Full time trading does it really pay

[Black Swan]

Howard, Fayalac, how and why guys manage to get embroiled in the situation you currently find yourself in (on this and other threads) always baffles me. ..as you were...

 

[HowardCohodas]

Howard, Fayalac, how and why guys manage to get embroiled in the situation you currently find yourself in (on this and other threads) always baffles me. ..as you were...

I'll ask my shrink the next time I see her.

Meanwhile, DT has won again, because I withdraw when he transitions from deceptions to falsehoods. On ne s'attaque pas à un plus fort que soi.

 

[brettus]

I'll ask my shrink the next time I see her.

Meanwhile, DT has won again, because I withdraw when he transitions from deceptions to falsehoods. On ne s'attaque pas à un plus fort que soi.

I can understand why you want to do things differently. You want to be unique with your spanish stops, credit spreads, options and iron condors. That's fair enough i get that, but when you're calculating risk and return, that isn't up for debate how we calculate it. It is simply a fixed amount or percentage that you are risking or potentially gaining on your account cash balance.

If i buy one contract of the March FTSE at 6000, with no stops. I am risking £60,000. If my account balance is £100,000, then i am risking 60% of my account.

 

[forker]

There is one way to settle this. Ask him to show copies of his account\transactions...

 

[Splitlink]

I can understand why you want to do things differently. You want to be unique with your spanish stops, credit spreads, options and iron condors. That's fair enough i get that, but when you're calculating risk and return, that isn't up for debate how we calculate it. It is simply a fixed amount or percentage that you are risking or potentially gaining on your account cash balance.

If i buy one contract of the March FTSE at 6000, with no stops. I am risking £60,000. If my account balance is £100,000, then i am risking 60% of my account.

Even that is a bit elastic, although I agree with you, in general. My question is "Is risk limited to your account?" This is a rhetorical question, that only the person asking himself can answer but I agree with you that those attempting to show others how to trade should not minimise the risks involved simply to make their own trading style seem easy.

Some posters do try to make everything so easy when it is very complicated and the only uncomplicated thing about it is pressing the button. After that, you are on your own.

 

[brettus]

Even that is a bit elastic, although I agree with you, in general. My question is "Is risk limited to your account?" This is a rhetorical question, that only the person asking himself can answer but I agree with you that those attempting to show others how to trade should not minimise the risks involved simply to make their own trading style seem easy.

Some posters do try to make everything so easy when it is very complicated and the only uncomplicated thing about it is pressing the button. After that, you are on your own.

Look. Risk is limited to your account balance. Yes it is. But how we normalize the risk/return model is by saying. I'm risking 0.3% to make 1%, and my average monthly return is say 5%. You could easily say that if you were to risk 1.8% to make 6%, i would make a monthly return of 30%. I think it's called Risk-adjusted rate of return, which effectively takes into account what you are risking for what return.

The problem is. We were just asking Howard and the Mexican, how much do they risk on any individual trade as a percentage of their account and they couldn't answer it, so it leaves us with some doubts about anything they say, especially as the Mexican guy doesn't even have a Scooby Doo what Risk is.

Even if i ask a stupid prop trader. They could at least tell me they do not lose more than 2k on a single trade, and we could go from there.

 

[DionysusToast]

I agree SL - there's always leeway. Then there's those that just give ridiculous numbers.

This style of trading is a recurring theme here. What we see are lots of big numbers followed by a lot of "you don't deserve to know how I do it".

Is it attention seeking or is it PM seeking with a view to extracting $$$ from the uninitiated?

 

[BSD]

The problem is. We were just asking Howard and the Mexican, how much do they risk on any individual trade as a percentage of their account and they couldn't answer it, so it leaves us with some doubts about anything they say, especially as the Mexican guy doesn't even have a Scooby Doo what Risk is.

Been totally missing out on the fun, don't know those guys at all, never read anything from em, but that's just ludicrous, not getting what you're risking.

NOT rocket science lol !

 

[HowardCohodas]

I can understand why you want to do things differently. You want to be unique with your spanish stops, credit spreads, options and iron condors. That's fair enough i get that, but when you're calculating risk and return, that isn't up for debate how we calculate it. It is simply a fixed amount or percentage that you are risking or potentially gaining on your account cash balance.

