Cutting Losses Early

[firewalker99]

All this talk about the past... but where would one go if he were interested in studying intraday charts from say 5 or 10 years ago?

 

[Rhody Trader]

All this talk about the past... but where would one go if he were interested in studying intraday charts from say 5 or 10 years ago?

To the data vendor of your choice with credit card in-hand. :cheesy:

 

[firewalker99]

To the data vendor of your choice with credit card in-hand. :cheesy:

On a more serious note, anybody know any good books who deal with the "market's history"? I don't mean real study or TA books, but just in the general sense a proper description of the bull & bear markets we've been through and the comparative economic conditions.

 

[dbphoenix]

I suggest you read those who were there: Wyckoff, Schabacker, Edwards, Magee, Neill, Graham, Loeb. Hindsight often provides perspective, but there's no substitute for the living through it.

 

[Rhody Trader]

The interviews in the Market Wizards books also have bits of history built into them. Many of the original Wizards got their starts in the 70s (or earlier) and there's definitely a lot of talk in that first book about the Crash.

 

[rathcoole_exile]

This is basically a contradiction. If scaling out at certain points is not part of a trading system then doing that sort of thing is by definition of overriding the exit signal. Newbies' biggest problems are often failing to stick to their system. You're encouraging them to do exactly the thing which messes them up.



I don't agree with that at all. If your trading system includes the determination and use of targets, then fine. For those using systems which do not include determination of specific targets, though, identifying them just suggests a lack of faith in and/or understanding of what the system is meant to accomplish.

is your name Hansel or Gretl ? 'cos you've completely lost yourself if you think this is the right place for this sort of discussion. take a deep breath and take a look at the title of this forum. this is First Steps for Newbies. everything I have written has been in that vain, trying to help along our newer brethren. On the other hand, there seems to be a concerted multiple-thread "let's have a pop at r_e week"
Are you a) interested in trying to disseminate, in small, easy to digest chunks, essential lessons from your own trading experience so that Newbies can benefit or b) interested in a clash of egos between you and me. Cos frankly 1) you're in the wrong place and 2) i dont give a ****

And 3) i took a New Years Resolution, which up until now I've kept, to be try to be more helpful and accommodating to newer traders. Hence far more time spent on these general/newbie threads than in previous times. Up until now, you're the only negative I've come across in my new found enlightened lease of life as r_e the nice guy.

 

[firewalker99]

is your name Hansel or Gretl ? 'cos you've completely lost yourself if you think this is the right place for this sort of discussion. take a deep breath and take a look at the title of this forum. this is First Steps for Newbies. everything I have written has been in that vain, trying to help along our newer brethren. On the other hand, there seems to be a concerted multiple-thread "let's have a pop at r_e week"
Are you a) interested in trying to disseminate, in small, easy to digest chunks, essential lessons from your own trading experience so that Newbies can benefit or b) interested in a clash of egos between you and me. Cos frankly 1) you're in the wrong place and 2) i dont give a ****

And 3) i took a New Years Resolution, which up until now I've kept, to be try to be more helpful and accommodating to newer traders. Hence far more time spent on these general/newbie threads than in previous times. Up until now, you're the only negative I've come across in my new found enlightened lease of life as r_e the nice guy.
You want me to go back to the old r_e and start ripping pricks like you to shreds then, game on baby .....

Not to get in between things here, but I've always found yours and Rhody's comments interesting and replies to newbies have always been appropriate and courteous to my knowledge. Please don't make this into a personal match,... and don't throw any chairs at me now for having said this!

 

[dbphoenix]

The interviews in the Market Wizards books also have bits of history built into them. Many of the original Wizards got their starts in the 70s (or earlier) and there's definitely a lot of talk in that first book about the Crash.

The 70s are history? You sure know how to make a guy feel old . . .

 

[rathcoole_exile]

Not to get in between things here, but I've always found yours and Rhody's comments interesting and replies to newbies have always been appropriate and courteous to my knowledge. Please don't make this into a personal match,... and don't throw any chairs at me now for having said this!

well he started it !! (pout pout pout) :innocent:

 

[Rhody Trader]

is your name Hansel or Gretl ? 'cos you've completely lost yourself if you think this is the right place for this sort of discussion. take a deep breath and take a look at the title of this forum. this is First Steps for Newbies. everything I have written has been in that vain, trying to help along our newer brethren. On the other hand, there seems to be a concerted multiple-thread "let's have a pop at r_e week"
Are you a) interested in trying to disseminate, in small, easy to digest chunks, essential lessons from your own trading experience so that Newbies can benefit or b) interested in a clash of egos between you and me. Cos frankly 1) you're in the wrong place and 2) i dont give a ****

And 3) i took a New Years Resolution, which up until now I've kept, to be try to be more helpful and accommodating to newer traders. Hence far more time spent on these general/newbie threads than in previous times. Up until now, you're the only negative I've come across in my new found enlightened lease of life as r_e the nice guy.
You want me to go back to the old r_e and start ripping pricks like you to shreds then, game on baby .....

Well, I wasn't confused before, but now I am.

Since you ask the question, I am interested in a), while b) doesn't interest me in the least. I'm sorry if you have taken my disagreement with your opinion - and that's all it was - as some kind of personal attack. I think you're wrong and I said so. Full stop, the end. No pissing contest. No ego battles. As far as I'm aware, we don't know each other, so there's no personal element to it at all.

 

[rathcoole_exile]

Well, I wasn't confused before, but now I am.

