Boiler Room Scams

[maiden22]

We've noticed a shift in emphasis - it used to be on selling stock (good times, prey on greed).

Now it is on purchasing stock (bad times, prey on desperation).

The membership fee is an excellent innovation in what was in danger of becoming a moribund industry. And in fairness, £499 is pretty modest compared to the thousands that some of these people are after.

Ramsis, why restrict yourself to helping people divest themselves of valueless shares? You are needlessly shutting yourself out of a potentially huge market. In the near future there will be millions of investors desperate to shift vast quantities of worthless paper, inexplicably sometimes referred to as "gilts" . They're going to need all the help they can get!

 

[maiden22]

Hi Ramis,

If you really want to help people as you say you do, charge no upfront fees just a commission of the money received when you sell the shares

You terrible cynic Philly! This is explained in detail on the excellent website. If Ramsis were to charge a commission, he would become a stockbroker. I had no idea that it was such a simple matter, but there you are.

 

[Ph1lly]

Hi Maiden,

I prefer the word realistic.

Cheers


Phil

 

[maiden22]

Phil, have a heart. Times are tough out there. Boiler rooms can't make ends meet using traditional methods. They're just trying to move with the times . If punters are refusing to go for the old cons, what's a poor scam artist to do?

Anyone want to take bets on how long this thing will take to show up on the FSA's radar? I'm guessing 3 or 4 years .

If you've ever tried to report a scam to them, you'll know how much interest they take in these things.

 

[Ph1lly]

Hi Maiden,

I agree we should all feel sorry and do our best to help the poor scam artists in these trying times.

Cant see there being an FSA or anything like it in 3 or 4 years time, me thinks it will be like now where the Banks police themselves.

Cheers


Phil

 

[anley]

Come on Ramis, we're waiting for your comments.

Why not make fools out of us all and answer some of our questions especially who your contact person is as the FSA re your 'application'.

Prove to us that you're 100% legit and not just another scammer trying to steal money.

I'll be the first to apologise.

 

[Ph1lly]

Hi,

I'll be the 2nd

Cheers


Phil

 

[ramsis]

OK guy's, where do i start. we'll the egyptian theme is simple, i'm half egyptian so there you go that answers that.

the type of applicacation is the same for all - well in fact there is 3 simple-medium and complext. my application will fall under simple on the base's that the fsa will see the company only "arranging investments"

my contact in the fsa is pointless to state purly because they wont tell you anything due to the data protection act and also that the company has not filed the application yet which i have already stated.

as for bad grammer in the website text, well, a company was employed to do the copy writting as every company does. i had it re checked and told the grammer was fine! if not then i will get it checked again if you like.

as for the fact it has taken 6 years so far..... and i must be stupid....... well lets just say im not the one who invested in these shares in the first place, im not the one who spends all day passing point less information on forums giving out the same old story about abc is scam and nothing can be done. none of you are really helping anyone apart from your selves by means of self pitty. i am sorry to say this guys but but to call me stupid when i have worked the past 6 years for all of you and the millions more is a bit of a low blow.

if you actually took just a little tie cncidering i took 6 years, you would have gone to my website and actually read the website rather then say its a con because it has grey background? (no wonder your in the situation your in if this is the kind of research you do). your shares are listed on...... well its on my websites READ IT that way you will be able to understand it better. i'll even give you a hint "micro cap" your shares are worthless because you tried to sell through your local broker and he said no he told you to try another company and they said no you then joined a forum and heard people say this and that after they done exactly the same thing as you lol and you all call me stupid and a con man?

now im not saying you are all stupid, no, you made a simple mistake like millions of others.

i can not guarantee that your shares can be sold but there maybe a chance - for example have you heard of a stock called nanoforce "NNFC" they were a stock sold through a typical boiler room which we found some one to buy. it clearly states on our website we can not guarantee your shares will be sold and it clearly states its not an over night process.

