Goodbye Finspreads jan 4th 2007

[grahamsc1]

Finspreads argh, their mobile service is soo bad

I totally agree with your comments. I recently started using them and wanted to test out their mobile platform so I can track positions all the time and not worry too much about stop losses, well that was a big mistake! The system is very unreliable especially during heavy trading periods even more so when the NYSE opens at 2.30, three days in a row the system crashed immediately and I was unable to log back in.

Not only do they have a poor spread margin I mean 6 points on the Dow (licence to print money) their systems are weak. I am going back to IG they seem lot better and so far their mobile software holds up.


---------------------------------

Today I decided I was never again going to use Finspreads. I went long at about 12430. I don't use stops as I prefer to just watch whats happening with a book for company. It was going well about 27 points in my favour. Things then started to change for the worse. It started to nosedive. I hung on but was getting concerned. Suddenly The screen was no longer live, with no fresh updating. I didn't know where I was.

I turned the computer off, as I must to use the telephone. I called Finspreads. They must have been busy, as it was a while before I got an answer. I told the lady what was happening. Another wait, while she connects me to a dealer. Again I tell him what is going on. I am told that the server is down. Politely enough I told him what I thought of the service. The line then becomes dead.

I ring them again and got through the whole thing again. Then I'm talking to a dealer again. Yes the server is down he tells me. What about my bet I tell him. I havn't a clue whats going on, and I am long £100 per point on the Dow.

He wants my account number, post code etc. Eventually I discover I am nearly £4 K out of pocket. I get him to close the bet. As there is no point leaving it run as I cannot see what the hell is happening, and it could easily get worse.

Finspreads have a spread of 6 points. Therefore I placed £600 in their hand that day. Thats a tidy sum of money considering the little they do. I think the service considering its cost, is really crap. Servers- whatever they are, should not be going down or anywhere else for that price.

It really is just not good enough. To cap it all the Dow closed at 12480. I would have made 50 points 50 X100 = £5000. So, Ive lost about £9k all in.

The previous week while in a bet, they did the same thing -down server. Then I gave them the benefit of the doubt. Once yes, but not twice. Good bye Finspreads.

 

[JTrader]

It is very scary that a spreadbetter dealer, or bonified "brokers" could go offline at any minute, with you in the market.
I think that if this sort of thing (platform freezes, platform disconnects, servers down) happens more than once every blue moon, you do need to ask some serious questions and look elsewhere.

In effect, we are at their mercy.

 

[splorff]

Spreadbetters tend to be untrusting with their opposite parts.That, I believe, is the problem they have with placing their stops. They believe, with good reason, that they will be cleaned out in a spike action. The other option, though, is a terrible uncertainty and the stress must be enormous when bets are at stake.

I trade profitably with Fins, but with far smaller amounts and I am confident that I know what I am doing. Frankly, I feel thaf £100 betters are better served with brokers. How anyone can trade like that without stops is beyond my comprehension. You can't think of anything else, when in a crisis, apart from getting someone to answer the phone!

In 1987- the big weekend drop- James Capel, a reputable broker at the time, would not pick up the phone for me until things settled down a bit, on the Monday morning. Anyone trading without stops in that atmosphere must have had a nightmare of a weekend.

Regards

Split

Hi Splitlink
Its not that I won't used stops, I actually think they are a good idea. The problem for me is where exactly should you put them. As I said elsewhere, the last time I used one I was stopped out in a trade which would have been very profitable.

Of course the further away you place the stop, the less likely it is that you will be stopped out by the normal fluctuations in price we must expect., but of course, the chance of losing a big wedge increases should the bet go south.

I think that I would rather be there at the time and make that decision on my feet.

But of course I never really thought that having paid the princely sum of £600 for a live data stream from Finspreads, that it would just stop unexpectedly during some bad news period. Thats the last thing I would expect. I expected having paid hansomely for the service, that I would get exactly that - service

Yes as I said before this did happen last week. But firstly I believe that one in a million things can sometimes happen. Seconly I was not at all suspicious then. I was not in a compromised position then. It was believable as a one off event.