Since you ask the question, I am interested in a), while b) doesn't interest me in the least. I'm sorry if you have taken my disagreement with your opinion - and that's all it was - as some kind of personal attack. I think you're wrong and I said so. Full stop, the end. No pissing contest. No ego battles. As far as I'm aware, we don't know each other, so there's no personal element to it at all.

confused ? of course. you're from Mass. You can't work out why your passport says "American" when you're quite patently British

 

[Rhody Trader]

confused ? of course. you're from Mass. You can't work out why your passport says "American" when you're quite patently British

Wow! Those trips to London in 1997 and 2000 must have left more of a mark on me than I realized. And here I've been thinking about moving to Southern California. Clearly I should reconsider and head across the pond.

 

[rathcoole_exile]

Wow! Those trips to London in 1997 and 2000 must have left more of a mark on me than I realized. And here I've been thinking about moving to Southern California. Clearly I should reconsider and head across the pond.

don't bother mate, to be honest, it's a hole.

Until the newly elected Independent Prime Minister, Richard Branson, takes office :clap:

 

[businessman]

What did I do wrong?

I bought Platinum at 1700 (using a trend following strategy) and was thrilled with the run I had in the last week . Having had a bad experience on a previous trade (I exited a trade too early, then got in at a higher price and watched the market plummet to my stop loss), I was determined not to loose the big move so kept increasing my stop loss on a daily basis (even though I do my entry analysis once a week). My stop loss was 1899 and to my abject horror it was triggered this morning. However as the spread expanded, I did not get the opportunity to buy it back at a lower price because the buy price never came down. Since then I have watched with a lot of pain the price of platinum retrace it's losses and go into positive territory. Should I have reduced the stop loss because the spread increased? Should I have bought it back when I found the stop loss was incorrect? Or did I do the right thing by doing nothing and just move on to the next deal when I do my weekly analysis?

Your views would be highly appreciated.

 

[dbphoenix]

I bought Platinum at 1700 (using a trend following strategy) and was thrilled with the run I had in the last week . Having had a bad experience on a previous trade (I exited a trade too early, then got in at a higher price and watched the market plummet to my stop loss), I was determined not to loose the big move so kept increasing my stop loss on a daily basis (even though I do my entry analysis once a week). My stop loss was 1899 and to my abject horror it was triggered this morning. However as the spread expanded, I did not get the opportunity to buy it back at a lower price because the buy price never came down. Since then I have watched with a lot of pain the price of platinum retrace it's losses and go into positive territory. Should I have reduced the stop loss because the spread increased? Should I have bought it back when I found the stop loss was incorrect? Or did I do the right thing by doing nothing and just move on to the next deal when I do my weekly analysis?

Your views would be highly appreciated.

If you've been using a trend-following strategy, it's not a very good one. In your eagerness to squeeze every last cent of the trade, you wound up shooting yourself in the foot, and after all this time, you really ought to know better.

Why such a tight stop? Platinum hasn't even made a lower low, much less a retracement. Did you have a written-out trading plan, or did you manage the trade based on fear?

 

[businessman]

Why such a tight stop? Platinum hasn't even made a lower low, much less a retracement. Did you have a written-out trading plan, or did you manage the trade based on fear?

It was a trailing stop supposed to protect my gains from evaporating! I haven't mastered stop losses yet which was the reason for my post. I was actually watching the price fall but thought I was being disciplined by not changing my stop.

 

[Rhody Trader]

It was a trailing stop supposed to protect my gains from evaporating! I haven't mastered stop losses yet which was the reason for my post. I was actually watching the price fall but thought I was being disciplined by not changing my stop.

If you are using a trend following system then you need your exit strategy to be based on trends. That means you don't get out until the trend is over. Your exit strategy must define when the trend is over - or at least it's very like so - and incorporate that into a trailing stop or stop/reverse or whatever.

 

[dbphoenix]

It was a trailing stop supposed to protect my gains from evaporating! I haven't mastered stop losses yet which was the reason for my post. I was actually watching the price fall but thought I was being disciplined by not changing my stop.

Price, however, hadn't even dropped below the low of the last bar since last week, and even then it hadn't broken the trendline, much less reversed the trend. You're not trading trend; you're trading scared. What exactly is the "trend-following strategy" that you're following?

 

[Crap Buddist]

This is ground control to Major Tom....

Having had a bad experience on a previous trade (I exited a trade too early, then got in at a higher price and watched the market plummet to my stop loss), I was determined not to loose the big move so kept increasing my stop loss on a daily basis (even though I do my entry analysis once a week). My stop loss was 1899 and to my abject horror it was triggered this morning.




However as the spread expanded, I did not get the opportunity to buy it back at a lower price because the buy price never came down. Since then I have watched with a lot of pain the price of platinum retrace it's losses and go into positive territory. Should I have reduced the stop loss because the spread increased? Should I have bought it back when I found the stop loss was incorrect? Or did I do the right thing by doing nothing and just move on to the next deal when I do my weekly analysis?

Your views would be highly appreciated.

You have used a stop order to exit a long position, the markets position is what ? still long ? why should you stop the position? What youve done is Cut Profits early...

Personally I do think trend traders will find trailing stops useful as a functional decision making process for monitoring trends,with the idea that this will enable them to exit positions effectivley.

What the hell am I saying.... ?? ahhh yes....

Trend in Trend out. Its as natural as breathing air on Earth ,only traders start off from Mars.

Enjoy the trip....

You had no need to do anything with cutting losses as thats not the position is it ? youve tampered with the profits, youve peaked too soon.... what about tantric staying power ?

Maybe start a thread called Cutting profits too soon How I watched Platinum rocket without me onboard

Trend In Trend Out

Trend In Trend Out

Trend in Trend Out

 

[dbphoenix]

Perhaps there's some confusion over trading trend over trading momentum.

What is wrong with this picture?

(Platinum)

.