thank you maiden22 for pointing out what would be the obvious if you read the website.
1- we do not charge commission because we would be classed as a stockbroker if we did - an thats not what the company is
2- we do not charge commission because in some cases we may not be able to find a buyer for your shares and if we charged a commission and was unable to sell them then we would go bankrupt before we even start.
now you are all probably asking your selves the simplest question right now "then why am i going to pay you £499 if there is a chance you cant sell them"
the answer is simple -- we spend alot of time research your investments and try to find a buyer. we do not simply go on to a forum and wait for the next coming, some one say by gosh i actually sold my shares through this company, here are the details. nor do we just phone one or two stockbrokers and say will you buy my shares. we put a lot of work into it. HENCE ITS TAKEN 6 YEARS TO SET THIS COMPANY UP.

not many people really know how a boiler room works, not many people know how the stock its self works etc etc so its not just a simple case of let me call the police and fsa up and ask them all these what would seem to be simple questions and then ah great ive got the info i need so i'll setup a company now. these are complex investments, if you all brought microsoft, we'll ..... i wouldn't need to take 6 years to set-up a company would i.

I apologise if i have come accross as a bit abrupt but seeming how alot of people seem to like to knock some one down when they are trying to help and dont seem to understand the concept of look before you walk, i'll make it as clear as possible.

like i said i understand alot of people will be carefull seeming they have been done wrong in the past which is rightly so. but like they say..... never shoot the messenger.

and let me make one last thing very very clear "RAMSIS SECURITIES IS NOT A SCAM"

 

[ramsis]

and as i asked before if you do have any sensible feed back or suggestions that would actually be of help then please email me at [email protected].

at the end of the day i have set this company up for the benefit of all of you so i woud appreciate the feed back and suggestions

 

[ramsis]

RAMSIS SECURITIES has been " googles " i wait to see whats turns up.? RAMSIS SECURITIES
Maybe after scrutiny you will turn up as legit. ?
If you are above board, tell us here on this thread about EIUS and AUFI what you know.? both of which are pink sheets stock USA.
Do you know anyone who can give you a reference in Intersecurities and FSW europe ? -- both of which are based in Frankfurt, Germany

no i cant say of the top of my head i know these 2 stocks.. understand there are thousands of them but i will take a look for you.

as for intersecurities they are a boiler room based in barcelona but im not too sure about fsw.

understand one thing though people dont expect me to start giving you all your answers over this forum or any other. thats what the company is there for.

 

[ramsis]

The reason people find these securities hard to sell is because they are worthless. People are holding Reg. D / S or 144 paper that is in lock-up, delisted or already worthless. What are you (Ramsis Securities or anybody!) going to do to help? Turn the paper into gold? (King Ramsis Midas!)

LISTEN UP ANYBODY WITH RESTRICTED SHARES (OTC, Pink Sheets, Etc.) - The shares have been sold in a complicated manner to ensure that they will never be liquid. NEVER.

I can go into pages of legal explanation and all the intricacies involved but there is no way to produce value from paper worth $0.001. If anyone wants to send me their info. or details of their situation I would be happy to explain exactly what happened by doing an individual case study. (In my free time, free of charge with no strings attached. It is not that I have a lot of free time, but I have a solid financial and legal education and I can usually spot the "Catch" very quickly.)

I hope people stay positive and learn from their mistakes. There are still many good business people out there that are trying to do good business. You just have to learn how to do the research and do your due diligence.:smart: Good luck all!

firstly the SEC has changed the restriction period from 2 years to 6 months, but this does not matter because i am going to tell you something that i am sure you do not know.

with restricted stock you can not sell on the open market HOWEVER you can sell it privatly such as through an institution which would constitute as a pritave transaction.

if you are so educated as you claim to be within in the financial and legal world and suggest you know all about these types of investment you will know exactly in detail what a micro-cap company is and as a result to this extensive knowledge of yours you will understand that these shares are quite possibly worth more then you can actually see on their balance sheets, which is the very reason i never even look at them.

you should also know that with the company trading at the as you quated the "worthless $.001 paper" is actually the par value of the shares and is not the actual value of the company.

as for the stock being delisted, well it goes back to me researching for 6 years about all of this. in fact more then 90% of these companies are not what you would call delisted they merely change the company name and ticker symbol and your shares would then become recognised throught the new company name. it is reasons like this why in nearly all cases you never sell your shares because you nearly never know this information.

but if you read the con mans website that has alot of useless information you would actually start to understand and learn this because on the con mans use website there is links directly to the page you need to be on, not like other websites who send you to the main page of the fsa or sec for example and expect you to go through a million pages before you actually find what you are looking for. i guess this must also be classic signs of scam site.

if any of you would like some real information then please email me or if you dont want to deal with a so called con man then go to the educated kind

 

[ramsis]

Having looked at the Ramsis website, I still can't make out how it's meant to work. Is it trying to match buyers and sellers? I think that's what's called an 'exchange' and should be regulated.

Other obvious questions
Why do they need to know the price you paid for any shares, and the date you bought them?
Why is the company not registered in England and Wales, where it's soliciting business?
Why is the standard of English so poor ( Resource's is not the plural of resource)

Being charitable, it's a poorly planned and poorly executed idea, and not one I would ever trust with any investments. If this is has honestly taken six years to construct, then Ramsis must be either incompetent or stupid.

the reason we require the price you paid per share and the date you brought your shares is so we can find out where you stand now. for example as stated on our website " do not include any forward or reverse splits" this is because we will find out the exact amount of shares you now own based on a potential number of forward and reverse splits ourselves. the chances are you probably have not got an acurate figure so we will obtain it for you.

the company is registered in england and wales under the name ramsis ltd which is also disclosed that we will trade under the name ramsis securities ltd which is registered within ramsis ltd. the registration number is 6654306.

 

[ramsis]

sorry i also have a question for you ns1000, you personally state i must be incompetent or stupid taking 6 years to construct this company.

let me ask you, do you work for someone else or do you have your own business.

if you work for someone else then you have no idea what it means to start your own business.

if you have your own business then let me ask you my next question... is their a thousand other business that do the same thing as you.

now if you do have your own business then i would assume its not exactly unique in any way, by means that there is probably a thousand + business the same as yours and that you would be simply able to download a business plan from the internet and call it your own. you could also go to a business adviser if you wanted to get the most from your company and he could tell you exactly what to do because half his clients have the same business.

well not in my business is any of this possible hence it takes a while.
you also say poorly planned and poorly executed. let me know what you think my plan and execution methods exactly are.

and why is my whole websites standard of english so poor based on "resource's"

 

[experienced_it_all]

firstly the SEC has changed the restriction period from 2 years to 6 months, but this does not matter because i am going to tell you something that i am sure you do not know.

with restricted stock you can not sell on the open market HOWEVER you can sell it privatly such as through an institution which would constitute as a pritave transaction.

if you are so educated as you claim to be within in the financial and legal world and suggest you know all about these types of investment you will know exactly in detail what a micro-cap company is and as a result to this extensive knowledge of yours you will understand that these shares are quite possibly worth more then you can actually see on their balance sheets, which is the very reason i never even look at them.

you should also know that with the company trading at the as you quated the "worthless $.001 paper" is actually the par value of the shares and is not the actual value of the company.

as for the stock being delisted, well it goes back to me researching for 6 years about all of this. in fact more then 90% of these companies are not what you would call delisted they merely change the company name and ticker symbol and your shares would then become recognised throught the new company name. it is reasons like this why in nearly all cases you never sell your shares because you nearly never know this information.

but if you read the con mans website that has alot of useless information you would actually start to understand and learn this because on the con mans use website there is links directly to the page you need to be on, not like other websites who send you to the main page of the fsa or sec for example and expect you to go through a million pages before you actually find what you are looking for. i guess this must also be classic signs of scam site.

if any of you would like some real information then please email me or if you dont want to deal with a so called con man then go to the educated kind

Ramsis,

Simple, Medium or Complext?? That is a complex statement.

I understand that the shares could be Cross-Traded or Traded Privately if they had value or someone was interested in them (like in the movie "August", which also had a lot of technical flaws but that is for another conversation). But people who got "taken" and bought these restricted shares have ABSOLUTELY no buyers. Just because Microsoft gives restricted shares to their employees or Nestle is on the Pink Sheets does not mean that these shares are going to trade the same way. And they WILL NOT! These shares are set-up to blow up the price, sell under Reg. D/S/144 and then dump until the price goes down to nothing (thats why I used Par Value, which we all understand what Par Value is, which may actually be greater than the real value of the shares in this case!). When the stock gets delisted or the company delists itself, they go through a symbol change and repeat the process. The only people who will ever make money is the people behind the scam (CEO, Managers, Brokers etc.)