If i buy one contract of the March FTSE at 6000, with no stops. I am risking £60,000. If my account balance is £100,000, then i am risking 60% of my account.

I always have agreed with your example account-risk calculation.

 

[HowardCohodas]

Look. Risk is limited to your account balance. Yes it is. But how we normalize the risk/return model is by saying. I'm risking 0.3% to make 1%, and my average monthly return is say 5%. You could easily say that if you were to risk 1.8% to make 6%, i would make a monthly return of 30%. I think it's called Risk-adjusted rate of return, which effectively takes into account what you are risking for what return.

The problem is. We were just asking Howard and the Mexican, how much do they risk on any individual trade as a percentage of their account and they couldn't answer it, so it leaves us with some doubts about anything they say, especially as the Mexican guy doesn't even have a Scooby Doo what Risk is.

Couldn't is very different than stating that it was not the focus of my thread. I wrote that I wanted to keep money management a minor, not major part of the discussion.

Even if i ask a stupid prop trader. They could at least tell me they do not lose more than 2k on a single trade, and we could go from there.

I did that. Several times. Perhaps you missed it.

 

[meanreversion]

I can understand why you want to do things differently. You want to be unique with your spanish stops, credit spreads, options and iron condors. That's fair enough i get that, but when you're calculating risk and return, that isn't up for debate how we calculate it. It is simply a fixed amount or percentage that you are risking or potentially gaining on your account cash balance.

If i buy one contract of the March FTSE at 6000, with no stops. I am risking £60,000. If my account balance is £100,000, then i am risking 60% of my account.

You're using too many numbers. Maybe trading is mathematical and scientific for you, but for others it's more like art.

In seriousness, even those who trade without stops actually DO have stops, e.g. 20% of account. I have to say, if I was looking to invest in a trader and it took me more than 3 minutes to work out how much of his account he risked per trade, I'd walk out.

After a few days it's still not clear how much fayalac is risking, and it took a week or two with Howard (who repeatedly refused to reveal the number, because his thread was "nothing to do with money management").

 

[DionysusToast]

I have to say, if I was looking to invest in a trader and it took me more than 3 minutes to work out how much of his account he risked per trade, I'd walk out.

Totally agree. Trading just isn't that complex that something like this would take more than a single paragraph to explain. Of course, it takes PAGES to try to avoid explaining.

 

[Pazienza]

You're using too many numbers. Maybe trading is mathematical and scientific for you, but for others it's more like art.

For me it's more of a reggae jazz dance fusion.

In seriousness, even those who trade without stops actually DO have stops, e.g. 20% of account. I have to say, if I was looking to invest in a trader and it took me more than 3 minutes to work out how much of his account he risked per trade, I'd walk out.

Yep.

 

[meanreversion]

The return of a strategy is of no meaning without knowing the likely drawdown (or volatility of returns).

Drawdown (or volatility of returns) has no meaning unless it relates to a percentage of trading account.

Thus return (and by extension, the stake size) also needs to relate to a percentage of trading account.

I challenge anyone to argue with this logic.

 

[Pazienza]

Anton Kreil (CEO Institute of Trading and Portfolio Management, BBC2's "Million Dollar Traders") offers you the opportunity to “Trade Your Way To Financial Freedom.”

That's great. Can I also add "WTF?", and ask you not to spam threads with bullsh1t of this nature?

 

[meanreversion]

The stupid pr1ck is all over t2w. Spam attack.. !!

 

[Pazienza]

The stupid pr1ck is all over t2w. Spam attack.. !!

If there was any doubt that it was utter bullsh1t, watch the video. Hilarious!

 

[meanreversion]

The guy has made 100 times more than any of you bullsh1t traders put together, and is offering his help to those of you that aren't succeeding. If you aren't interested then just ignore it but others may be.

You're a silver tongued charmer aren't you? I'm definitely interested in his course now.

 

[meanreversion]

Looks like willyboy's time on t2w is limited. Shame, I was really warming to him.

 

[BSD]

The guy has made 100 times more than any of you bullsh1t traders put together, and is offering his help to those of you that aren't succeeding. If you aren't interested then just ignore it but others may be.

Crikey I seem to be missing more here recently than I'm getting haha.



Whozzat guy, does he have an independetly audited track record ?

And oh yeah whatssup with fat Germans ??

(Says one very Skinny like a Rockstar German here !!!)

:idea: