Are you proud to be a British citizen?

[Splitlink]

Trendie,

"For those who do not have anything good to say about the UK, why do you stay?"

In day gone by the answer to the second part of that statement was carried in the first part of the statement ....that is , if you are to fleece the sheep would you be better recommended to do so where they are uneducated and unwealthy , or uneducated ,but 'wealthy'...of course the latter is much more effective which is why we do so well with IPO's...
Not being in the shearing business any longer the answer no longer applies.

That sentence that you quoted from someone else is the sort of daft question that gets thrown from time to time to shut up the critics. The reason that people do not emigrate is because they do not want to uproot themselves from their families, or are not brave enough, or desperate enough to take the chance.

There is nothing shameful in any of that. Why should they go away if they do not want to? I went because an oportunity presented itself, frankly, to make money which was not availablr to me in the UK. Not everyone wants to. I say that because I know how difficult it would be to uproot myself from Spain, now, and return to the UK, even if I am British and I'm one who would have no language problems.

People should be able to criticise as much as they like without the "If you don't like it, shove off" type of remark that often comes forth.

Split

 

[JTrader]

In many ways, I tend to consider myself a citizen of the world rather than label myself as a Brit, and i don't tend to have stereotypical expectations of foreigners.
A nationality to me represents a place of birth, and i believe that all people tend to be more or less the same in terms of their human behaviour, values, etc. across the globe.

When I am on holiday & meet foreigners, eg. Australians, Irish & Americans, i gain the sense that they tend to be more patriotic than I am, and they perhaps tend to be more stereotypical in what they expect from an "Englishman", expressed through jokes, taking the mick etc.
Equally this can be said of many Brits in their stereotypical expectations of citizens of other countries.

I'm English, but don't take personal offence if someone from another country takes the p**s out of me for being English.
Being English is not a label I hold close to my chest.
If someone takers the p**s out of me for being a f*t b*****d or crap at golf etc. I'll take much more offence than for some streeotypical assumption made based on where i was born.
Because of all this, i shouldn't really feel any embarrassment or shame at being English. I am an individual representing me & my family, not my country.

I find that foreigners usually have positive stereotypes about Englishness - such as gentlemanly etc. which can soon turn out to be false.

 

[chump]

"patriotic "...Patriotism is what get's rolled out when reason and rational objective argument is not possible....simply yet another persuasive strategy for getting someone to do something in the knowledge that rational argument could not succeed...in other words play to the emotions when you know you cannot play to 'brain'....used to work better in the Uk..which is actually a good sign for the future

 

[JTrader]

"patriotic "...Patriotism is what get's rolled out when reason and rational objective argument is not possible....simply yet another persuasive strategy for getting someone to do something in the knowledge that rational argument could not succeed...in other words play to the emotions when you know you cannot play to 'brain'....used to work better in the Uk..which is actually a good sign for the future

I agree.

Do you apply this logic to sports also?
World cup, Olympics, etc. in the sense that we should no more want Tiger Tim to win Wimbledon, than we should want that highly talented and modest Swiss bloke to win?
I would.

In individual sporting contests, I often want the seemingly nicest person to win, and often the underdog.

In a team event, I again often favour the most sporting team, and often the underdog.

Last night watching England for example. Steven Gerrard (seems like a decent chap) plays hell with an Andorra player, claiming he'd made a meal of Gerrards tackle & was faking injury. Gerrard looked to have fouled him to me (& within 5 minutes Gerrard was diving - again!).
But I just thought to myself, Gerrard gets paid £100+k per week, and this poor chaps probably got a full-time day job, so clearly it seemed a bit unfair, as they weren't competing on an equal basis in some ways.
In fact, I would have liked Andorra to beat England, just for the novelty value.

 

[chump]

Objectively I want the player to win who provides me with most entertainment value..the latter might be flair , sheer technical brilliance ,or a combination thereof ...now what has nationality got to do with that other than nationality/patriotism get's people emotionally involved which i dare say might be be a form of entertainment ,just not one that appeals to me.
Staging events like Olympics should be an economic decision..under certain economic criteria it might make sense although if you're referring to our staging of same it doesn't...pulling the patriotic strings to sell it is where it turns to crap ,but our politicos know what a lot of their voters like.