You are going to make money in a legitimate way using shares from a scam????

Tell me WHO is going to be the BUYER in your fantastic process??

Your information is that of an amateur. I do not have to do any research to know your a scammer. From this thread alone and your dictation I can tell you do not have any real experience and have never worked for a large brokerage or carried out any real private equity deals.

I thought your website looked pretty good. Better than mine. But the difference is my business model is feasible. Your business model is to take "Dog Sh.t" and make it edible. IT JUST WON´T FLY!

I apologize and feel really bad for you if you actually think this can work. Maybe you do not understand the technical aspect or the real situation that has occurred. In that case, I almost just hope you are a grifter!

 

[experienced_it_all]

and as i asked before if you do have any sensible feed back or suggestions that would actually be of help then please email me at [email protected].

at the end of the day i have set this company up for the benefit of all of you so i woud appreciate the feed back and suggestions

There is your first flaw in your business model. You should have set your company up to make a profit.

I have set up my own company, with a complex structure and agree with you 100% that it takes a lot longer than people realize. And my company is in a common industry. But the reason your company doesn´t exist is because the model can not work.

I would like to set up a company to buy rotten apples privately at $20 an apple and then use my inventory to sell beautiful oranges to the public at $100 an orange. Do you see why this might confuse people?

Ramsis, if you really think you have a legit business, contact me and I will explain to you why your company can not work-

(restrictions and the seals that the company itself has to lift, etc .... Do you think someone in the company is going to reach into their pocket and give you $100k of their money or do you think they will just not lift the restriction due to a technicality?? I could teach you a lot if you really think this is a legit idea.)

 

[experienced_it_all]

Ramsis,

Not one of these companies went belly-up on accident!

 

[ramsis]

Yeah Ramsis,

Simple, Medium or Complext?? That is a complex statement.

I understand that the shares could be Cross-Traded or Traded Privately if they had value or someone was interested in them (like in the movie "August", which also had a lot of technical flaws but that is for another conversation). But people who got "taken" and bought these restricted shares have ABSOLUTELY no buyers. Just because Microsoft gives restricted shares to their employees or Nestle is on the Pink Sheets does not mean that these shares are going to trade the same way. And they WILL NOT! These shares are set-up to blow up the price, sell under Reg. D/S/144 and then dump until the price goes down to nothing (thats why I used Par Value, which we all understand what Par Value is, which may actually be greater than the real value of the shares in this case!). When the stock gets delisted or the company delists itself, they go through a symbol change and repeat the process. The only people who will ever make money is the people behind the scam (CEO, Managers, Brokers etc.)

You are going to make money in a legitimate way using shares from a scam????

Tell me WHO is going to be the BUYER in your fantastic process??

Your information is that of an amateur. I do not have to do any research to know your a scammer. From this thread alone and your dictation I can tell you do not have any real experience and have never worked for a large brokerage or carried out any real private equity deals.

I thought your website looked pretty good. Better than mine. But the difference is my business model is feasible. Your business model is to take "Dog Sh.t" and make it edible. IT JUST WON´T FLY!

I apologize and feel really bad for you if you actually think this can work. Maybe you do not understand the technical aspect or the real situation that has occurred. In that case, I almost just hope you are a grifter!

thank you for your reply,


let me start by saying there is a possibilty in selling the shares, how do i know this, because its been done.
i make no statement that in every single case the shares can be sold because they cant all be sold. the only way of knowing that certain shares can not be sold is by actually doing extensive research in the company and then after all that not being able to find a buyer.
the only foundation you have to say these shares are worthless is because you look at the balance sheets - if you know as much as you claim about this sector you will know about micro-cap companies thus making you understand the balance sheets mean nothing.

to your statement "Your information is that of an amateur" not everbody is technically minded so i provide the information as a universal basis that every one can understand because alot of people who have invested through a boiler room have had no prior knowledge or experiance of investing.

before i accept any new clients i make it very clear it is unlikely they will recieve 100% of their investment back but there maybe a chance to get a large portion of it back if any.

i have worked for a few brokerage firms in the past, a couple of them large ones but that is irrelevent because they do not teach you about these types of shares.

