Diary of a swing spread better

[Splitlink]

I share your pain. I hope your stake was small enough. What about your stop loss?!

I'm one of those peculiar guys who don't use them until I'm in profit. I don't like getting spiked out. Up until now I have not come to serious harm but this one was a big 'un, I must admit., although I have been warned! I'm not sure whether a stop would have saved me under those circumstances- it happened at night and gapped down on the open.

Split

 

[pboi]

man I hate the opens..they are a major cause of my trading woes...I was thinking of lining up trades and only putting on a stop loss after the morning spikes.

 

[hungvir]

... I'm not sure whether a stop would have saved me under those circumstances- it happened at night and gapped down on the open.

Split

That's very true. But if it is just a one off for you, it was not too bad, I suppose. Presumably, you've closed the position?!

best,

Hung

 

[hungvir]

man I hate the opens..they are a major cause of my trading woes...I was thinking of lining up trades and only putting on a stop loss after the morning spikes.

Or may be you would be better off looking for stocks that don't give you that kind of woes?!

 

[Splitlink]

Fins have pleasantly surprised me with spikes, sometimes. I have to pack trading up at lunchtime as I have to be somewhere else. I have come home at night, seen a spike on the chart, gone to Fins site and found that I am still in the trade. Don't know why that is (and it doesn't, always, happen like that).

Split

 

[Splitlink]

That's very true. But if it is just a one off for you, it was not too bad, I suppose. Presumably, you've closed the position?!

best,

Hung

Well, pride got damaged I can see that it was a shorter (now, after the event , but it raises the point that you must watch your cheap shares closely if you are thinking of making a quick profit going long for a rise. This fall was due to management decision not to sell a branch of their business- I doubt whether anyone could have seen it coming.

Yes, I watched it for a couple of hours and then closed it.

Split

 

[pboi]

I trade indices, spread bet . FTSE, DAX and DOW..and I am still learning how best to tackle them. My best idea was to trade futures, to reduce volatility fo the spike...but I postd hered about futures, nobody replied. SO I am trading blind atm ( fake money)
my system is based on trends, so if the market is unstable ( like 2 weeks ago) i get messed up ..the rest of the time, it works quite well.

i tend to my figures at 10 every night, then place my SB orders for the next day.

 

[hungvir]

Well, pride got damaged I can see that it was a shorter (now, after the event , but it raises the point that you must watch your cheap shares closely if you are thinking of making a quick profit going long for a rise. This fall was due to management decision not to sell a branch of their business- I doubt whether anyone could have seen it coming.

Yes, I watched it for a couple of hours and then closed it.

Split

I hope another good trade will make good the pride damage. Do you like reading the Daily Mail?! There's always that risk when you hold positions overnight, isn't there.

 

[hungvir]

I trade indices, spread bet . FTSE, DAX and DOW..and I am still learning how best to tackle them. My best idea was to trade futures, to reduce volatility fo the spike...but I postd hered about futures, nobody replied. SO I am trading blind atm ( fake money)
my system is based on trends, so if the market is unstable ( like 2 weeks ago) i get messed up ..the rest of the time, it works quite well.

i tend to my figures at 10 every night, then place my SB orders for the next day.

If I may, I would recommend you take Finspreads' 1p per point offer for the first eight weeks. That may be better than paper trading.

 

[Splitlink]

I trade indices, spread bet . FTSE, DAX and DOW..and I am still learning how best to tackle them. My best idea was to trade futures, to reduce volatility fo the spike...but I postd hered about futures, nobody replied. SO I am trading blind atm ( fake money)
my system is based on trends, so if the market is unstable ( like 2 weeks ago) i get messed up ..the rest of the time, it works quite well.

i tend to my figures at 10 every night, then place my SB orders for the next day.

Hi phoi,

Just seen your post but have to go so this is quick. You mentioned futures. I don't like them because I can't tell how the price is made up between "time" and "bias" Bias is something peculiar to bookies, in a nutshell it is their odds. I can figure it out better if I use the rolling bet, as there is no time value on it. I have heard that rolling bets are competitive with a future for up until nine days, then it is better to have a future, but I figure that it is better to know more about
what the bias is before entering a trade.

Talk again later (tomorrow)?

Regards Split

 

[pboi]

Interesting points. At the moment I am using Capital Spreads..and dont have a problem with them The plan is to hold a trend for circa 4 days, and if the trend continues, move stop loss accordingly to lock in some profit. Maybe I will hold the rolling daily and take the fiscal hit.


I have been doing intraday trading before using figures I have made from previous days numbers..and in my first 6 weeks or so, pulled in +200 points..soon as I start trading with real money, I lost a lot. The markets were messed up and the trends just werent there. It was volatile..and I got to thinking about rather than looking at getting in and out, 10-20 points a day, I would make a trade on the trend change, and hold it while I deemed the trend to be continuing....

still need to practice before I do it for real, losing 1/3 of my hard earned pot has really messed me up psycologically.

all being well, the sell indicator i just got on the S&P will be a proper downtrend and the experiment gets off to a good start...of course if it bounces back up, I am screwed

 

[hungvir]

... The plan is to hold a trend for circa 4 days, and if the trend continues, move stop loss accordingly to lock in some profit.