 

[JTrader]

I'm getting slightly off track now, but RE: Olympics. They're building a dedicated 80,000 seater stadium, and once the Olympics are over, they're reducing it to 25000 capacity? How can this make any sense, economic or otherwise? What is the point? The stadium costs £500m+ gets four weeks use and then is virtually demolished?

http://www.london2012.com/en/news/archive/2005/june/2005-06-23-10-35.htm

 

[pssonice]

england here named as "Kassiteriden" was mentioned first by Aristoteles

Aristoteles got tin from england delivered by Phoenicier

Die brittischen inseln kennt Herodot unter dem namen Kassiteriden, von denen die Phoenicier das zinn holten (Herod. Thalia cap. 115). Der autor des dem Aristoteles
zugeschriebenen buches erzaehlt von der welt (cap. 3) wusste bereits, dass
jenseits der saeulen des Hercules in dem ocean zwei grosse inseln
Albion und Ierne (Erin--Irland), die britannischen genannt, jenseits
der Kelten laegen, und in dem orphischen argonautengedicht (edid.
Hermann. Lipsit¦ 1805. v. 1186) kommt die insel Iernis vor. Dieses ist
die älteste kunde von den namen dieser inseln, welche auch von Polybius
nicht vermehrt wird, indem er ebenfalls nur die britannischen inseln als
die fundorte des zinns bezeichnet.

 

[JTrader]

Aristoteles got tin from england delivered by Phoenicier

Die brittischen inseln kennt Herodot unter dem namen Kassiteriden, von denen die Phoenicier das zinn holten (Herod. Thalia cap. 115). Der autor des dem Aristoteles
zugeschriebenen buches erzaehlt von der welt (cap. 3) wusste bereits, dass
jenseits der saeulen des Hercules in dem ocean zwei grosse inseln
Albion und Ierne (Erin--Irland), die britannischen genannt, jenseits
der Kelten laegen, und in dem orphischen argonautengedicht (edid.
Hermann. Lipsit¦ 1805. v. 1186) kommt die insel Iernis vor. Dieses ist
die älteste kunde von den namen dieser inseln, welche auch von Polybius
nicht vermehrt wird, indem er ebenfalls nur die britannischen inseln als
die fundorte des zinns bezeichnet.

Morgen pssonice

Das ist sehr interessant. Ich wusste das nicht.

 

[Atilla]

Aristoteles got tin from england delivered by Phoenicier

Die brittischen inseln kennt Herodot unter dem namen Kassiteriden, von denen die Phoenicier das zinn holten (Herod. Thalia cap. 115). Der autor des dem Aristoteles
zugeschriebenen buches erzaehlt von der welt (cap. 3) wusste bereits, dass
jenseits der saeulen des Hercules in dem ocean zwei grosse inseln
Albion und Ierne (Erin--Irland), die britannischen genannt, jenseits
der Kelten laegen, und in dem orphischen argonautengedicht (edid.
Hermann. Lipsit¦ 1805. v. 1186) kommt die insel Iernis vor. Dieses ist
die älteste kunde von den namen dieser inseln, welche auch von Polybius
nicht vermehrt wird, indem er ebenfalls nur die britannischen inseln als
die fundorte des zinns bezeichnet.

Aristoteles got tin from England delivered by Phoenicier

Herodot under the name Kassiteriden knows the brittischen islands, from which the Phoenicier got the tin (Herod. Thalia cap. 115). The author the Aristoteles of attributed book told by the world (cap. 3) knew already the fact that beyond the columns of the Hercules in ocean two large islands the Albion and Ierne (Erin -- Ireland), which britannischen mentioned, beyond which Celts would lie, and in the orphischen argonautengedicht (edid. Hermann. Lipsit¦ 1805. v. 1186) seems the island to Iernis. This is the oldest customer of the names of these islands, which are not increased by Polybius, by calling likewise only the britannischen islands the discovery sites of the tin.

Interesting indeed...

 

[chump]

yes we're long famous for our tin ...makes a lot of tin cups for a lot of handouts ..guess that's why we produce the best 'educated' (unlearned) beggars in th world.

 

[Atilla]

yes we're long famous for our tin ...makes a lot of tin cups for a lot of handouts ..guess that's why we produce the best 'educated' (unlearned) beggars in th world.

A?

Do you mean famous Sheffield steel?

 

[trendie]

Atilla,

I thought the UK was named by the French!

It must thave been an urban myth then, as I thought the French noted two islands of their coast, Lesser Brittany, and a larger island they called Greater Brittany.

 

[Atilla]

Atilla,

I thought the UK was named by the French!

It must thave been an urban myth then, as I thought the French noted two islands of their coast, Lesser Brittany, and a larger island they called Greater Brittany.