At the end of the day it has never been one before so we can only wait to see how successful this venture really will be. However i am very confident i can help people, maybe not every single person in this situation but i will help a number of them.

i do not disregard that you may have extensive knowledge within the financial sector however the financial world is very broad and i have made this particular sector my area of advanced knowledge. i do not believe there is one thing i do not know about this sector and there is more to it then meets the eye. of course you can not expect me to poor out my knowledge of this as it would be stupid to in my postion which i am sure you can appreciate.

i would be interested to know your company website to understand what it is you do, seeming you know what it is i do and what my website is.

i can understand you as well as the many others out there have the idea that this is a scam but i can assure you it's not, and i can understand that what i am saying now may mean nothing to you but as i said this is a new company and you will all see in due course.

also if you have noticed on the website that if we are unable to liquidate your stock then it maybe possible to get legal redress which we would follow up.

the only real shame here is that here is someone trying to honestly help people and is being accussed of a scammer.

 

[experienced_it_all]

thank you for your reply,


let me start by saying there is a possibilty in selling the shares, how do i know this, because its been done.
i make no statement that in every single case the shares can be sold because they cant all be sold. the only way of knowing that certain shares can not be sold is by actually doing extensive research in the company and then after all that not being able to find a buyer.
the only foundation you have to say these shares are worthless is because you look at the balance sheets - if you know as much as you claim about this sector you will know about micro-cap companies thus making you understand the balance sheets mean nothing.

to your statement "Your information is that of an amateur" not everbody is technically minded so i provide the information as a universal basis that every one can understand because alot of people who have invested through a boiler room have had no prior knowledge or experiance of investing.

before i accept any new clients i make it very clear it is unlikely they will recieve 100% of their investment back but there maybe a chance to get a large portion of it back if any.

i have worked for a few brokerage firms in the past, a couple of them large ones but that is irrelevent because they do not teach you about these types of shares.

At the end of the day it has never been one before so we can only wait to see how successful this venture really will be. However i am very confident i can help people, maybe not every single person in this situation but i will help a number of them.

i do not disregard that you may have extensive knowledge within the financial sector however the financial world is very broad and i have made this particular sector my area of advanced knowledge. i do not believe there is one thing i do not know about this sector and there is more to it then meets the eye. of course you can not expect me to poor out my knowledge of this as it would be stupid to in my postion which i am sure you can appreciate.

i would be interested to know your company website to understand what it is you do, seeming you know what it is i do and what my website is.

i can understand you as well as the many others out there have the idea that this is a scam but i can assure you it's not, and i can understand that what i am saying now may mean nothing to you but as i said this is a new company and you will all see in due course.

also if you have noticed on the website that if we are unable to liquidate your stock then it maybe possible to get legal redress which we would follow up.

the only real shame here is that here is someone trying to honestly help people and is being accussed of a scammer.

Ramsis,

Tell me the stock you sold (symbol). That is not giving away a big secret and if your legit it should help you. It is like free advertising. Can you sell RYLP?? There is a whole thread of people on here who would be in love with you. (I know it is not possible but do you understand why it is not possible??)

I am not looking at balance sheets or Scam.com or whatever you are saying. I am familiar with the inside of the company and DILUTION. All these situations are the same - someone told people this was the next big company, the company owners had the price driven up by purchasing their own stock, people put their hard-earned money into the stock (of which only 35% or so actually went to the company because in the Subscription Agreement or Purchase Agreement this is stated in fine print - Administrative Expense and Dilution), during the restriction period the company owners dumped all of their stock (or used up all the cash) and by the time the restriction is up the company stock has less value than it costs to get the restriction removed. Then the company applies for de-listing or symbol/name change and they run the process again.

If you invest in my company tomorrow, you trade your money for equity in my company. I can do whatever I want with the cash (especially in stock with no operating agreement). If I blow all of the cash, there is nothing you can do. You signed an agreement that I or my managers control the operations of the company.

You do not tell your clients they can get 100% of their money, that is good because they can not get 1% of their money back! There are no legal measures to take because nothing illegal happened. The people who got scammed trusted what the broker told them and then they signed a contract stating that they were not approached by any broker and that they can lose 100% of the investment.