Now, like others I believe that my pc has been left without the data stream at that very stressful moment deliberately. It was an inducement to panic. With no back up streaming data provider I was flying blind. I could only end the bet which I believe is exactly what they wanted.

I am told on by a guy on this thread that it is possible to knobble someones pc remotely. So now we see the means.

I am also told by another who knows, that when betting on the Dow Daily that the loses of punters , as well as the spread go to Finspreads. In addition to the means, I now see the motive. Now consider the timing. It's looking very ugly from here.

Another point of interest is that I was told by finspreads that the "server was down" .That is on tape, and I have requested a copy. I am told that c-bot did not go down on the day in question. What went bad was finspreads platform- their service.

Incidentally if you are a UK spread betting solicitor reading this please advise me of your presence.

 

[splorff]

Hi Splorff

I suspect that finspreads have really done wrong by you, and really sympathise with your plight. Any finspreads customers reading about your experience should be so shocked they should move elsewhere in my opinion.

A server going down is a very scary thing, and probably something of a grey area. While this resulted in you taking a significant loss with FS, no doubt somewhere, FS customers, were also stacking up a significant profit?
Unless the servers didn't really go down, and you were the only/one of the few customers to experience this problem?

Knock FS on the head, at least consider WorlsSpreads with their 1 pip spreads, and also look into futuresbetting/twowayfutures who are based in Gibraltar.

While WS may seem good so far to me, at the end of the day they are still a spreadbet dealer, like finspreads. FB/TWF are a spreadbet broker, only making their profit through client commissions, hedging all clients trades into the market that you are trading through direct access (very transparent as you are trading direct access, without commission, but just paying a wider spread to do so).

A broadband connection is considered to be much more reliable and stable than a dial-up connection. Virgin.net, metronet, broadbandquest, are some of the few broadband ISP's that have monthly contracts (with maybe a 30 day notice cancellation period, and a £50 cancellation fee). Most other ISP's have a 12 month minimum contract.

Good luck
JT.

Thanks for your input JT. I wont be doing anymore with FS as I have no confidence in their neutrality, and no confidence in their service. Plus it may be that they have a criminal on the team. I like what I have read about the Gibralter firm- twoways.

I can see from what you have said that I ought to get broadband. And I also need to get a back up data stream provider. It just had not occured to me that this was necessary. At £600 commission I was expecting a Rolls Royce of a service. I also need to get my pc and landline phone working independently. And the mobile needs topping up too !

 

[splorff]

I totally agree with your comments. I recently started using them and wanted to test out their mobile platform so I can track positions all the time and not worry too much about stop losses, well that was a big mistake! The system is very unreliable especially during heavy trading periods even more so when the NYSE opens at 2.30, three days in a row the system crashed immediately and I was unable to log back in.

Not only do they have a poor spread margin I mean 6 points on the Dow (licence to print money) their systems are weak. I am going back to IG they seem lot better and so far their mobile software holds up.


---------------------------------

I think you are doing the right thing. I dont know about IG, are they neutral like twoways ? I will only use a neutral company now, not one who can profit from my loss, excepting the spread.

 

[Splitlink]

Hi Splitlink

But of course I never really thought that having paid the princely sum of £600 for a live data stream from Finspreads, that it would just stop unexpectedly during some bad news period. Thats the last thing I would expect. I expected having paid hansomely for the service, that I would get exactly that - service

Another point of interest is that I was told by finspreads that the "server was down" .That is on tape, and I have requested a copy. I am told that c-bot did not go down on the day in question. What went bad was finspreads platform- their service.

Incidentally if you are a UK spread betting solicitor reading this please advise me of your presence.

Hi splorff,

Yes, there is nothing that I can say about that. It is something that deserves full compensation for losses incurred.and, if you push hard enough, you may well get it

Below is a copy of part of a post I made on another "Spreadbet" thread, a few years ago. The trouble I am writing about was with City Index

"I had trouble with them before internet trading came in and it was telephone. I opened and closed two trades in one day and got a margin call by post because one trade was still open. The onus was on me to prove that I had closed it. Fortunately, because I live in Spain, they were international calls and logged. Telefonica, to whom I shall always be grateful and a loyal customer, when I told them the problem sent the printout very promptly. The exact times of the conversations were found on City Index, there were apologies and I was reimbursed with a few free trades- you know the sort of thing. However, I told them that there were enough problems with trading without having mistakes like that , as well, and I went somewhere else.

The point is- what would have happened if I had lived in the UK and the calls were local and not logged.? The amount was for several thousands and I was worried to hell.
Nowadays, I can check what my account is and whether I have open orders, or not , but I, really, sympathise with Atters or anyone else who gets a similar problem. It represented rwo weeks of worry before it was settled.. Even if he goes to the FSA, he'll have that."


I might have explained that all telephone calls were taped but unless I knew the actual times, which I didn't, City Index were not going to search through the tapes to find mine. So I had to go to Telefonica for the information.

That brings me to another warning for telephone users. Always log your times as closely as possible. As I said before--It's a jungle out there!

Split

 

[JTrader]

If you open a TWF account, it is maybe slghtly better to open it through futuresbetting (a whie label for TWF) as 6 months ago FB had a tendency to start you off on a slightly better commission (narrower spread) than if you opened the account via TWF. Once the account is open, you are trading with TWF.

If you don't go with TWF/FB, I would seriously give worldspreads a consideration.

Cheers.

 

[splorff]

Thanks for your input JT. I wont be doing anymore with FS as I have no confidence in their neutrality, and no confidence in their service. Plus it may be that they have a criminal on the team. I like what I have read about the Gibralter firm- twoways.

I take this back. I will not go to twoways after reading this guys post :

Seasider
Newbie
Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1 Quote:
Originally Posted by markjpwill

I looked into this myself and they are regulated by the FSC (Gib equivalent of FSA).

They run an investor compensations cheme that seems to have:

The total amount of compensation to any claimant shall be limited to the lesser of–
(a) 90% of the total amount of all eligible investments held by that claimant with the investment
firm in default (wherever held); or
(b) the sterling equivalent, as calculated under sub-section (6) on the date of declaration of default under section 9(1), of euros 20,000.


Er... they won't let you open an account unless you sign away your rights under the FSC compensation scheme (see attached).

In addition, you are sending unknown foreign persons all the documents they need to potentially steal your identity (passport copy, utility bill, bank statement).

Obviously, I am not suggesting TWF are in anyway less than honest and indeed they should be congratulated for the novel service they offer. Every firm is entitled to conduct business in its own way but the above observations are worrying nonetheless.

Seasider
Attached Files Application Form 3.pdf (34.1 KB, 10 views)

 

[splorff]

Thanks for your input JT. I wont be doing anymore with FS as I have no confidence in their neutrality, and no confidence in their service. Plus it may be that they have a criminal on the team. I like what I have read about the Gibralter firm- twoways.

I take this back. I will not go to twoways after reading this guys post :


Seasider
Newbie




Join Date: Jan 2007
Posts: 1 Quote:
Originally Posted by markjpwill

I looked into this myself and they are regulated by the FSC (Gib equivalent of FSA).

They run an investor compensations cheme that seems to have:

The total amount of compensation to any claimant shall be limited to the lesser of–
(a) 90% of the total amount of all eligible investments held by that claimant with the investment
firm in default (wherever held); or
(b) the sterling equivalent, as calculated under sub-section (6) on the date of declaration of default under section 9(1), of euros 20,000.


Er... they won't let you open an account unless you sign away your rights under the FSC compensation scheme (see attached).

In addition, you are sending unknown foreign persons all the documents they need to potentially steal your identity (passport copy, utility bill, bank statement).

Obviously, I am not suggesting TWF are in anyway less than honest and indeed they should be congratulated for the novel service they offer. Every firm is entitled to conduct business in its own way but the above observations are worrying nonetheless.

Seasider
Attached Files Application Form 3.pdf (34.1 KB, 10 views)

 

[splorff]

Hi splorff,

Yes, there is nothing that I can say about that. It is something that deserves full compensation for losses incurred.and, if you push hard enough, you may well get it

Below is a copy of part of a post I made on another "Spreadbet" thread, a few years ago. The trouble I am writing about was with City Index

"I had trouble with them before internet trading came in and it was telephone. I opened and closed two trades in one day and got a margin call by post because one trade was still open. The onus was on me to prove that I had closed it. Fortunately, because I live in Spain, they were international calls and logged. Telefonica, to whom I shall always be grateful and a loyal customer, when I told them the problem sent the printout very promptly. The exact times of the conversations were found on City Index, there were apologies and I was reimbursed with a few free trades- you know the sort of thing. However, I told them that there were enough problems with trading without having mistakes like that , as well, and I went somewhere else.

