Capital Spreads: Outright Thieves

[Phil Mibbutz]

I once put on an FX sell stop in on the Canadian Dollar at Capital Spreads very late at night . I happened to be awake and watching their chart. The stop was about 30 points below the market when I put the stop in. The market was virtually dead, with almost no activity. Almost as soon as the stop order was placed to sell at a price below the market, CS's price started inching down.

This was to initiate a short position, so I was out of the market at that moment. I put a contingent stop in at 40 points above the entry. So in order to get IN, the price would have to drop 30 points...and then once in, I would be stopped out if it rose 40 points. Guess what? After about 10 minutes the CS price reached EXACTLY my entry stop. Not even ONE tick lower. It then immediately reversed, and crept up EXACTLY 40 points, and I am not exagerating, not ONE point higher, hit my stop...then returned to EXACTLY where it had been before I put the stop in.

It was late at night and I happened to be watching, so I rang the trading desk, and a very surly Australian answered. I said I wanted to complain about a trade and before I even told him which one I was talking about he KNEW who it was and said very belligerently "These markets are very volatile". I guess late at night they don't have many people working so the guy may well have been the one who "executed" my trade. It's like throwing meat into a pool of sharks if you put stops in with Capital Spreads. They are after your money, and will cheat to get it from you.

Anyway, this is one small example. The odds of that happening randomly are tiny...at least by honest chance......but the times it's happened in gold are absurd.

I've never had these problems with City Index, for example. In fact City have even "let me off the hook" on stops a few times, when a stop was just briefly touched, by leaving me in the market after it made a comeback. This would be INCONCEIVABLE with Capital Spreads who are after your money with a vengeance.

If you had evidence that the quotes were being manipulated, did you put in an official complaint about this trade?

 

[Trader333]

Galtone,

Try trading using mental stops not physical ones and see if that makes any difference because it should be hugely different if you are correct.


Paul

 

[capitalspreads]

amazing

the market inched towards your order and then your stop in the middle of the night. And you were 'awake' and called us up.

We have nobody in our offices in the middle of the night. The computers run the system from 21.15 to 07.00 the next morning. Our phones go to a recorded message. He rang and spoke to an Australian (we have no Australians on our desk) Are you sure that your account is with Capital Spreads? In fact more than a couple of our competitors default to their aussi offices in the small hours so I suspect that this is a case of mistaken identity.

If he felt that our price did not reflect the 'real' market then please complain to the regulator. I can assure you that manipulating our prices would definately contravene some rule or other.

Get together your 'evidence' (please do not say things like "the probability of something happening" and try to say this is evidence, statistically speaking 100pc of people who try to use statistics to prove an argument are wrong ) and present it to the Financial Ombudsman.

Major complaints (or ones which the client will just not accept the dealers explanation) get passed to me for adjudication.. I can assure all readers of this thread that I have had no such complaint to deal with at all. I can only assume that this is a spoof complaint that does not actually exist and is merely put up to create bad PR.

Simon

 

[Greywell1]

Capital spreads

I often wonder what so called traders are really expecting.
And believe me I'm not denigrating, or belittling anyone's efforts.
I read so many 'down' posts re-guarding CS, that I really have to put my 'six penny' worth in here.
CS is a company, it has shareholders/owners/Capital investors - call them what you like.
We, you & me, are the GAMBLERS. Wrap it up any way you like, GAMBLERS we are.
We are NOT investors.
So why do we consistently demand the same treatment? Wake up!

The playing field is not level, never will be. Live with it.

Place your BET, cross your fingers, & HOPE.

 

[droogle]

Greywell,

We don't expect any treatment. Just let us bet fairly.

We are a gambler so what? Trader is gambling as well tell me the diffrence. Our so call gambler status critically define by you allow them to underhand us then? I don't see casino flip their dice or swap cards though.

 

[FXSCALPER2]

I often wonder what so called traders are really expecting.
And believe me I'm not denigrating, or belittling anyone's efforts.
I read so many 'down' posts re-guarding CS, that I really have to put my 'six penny' worth in here.
CS is a company, it has shareholders/owners/Capital investors - call them what you like.
We, you & me, are the GAMBLERS. Wrap it up any way you like, GAMBLERS we are.
We are NOT investors.
So why do we consistently demand the same treatment? Wake up!