Tell us all which stock you sold and how??? Like I said, if you have Microsoft Restricted you are in good hands, if you have Royal Petroleum (RYLP.ob obb pk etc.), go ahead and frame the share certificates because they are just a form of art!

I hate to be so negative and if you are trying something legit I wish you luck. But I do know SEC Rules, Restrictive Legend, "Blank Check and Shell Company" Compliance Rules, etc. and what you are claiming is just not possible.

You are either trying to pull a fast one or you really do not understand your business.

 

[ramsis]

i thought i made it clear before as an eample of what stock had previously been sold. once again "nanoforce" "NNFC" as for how, well if i explain that then i really have been wasting my time lol with all due respect that has to be the stupidest question so far.

let me make one thing clear here everybody. do not waste your time asking me what would be trade secrets like how, to whom and what is your business module etc.if you want to take advantage of my knowledge then that is what my company is there for.

i have set up a business to help you people. just because it has never been done before does not mean it can not be done. if this was the truth then we would all still be living in the stone age.

despite any knowledge you all believe you have, let me say congratulations. no one on this planet knows everything which is the reason we all specialise in certain and specific areas. this is my area and it is in an area that has very few collegues simply because some says its impossible and they leave it at that.

theres an old saying "you can find a thousand ways for a light buld not to work, but you only need one for it to work"

i found a thousand ways for this not to work but i did not stop there, i continued untill i found the second part to this old saying " you only need one for it to work" i found it.

no matter how experianced any of you maybe within the financial services industry or how much knowledge you all may believe you have, there is always someone out their who knows something you do not. just because you do not know certain things does not mean it is not true.

i believe there is a word for this.... "ignorance"

did you know that even though boiler rooms have been in operation since the stock market began it was only up untill last year there was the first international boiler conference in london.. so what does this tell you... that the fsa and government finaly decided to pull there heads out their ****'s.... NO ..... its because things are changing and we are starting to understand it all a little better. we now understand exactly how it all works. you may think you know but believe me its not as clear cut as you may think (experianced_it_all) you may read the publications sent out by the FSA and SEC and implement your financial knowledge with it all untill you believe you now got all the answers but you dont. everything you say makes complete sense ( if i was an ameture) but its just that.. well like i said there is more to it then meets the eye.

please send your company website experianced_it_all

 

[ramsis]

oh and something illegal did happen experianced_it_all. two things in fact amongst the others.
1. these shares were mis-sold (this is illegal)
2. the company who sold you the shares needed to be regulated by someone and if they weren't then its mis-representation (this is illegal)

oh and by the way i am assuming you never brought these types of shares before simply because no one ever signs anything from a boiler room. they only ever recieve a contract note from them with the bank details and the amount of shares they are purchasing and price per share and at the bottom of it there is a little disclamer which states ......

"The information provided here is based upon sources we believe to be reliable, but its accuracy cannot be guaranteed. Recommendations are given in good faith but without legal responsibility and are subject to change without notice. These shares carry a high degree of risk and are only suitable for institutional, sophisticated or high net worth investors. You should only make investments in these shares if you can afford partial or complete capital loss. Investors should be aware that past performance is not necessarily a guide to the future and that the price of shares, and the income derived from them, may fall as well as rise and the amount realised may be less than the original sum. ABC Limited takes no responsibility for offshore introductions and realises some clients may have been introduced by offshore (non UK regulated companies) Receipt of payment confirms you as a willing buyer."

now you maybe saying to your self right now "well look its right there, this is the contract, there signiture is the transfer of funds" well.. yes your correct, but this contract is immediatly void on the bases the company does know about the accuracy and beside from it all the contract note does not give any information about the investment so the disclamer actually refers to nothing on paper but shift it over to the agreement actually made over the telephone (verbal agreement) which will stand in court if no paper form of contract can be produced. now you are telling your self well wait a minute they can say what ever they want and call you (the client) a lier. again you would be correct however it is the companies legal responsibility to record telephone calls if this is there form of what would constitute as a contract. obviously they do not record their phone calls thus the company losses due to their own neglect of business practice.

i think that covers that