The point is- what would have happened if I had lived in the UK and the calls were local and not logged.? The amount was for several thousands and I was worried to hell.
Nowadays, I can check what my account is and whether I have open orders, or not , but I, really, sympathise with Atters or anyone else who gets a similar problem. It represented rwo weeks of worry before it was settled.. Even if he goes to the FSA, he'll have that."


I might have explained that all telephone calls were taped but unless I knew the actual times, which I didn't, City Index were not going to search through the tapes to find mine. So I had to go to Telefonica for the information.

That brings me to another warning for telephone users. Always log your times as closely as possible. As I said before--It's a jungle out there!

Split

Thanks for that unfortunate tale Splitlink. I can see now that scams like this are quite an industry in spreadbetting.

It is so blatant it beggars belief.

 

[Phil Mibbutz]

Just to add my 50p worth, in my experience Fins has the most unreliable platform of the SB cos. They also seem to delay or requote just long enough to wait for the market to move against you before the bet is opened.
I stopped using them six months ago when their platform did a similar thing to what happened to splorff. When I rang they just said it wasn't their fault because they lost their data feed. The price stayed still for about half an hour before they managed to put a warning message on the site. About an hour later the price jumped and they filled the orders, ignoring my stop!
In fact, although I just withdrew my remaining funds at the time, this thread has reminded me that I should really write a letter of complaint.

 

[splorff]

Just to add my 50p worth, in my experience Fins has the most unreliable platform of the SB cos. They also seem to delay or requote just long enough to wait for the market to move against you before the bet is opened.
I stopped using them six months ago when their platform did a similar thing to what happened to splorff. When I rang they just said it wasn't their fault because they lost their data feed. The price stayed still for about half an hour before they managed to put a warning message on the site. About an hour later the price jumped and they filled the orders, ignoring my stop!
In fact, although I just withdrew my remaining funds at the time, this thread has reminded me that I should really write a letter of complaint.

Hi Phil.
Sorry to hear of another victim of this scam. It may not be too late to get some justice. I have asked for a solicitor with an interest in spreading to make her/himself known. Lets see what develops. These creeps deserve a judicial bloody nose.

It seems clear to me that should I offer a service and charged a large amount for that service ,then I am duty bound to provide that service.

To fail to provide that service, by quickly and without warning removing it, having charged a large amount for it, incuring expense to my customer must leave me vulnerable to litigation surely. And so it should be with Finspreads.

 

[Splitlink]

Hi Phil.
Sorry to hear of another victim of this scam. It may not be too late to get some justice. I have asked for a solicitor with an interest in spreading to make her/himself known. Lets see what develops. These creeps deserve a judicial bloody nose.

It seems clear to me that should I offer a service and charged a large amount for that service ,then I am duty bound to provide that service.

To fail to provide that service, by quickly and without warning removing it, having charged a large amount for it, incuring expense to my customer must leave me vulnerable to litigation surely. And so it should be with Finspreads.

They merged with City Index, didn't they? I see that they are listed as authorised with the FSA in the City Index box, but unauthorised under their own name. You'd need to check that out a bit more, but that could be the way to go for a legitimate complaint, or just say that you are going to write to FSA if there is no satisfaction.

http://www.fsa.gov.uk/register/firmMainSearch.do

Split

 

[romik]

Today I decided I was never again going to use Finspreads. I went long at about 12430. I don't use stops as I prefer to just watch whats happening with a book for company. It was going well about 27 points in my favour. Things then started to change for the worse. It started to nosedive. I hung on but was getting concerned. Suddenly The screen was no longer live, with no fresh updating. I didn't know where I was.