The playing field is not level, never will be. Live with it.

Place your BET, cross your fingers, & HOPE.

Day trading with capital spreads is gambling, to be sure.

 

[TomTom]

Please remember, these are Market Makers.
Many times in the early days of SB this happened to me when stops got hit exactly to the point not one above or below. Yes this is true.
One time this happened and phoned up to ask for an explanation why i was stopped out when in fact I had a cash chat & futures chart running beside the SB platform. Indeed the market never reached the quote/price where my stops were.
The dealer was defensive when i acussed his firm of manipulation, then admitted they can skure prices/quotes when they feel its nececerry. The conversation concluded when the dealer informed me that we are a SB firm and you trade our prices and not the market prices.

SB firms are in this game to profit from every possible client, why else whould they be in business ?

Advise is to go with a Broker who has an intrest for his custermers to gain from trading so his/her commisions are healthy.

Want to trade the real market DONT TRADE WITH SB FIRMS YOU HAVE BEEN WARNED.
DONT BLAME THE SB FIRMS BLAME YOUR SELF'S

 

[capitalspreads]

droogle

on the other hand neither do you get a player in a casino saying "please ignore that card, it was obviously a spike/rogue/unfair card, give me another one and we can replay the hand"

as i have already said over and over again CS does not bias prices, never has, never will. The only things in our favour are the spread (never discount this as it is, when all is said and done, our profit margin) and the fact that, yes, we can put some clients on dealer acceptance.

Any order fill must be justified by the underlying market bid/offer (not where it trades..but the bid and offer on the exchange or relevant bank feed)

we have the same data as everyone else.. our order/trade fills can be challenged by any client. whilst everyone complains about the times they miss a trade print everyone conveniently forgets the times when they trade and the market moves in their favour over the trade action. On an exchange you would not get the deal on an SB platform you would.

Simon

 

[gle101]

and the fact that, yes, we can put some clients on dealer acceptance.
Simon

CS has been a signatory to the MiFID finacial "Best execution" directive. Segregating clients and not giving them the same trading conditions as the rest of the client base, does not comply with the spirit of the MiFID "Best execution" directive.

 

[arabianights]

Gle, being Swedish, ever been to Stockholm? And if so... ever caught any syndromes there?

 

[rwb]

droogle

on the other hand neither do you get a player in a casino saying "please ignore that card, it was obviously a spike/rogue/unfair card, give me another one and we can replay the hand"

as i have already said over and over again CS does not bias prices, never has, never will. The only things in our favour are the spread (never discount this as it is, when all is said and done, our profit margin) and the fact that, yes, we can put some clients on dealer acceptance.

Any order fill must be justified by the underlying market bid/offer (not where it trades..but the bid and offer on the exchange or relevant bank feed)

we have the same data as everyone else.. our order/trade fills can be challenged by any client. whilst everyone complains about the times they miss a trade print everyone conveniently forgets the times when they trade and the market moves in their favour over the trade action. On an exchange you would not get the deal on an SB platform you would.

Simon

Yes strange how we don't hear many stories about the bargain prices & fills that CS throws up occasionally and it happens with all SB's. I keep at least 3 SB platforms open and ready primed before any trade entry and very often one of them will give me a bargain price, might not be much but if I enter a trade and the spread is covered or in profit when price rectifies itself then it's a good fill.

Regarding galtone's experience if I see anything like that happening with any SB company then I'll jump on it and make some money from it. Perhaps galtone wasn't as awake as he thought or else he would have made some extra profit and kept quiet.

 

[gle101]

Gle, being Swedish, ever been to Stockholm? And if so... ever caught any syndromes there?

Ha ha, I understand what you mean. Yes I have been to Stockholm on numerous occasions. No I haven't caught the syndrome, but apparently it seems like some members on this forum have been struck by it.

 

[droogle]

capitalspreads,

Thank you for your explanation though I have nothing against CS as I never traded with them. I'm just pointing out to Greywell the fact that "gambler" or not we don't deserve to be underhanded.