I thought it was the Romans who gave it the name Britania?

 

[chump]

"best 'educated' (unlearned) beggars in th world"..actually it was a backhanded compliment to our history which is not so applicable today...from a book "Beggars in Red"

 

[Mr. Charts]

Off the top of my head, wasn't Britain prefixed by "Great" after the Act of Union to mean larger Britain? I might well be mistaken and haven't got the time to check at the moment.
Or perhaps the almighty having created Yorkshire (I'm from Leeds) and thus being his/her own country, decided that any nation with Yorkshire in it, must be Great?
This is obviously much more likely.
Richard

 

[AsifA]

Just got back from lunch - so where are we with" if you ain't got nuttin good to say..." My fear is the UK is an empire in decline. The wealth accumulated is being used faster than it was acquired. I think the country is now operating from its reserves. Sort of 70 lean years following 700 fat years. I Picture Mr. Brown when he got the chancellorship crying out @$£!&*!!!! when he had a look at the books. You now see the evidence of that in his taxation policy. We're being squeezed as we run on reserve. Shame really - the epicentre of the great imdustrial revolution which was effectively the great leap forward for mankind. And you see daily evidence of the demise without a shriek of protest. The crown jewels heving been stolen under Blairs watch - and not even a whimper. Oh there goes Rolls Royce bye bye. We can piddle billions on upgrading trident but not save a global pioneering brand. Makes you sick it does !

 

[Atilla]

Just got back from lunch - so where are we with" if you ain't got nuttin good to say..." My fear is the UK is an empire in decline. The wealth accumulated is being used faster than it was acquired. I think the country is now operating from its reserves. Sort of 70 lean years following 700 fat years. I Picture Mr. Brown when he got the chancellorship crying out @$£!&*!!!! when he had a look at the books. You now see the evidence of that in his taxation policy. We're being squeezed as we run on reserve. Shame really - the epicentre of the great imdustrial revolution which was effectively the great leap forward for mankind. And you see daily evidence of the demise without a shriek of protest. The crown jewels heving been stolen under Blairs watch - and not even a whimper. Oh there goes Rolls Royce bye bye. We can piddle billions on upgrading trident but not save a global pioneering brand. Makes you sick it does !

This is a global problem though. Not specific to the UK. Many other industrialised countries suffering the same.

The demand is with the lesser developed or industrialising countries.

Do agree with redirecting Investment to manufacturing or where the returns are greater.

 

[the blades]

Or perhaps the almighty having created Yorkshire (I'm from Leeds) and thus being his/her own country, decided that any nation with Yorkshire in it, must be Great?
This is obviously much more likely.
Richard

no need to do further research here Richard, I can confirm that this is fact.

UTB

 

[AsifA]

The British Disease if I can put it that way is the propensity to make accountants managers. This was a fundamental error in industry that began in the 50's. The bean counters looking at short termism, the quick buck and the bottom line became a virus burrowing away silently into manufacturing sectors. What you report now is the aftermath of the consequences.. You put an engineer in charge, he understands the design and the product - as masterfully examplified by the Germans. Their managers are mostly ex - engineers. My friend worked for indesit washing machines in their product develoment and the short cuts he was obligated to follow - dont ask. I would buy a Bosche any day irrespective of the extra £100. Its built by an engineer and not a bean counter. I remember in the great shakeout of the late 70's " We are going to specialise as a nation in the service sector" cried Mrs Thatcher - eh where exactly are the first of the service sector jobs going these days - ah yes India. Like I said running on reserve and about to hit empty !!

 

[AsifA]

The British Disease if I can put it that way is the propensity to make accountants managers. This was a fundamental error in industry that began in the 50's. The bean counters looking at short termism, the quick buck and the bottom line became a virus burrowing away silently into manufacturing sectors. What you report now is the aftermath of the consequences.. You put an engineer in charge, he understands the design and the product - as masterfully examplified by the Germans. Their managers are mostly ex - engineers. My friend worked for indesit washing machines in their product develoment and the short cuts he was obligated to follow - dont ask. I would buy a Bosche any day irrespective of the extra £100. Its built by an engineer and not a bean counter. I remember in the great shakeout of the late 70's " We are going to specialise as a nation in the service sector" cried Mrs Thatcher - eh where exactly are the first of the service sector jobs going these days - ah yes India. Like I said running on reserve and about to hit empty !!

Sorry response was for Attilla