I turned the computer off, as I must to use the telephone. I called Finspreads. They must have been busy, as it was a while before I got an answer. I told the lady what was happening. Another wait, while she connects me to a dealer. Again I tell him what is going on. I am told that the server is down. Politely enough I told him what I thought of the service. The line then becomes dead.

I ring them again and got through the whole thing again. Then I'm talking to a dealer again. Yes the server is down he tells me. What about my bet I tell him. I havn't a clue whats going on, and I am long £100 per point on the Dow.

He wants my account number, post code etc. Eventually I discover I am nearly £4 K out of pocket. I get him to close the bet. As there is no point leaving it run as I cannot see what the hell is happening, and it could easily get worse.

Finspreads have a spread of 6 points. Therefore I placed £600 in their hand that day. Thats a tidy sum of money considering the little they do. I think the service considering its cost, is really crap. Servers- whatever they are, should not be going down or anywhere else for that price.

It really is just not good enough. To cap it all the Dow closed at 12480. I would have made 50 points 50 X100 = £5000. So, Ive lost about £9k all in.

The previous week while in a bet, they did the same thing -down server. Then I gave them the benefit of the doubt. Once yes, but not twice. Good bye Finspreads.

* IF YOU ARE A UK BASED SOLICITOR WITH AN INTEREST IN SPREAD BETTING / TRADING i WISH TO SPEAK TO YOU.*

You can never rely on data coming from broker - NEVER. Only when broker's quotes match to external feed (like IQ - the best for retail sector IMO) I would place a trade. Unfortunately that is a problem when not using stops (when daytrading), if you can not get through to them over the phone after their system goes down, there is no chance of closing and risk becomes unlimited. Controlling risk is rule number one as we all know, why not place a stop which would be your maximum loss for that trade and being outside the broker's spread, basically marking to market?

 

[NASFUT]

Today I decided I was never again going to use Finspreads. I went long at about 12430. I don't use stops as I prefer to just watch whats happening with a book for company. It was going well about 27 points in my favour. Things then started to change for the worse. It started to nosedive. I hung on but was getting concerned. Suddenly The screen was no longer live, with no fresh updating. I didn't know where I was.

I turned the computer off, as I must to use the telephone. I called Finspreads. They must have been busy, as it was a while before I got an answer. I told the lady what was happening. Another wait, while she connects me to a dealer. Again I tell him what is going on. I am told that the server is down. Politely enough I told him what I thought of the service. The line then becomes dead.

I ring them again and got through the whole thing again. Then I'm talking to a dealer again. Yes the server is down he tells me. What about my bet I tell him. I havn't a clue whats going on, and I am long £100 per point on the Dow.

He wants my account number, post code etc. Eventually I discover I am nearly £4 K out of pocket. I get him to close the bet. As there is no point leaving it run as I cannot see what the hell is happening, and it could easily get worse.

Finspreads have a spread of 6 points. Therefore I placed £600 in their hand that day. Thats a tidy sum of money considering the little they do. I think the service considering its cost, is really crap. Servers- whatever they are, should not be going down or anywhere else for that price.

It really is just not good enough. To cap it all the Dow closed at 12480. I would have made 50 points 50 X100 = £5000. So, Ive lost about £9k all in.

The previous week while in a bet, they did the same thing -down server. Then I gave them the benefit of the doubt. Once yes, but not twice. Good bye Finspreads.

* IF YOU ARE A UK BASED SOLICITOR WITH AN INTEREST IN SPREAD BETTING / TRADING i WISH TO SPEAK TO YOU.*

Hello, Splorff!

I'm feelin ya bud, i'm feelin ya. But never fear, a bloke i know who's mate goes in our local knows a good solicitor. He specialises in this type of thing!

I'll pm you his mobile number.(if you want that is?)

Listen, you'll get your money back, and some. Know what i mean?

This guy, or should i say solicitor, that my mate knows is very subtle. First he writes a few letters, nothing nasty, nothing rash or silly. Then...

Well, let me just say this, who ever is responsible for 'nickin' your money better leave town matey, If they don't pay up,...know what i mean?

I mean, they don't want to be gettin' tied up and dangled over the Thames, for a poxy few k.


Remember, splorff!

Write a silly thread, get silly replies!

EASY!

 

[MarvinS]

Stop using Finspreads/city index and use WorldSpreads - from an outsiders point of view you get more reliable prices and narrower spreads.

 

[philhackett]

1) Always trade with a guaranteed stop

2) Contact the FSA and log a complaint. Deal for Free used to operate like Finspreads

Today I decided I was never again going to use Finspreads. I went long at about 12430. I don't use stops as I prefer to just watch whats happening with a book for company. It was going well about 27 points in my favour. Things then started to change for the worse. It started to nosedive. I hung on but was getting concerned. Suddenly The screen was no longer live, with no fresh updating. I didn't know where I was.

I turned the computer off, as I must to use the telephone. I called Finspreads. They must have been busy, as it was a while before I got an answer. I told the lady what was happening. Another wait, while she connects me to a dealer. Again I tell him what is going on. I am told that the server is down. Politely enough I told him what I thought of the service. The line then becomes dead.

I ring them again and got through the whole thing again. Then I'm talking to a dealer again. Yes the server is down he tells me. What about my bet I tell him. I havn't a clue whats going on, and I am long £100 per point on the Dow.

He wants my account number, post code etc. Eventually I discover I am nearly £4 K out of pocket. I get him to close the bet. As there is no point leaving it run as I cannot see what the hell is happening, and it could easily get worse.

Finspreads have a spread of 6 points. Therefore I placed £600 in their hand that day. Thats a tidy sum of money considering the little they do. I think the service considering its cost, is really crap. Servers- whatever they are, should not be going down or anywhere else for that price.

It really is just not good enough. To cap it all the Dow closed at 12480. I would have made 50 points 50 X100 = £5000. So, Ive lost about £9k all in.

The previous week while in a bet, they did the same thing -down server. Then I gave them the benefit of the doubt. Once yes, but not twice. Good bye Finspreads.

* IF YOU ARE A UK BASED SOLICITOR WITH AN INTEREST IN SPREAD BETTING / TRADING i WISH TO SPEAK TO YOU.*

 

[milt]

if you're trading that sort of bet size, you should really be looking into trading with direct-access spreadbet since at least you are then dealing directly on the underlying futures market and not having to fart about with the SB firms pony synthetic market.

check out www.twowayfutures.com

Were you betting on the daily dow, or the dow future?

Thanks for the link.I had a look at this outfit and it seems ok but after delving a bit deeper into their site and clicking through to twowayspreads.com it transpires they use Finspreads for their "platform & back office".....hmmm!

 

[Jack o'Clubs]

Thanks for the link.I had a look at this outfit and it seems ok but after delving a bit deeper into their site and clicking through to twowayspreads.com it transpires they use Finspreads for their "platform & back office".....hmmm!

you need to look at futuresbetting.com which is their futures side and operates completely differently. As far as I can tell TwoWayFutures is an agent for futuresbetting in the UK - I'm an FB client and don't quite understand the relationship... but anyway FB is the one you need to be looking at for a different way of doing things... I think the recommendation to splorff was on the back of his trading of Dow index futures - he'd be better off through FB. Presumably to offer 'full-service' twowayfutures then have a white-label relationship with Finspreads for stock bets.

 

[Splitlink]

you need to look at futuresbetting.com which is their futures side and operates completely differently. As far as I can tell TwoWayFutures is an agent for futuresbetting in the UK - I'm an FB client and don't quite understand the relationship... but anyway FB is the one you need to be looking at for a different way of doing things... I think the recommendation to splorff was on the back of his trading of Dow index futures - he'd be better off through FB. Presumably to offer 'full-service' twowayfutures then have a white-label relationship with Finspreads for stock bets.

If I was trading with a spreadbetting company and betting the amounts that Splorff bets, I would not change to another spreadbetting firm. I'd make a clean break and go to a broker.. The spreads are closer-everything is cheaper, but you pay tax. Well, you have to make money to pay tax, anyway, so if you lose a spreadbet that advantage has gone, regardless. Lose to a broker and you knock the loss off your winnings at the end of the year. In any case, you have to make 8000 pounds before you have to pay it, so make that much before worrying about it.

My advice is, if he leaves Fins he should move to a broker unless he intends to reduce his stake size.

Split