Sounds like a good strategy. I would close half of a position if it moves 150 points or so in my favour.

It seems like you've been taking too much risk too soon with real money if you've lost a third of your capital. But aren't we advised to be sanguine about both profit and loss?!

Cheers,

Hung

 

[pboi]

the problem was, around 2 weeks ago, there were 3 or so trend changes in one week..looking back, the markets were ferked..and it was the week i started trading.

I never realised how psychologial trading is...where I sit now, I would rather not risk trading again - just incase I lose it all...but then thinking like that I will never gain money either :/ So I am building my confidence back up with fake money.

btw I know very very little about trading, and only know what I have seen when pratcticing with figures..I am very very new to it all. In october I didnt know what the FTSE was at all.

 

[hungvir]

the problem was, around 2 weeks ago, there were 3 or so trend changes in one week..looking back, the markets were ferked..and it was the week i started trading.

I never realised how psychologial trading is...where I sit now, I would rather not risk trading again - just incase I lose it all...but then thinking like that I will never gain money either :/ So I am building my confidence back up with fake money.

btw I know very very little about trading, and only know what I have seen when pratcticing with figures..I am very very new to it all. In october I didnt know what the FTSE was at all.

A hug to you, Pboi.

There can't possibly be three trend changes in one single week. I would think it's just the nature of the market to move that way even if it's in an up trend like it is now.

If you like swing trading, I strongly recommend 'Marc Rivalland on Swing Trading' book. It's really simple, you don't event need a software package.

What he says basically is you look at the chart and decide if the market is trending up/down or going sideways. In an uptrend, wait for three days with lower highs and lower lows then buy when it breaches one of those highs, or the most recent high if there're more than three down days. The reverse is applied in a down trend.

All the best,

Hung

 

[Effkay]

do you stick to his take profit rules?

I find that every seems to concentrate on entry yet no one mentions exit! How do you exit your trades?

Any comments will be helpful to all i imagine!

Thanks

 

[pboi]

I kind of do the same thing..except I take the data over 5 days.

2 weeks ago I got indicators of the market going up, down and even stalling at the same level. It was crazy!

I will definately read the book.


now I need to decide if I trade intraday, taking H4 breakout figures and trying to grab 10 points..of if I trade a rolling daily on a trend change, over 4 days, trying to lock in profits as I go on...or I could do both I guess. I personally aim for 5-10 points profit on one trade in the day during a trend, and when a trend change occurs I aim for 20 point profit on the day.

then I have the issue of how best to avoid the spikes.



Thanks for your wisdom, I value it all so much.

Mat

 

[eddyjo]

Hi Splitlink, Were the 'Tankers' "In Flight Refuellers" by any chance?
Quote:
I've been to Saigon and Haiphong. Were you born then? The French were there. Tankers, 1953-1961. Mooochas problemas!

Now I'm in Spain.

 

[hungvir]

do you stick to his take profit rules?

I find that every seems to concentrate on entry yet no one mentions exit! How do you exit your trades?

Any comments will be helpful to all i imagine!

Thanks

To be honest, I just came back to the market after pulling all money I have to buy a house some three years ago.

But Marc said you can only make a lot of money in 'linear phase' like the one you're seeing now and preserving your capital when it doesn't move much. It's obvious if you look at the FTSE charts that it makes higher lows as it moves on. I would trail my stop along with those lows.

I do think it's sensible to realise half of the profit if you sit on about 150-200 point winning position.

Cheers,

Hung

 

[hungvir]

I kind of do the same thing..except I take the data over 5 days.

2 weeks ago I got indicators of the market going up, down and even stalling at the same level. It was crazy!

I will definately read the book.


now I need to decide if I trade intraday, taking H4 breakout figures and trying to grab 10 points..of if I trade a rolling daily on a trend change, over 4 days, trying to lock in profits as I go on...or I could do both I guess. I personally aim for 5-10 points profit on one trade in the day during a trend, and when a trend change occurs I aim for 20 point profit on the day.

then I have the issue of how best to avoid the spikes.



Thanks for your wisdom, I value it all so much.

Mat

You're very welcome, Mat. I salute your experimenting spirit! But when you decide to make something your trading method, make sure that it stands the test of time. Not days or weeks but months and years.

For your loss, consider it a fee to the Stock Market University Then may be you'll feel a bit better.

Best,

Hung

 

[hungvir]

No chance to catch the train

I am waiting for these guys to dip to go long but it looks like I'll have to stay in the waiting room for quite a while. Don't dare to jump on because I have no where to place my stop loss.