to your posts is they suggest that everything that isn't expressed according to your own limited frame of reference is 'put down' as a 'diversion' or 'off topic'. I'm sure it will come as a shock to you, perhaps to others as well, but the PV thread is not the font of all knowledge.

Not for nothing db, but sandpiper is absolutely right. This thread was the first one that has come along in ages that had real potential for learning and you before anyone had asked, came and disrupted it. Nobody is trying to put down your p/v threads, in fact their is a ton of value in them, but let others express themselves even if you disagree with what they are saying. Who knows, you may realize that your more on the same page than previously thought.

 

[counter_violent]

Can't we get some luv going on T2W......even Socco is capable I suspect

 

[mejnoon2003]

When the market is good, you can through darts; when it's bad, nothing works. Simple as that.

 

[Paul71]

If I decided to buy 100.000 shares tomorrow, of a company that only trades around 200.000 shares daily, well... that would influence price to say the least. Would those laws be able to predict that? So how can everything (or anything) be known in advance?

The answer lies in this question.

What creates trend?

 

[timsk]

.....so what creates the strongest trends?

Yo Mr.m'
Good to see that your back in earnest!
The strongest uptrends are created by the big boyz (strong hands) accumulating stock and, as the trend gathers momentum, the retail traders spot it and start to pile in. Then supply starts to get thin on the ground and those arriving late to the party (weak hands) pay ever higher prices.
This results in large price bars which deviate away from all MA's and send all sarcastic indicators into heavily overbought territory. During these latter stages, the smart money is getting out at a handsome profit and the inevitable correction occurs soon after leaving the likes of me wondering what the hell went on. This is the conventional wisdom, so I expect you'll say it's total pants!

Tim.

 

[Paul71]

.....so what creates the strongest trends?

What is a strong trend?

Seriously though, would i be on the right lines by saying the strongest trends have least resistance?


How long does it take to create a 6 month trend?

A week, a month or a day?

And what about this formulae, would Wyckoff realise it?

This guy was never exposed to the power of the microchip.