By the way you really did your firm a favour by explaining some misunderstanding here. Personally I don't believe a cheat untill it's proven with graphs or other means here.

 

[fourheadedmoose]

Pft, you think that's bad. They have frozen me out of a market in which I'm currently holding a position. The market isn't responding and I can't even close out my position. It just says 'closed' as if the market was inactive when it most definitely is for Capitalspreads. I mean a few minutes maybe, but it's getting close to an hour now... That is absolutely shocking!!!

PS. can anyone show me how to post screenshots, because seriously, it's been over an hour. I'm going to close my account tomorrow and for those who still complain about Caapitalspreads I suggest that you do the same. There is plenty of competition out there.

 

[gooseman]

Pft, you think that's bad. They have frozen me out of a market in which I'm currently holding a position. The market isn't responding and I can't even close out my position. It just says 'closed' as if the market was inactive when it most definitely is for Capitalspreads. I mean a few minutes maybe, but it's getting close to an hour now... That is absolutely shocking!!!

PS. can anyone show me how to post screenshots, because seriously, it's been over an hour. I'm going to close my account tomorrow and for those who still complain about Caapitalspreads I suggest that you do the same. There is plenty of competition out there.

see that banana shaped object with buttons on it? Use that and it might get you out of the position.....

 

[UKtradergirl]

Pft, you think that's bad. They have frozen me out of a market in which I'm currently holding a position. The market isn't responding and I can't even close out my position. It just says 'closed' as if the market was inactive when it most definitely is for Capitalspreads. I mean a few minutes maybe, but it's getting close to an hour now... That is absolutely shocking!!!

PS. can anyone show me how to post screenshots, because seriously, it's been over an hour. I'm going to close my account tomorrow and for those who still complain about Caapitalspreads I suggest that you do the same. There is plenty of competition out there.

Take a screenshot by pressing 'printscreen', (labelled 'prtsc' on my computer!) in the top right corner of the keyboard. Then open a blank document... i use paint purely because it loads so quick and is easy to use. Click on Edit> Paste and the pic will be pasted into the document. Save it. Ready to post.

 

[gle101]

Pft, you think that's bad. They have frozen me out of a market in which I'm currently holding a position. The market isn't responding and I can't even close out my position. It just says 'closed' as if the market was inactive when it most definitely is for Capitalspreads. I mean a few minutes maybe, but it's getting close to an hour now... That is absolutely shocking!!!

PS. can anyone show me how to post screenshots, because seriously, it's been over an hour. I'm going to close my account tomorrow and for those who still complain about Caapitalspreads I suggest that you do the same. There is plenty of competition out there.

One thing is for sure, any thing can go wrong while trading the markets. Be sure to have an alternative SB up and running, so you can hedge your position immediately if needed. Also, an extra computer, if your ordinary computer fails. An alternative broadband connection is also required (do not count on closing your position on the phone), this is important in order to be on the safe side if your current connection goes down. For, in the long run, it is you who is ultimately responsible for a secure and accident free trading setup.

 

[Masquerade]

I concur - thieves of the lowest order. Nothing else to add.

 

[fourheadedmoose]

Hi UKtradergirl, yes as in how do you post the screenshot onto the forum? It doesn't matter, I thought they would cover up their mistake but there's no need. It seemed to be a genuine problem therefore highlighting reliability issues perhaps. If you check the EUR/GBP forex pair you can clearly see on the 5 minute chart for the 25/11/08 that there are missing candlesticks between 4:45 and 5:45. Although the market was frozen out it was still possible to close out my position by putting in the reverse position. Although I made a profit it did cost me any extra profit that occurred during the blackout plus time lost in a trade.

Gle101 is correct, you should always have a backup computer/modem/SB account etc in case of emergencies. This doesn't just apply for spreadbetting but for genuine trading as well.

 

[Hoggums]

Technical glitches happen. That's life. I don't think there's one person here who can say they never had a problem with their trading platform whether DA or SB or whatever.

You do have a backup - as trader girl said - it's called a telephone.

Did you phone them up to close the trade? If you did and they refused/were unable - then that's a different story.