Goodbye Finspreads jan 4th 2007

Today I decided I was never again going to use Finspreads. I went long at about 12430. I don't use stops as I prefer to just watch whats happening with a book for company. It was going well about 27 points in my favour. Things then started to change for the worse. It started to nosedive. I hung on but was getting concerned. Suddenly The screen was no longer live, with no fresh updating. I didn't know where I was.

I turned the computer off, as I must to use the telephone. I called Finspreads. They must have been busy, as it was a while before I got an answer. I told the lady what was happening. Another wait, while she connects me to a dealer. Again I tell him what is going on. I am told that the server is down. Politely enough I told him what I thought of the service. The line then becomes dead.

I ring them again and got through the whole thing again. Then I'm talking to a dealer again. Yes the server is down he tells me. What about my bet I tell him. I havn't a clue whats going on, and I am long £100 per point on the Dow.

He wants my account number, post code etc. Eventually I discover I am nearly £4 K out of pocket. I get him to close the bet. As there is no point leaving it run as I cannot see what the hell is happening, and it could easily get worse.

Finspreads have a spread of 6 points. Therefore I placed £600 in their hand that day. Thats a tidy sum of money considering the little they do. I think the service considering its cost, is really crap. Servers- whatever they are, should not be going down or anywhere else for that price.

It really is just not good enough. To cap it all the Dow closed at 12480. I would have made 50 points 50 X100 = £5000. So, Ive lost about £9k all in.

The previous week while in a bet, they did the same thing -down server. Then I gave them the benefit of the doubt. Once yes, but not twice. Good bye Finspreads.

* IF YOU ARE A UK BASED SOLICITOR WITH AN INTEREST IN SPREAD BETTING / TRADING i WISH TO SPEAK TO YOU.*

I've just read this with horror as I've been watching the Finspreads charts all day live on screen (while watching a trade with tradindex on the computer next to it) and the screen did not go down once. Why has this happened to you and not me ?? Me thinks bad thoughts.....

Trading the equivalent of 39 lots with no backup datafeed, no hard stop and a phone that puts the PC out of action? Imagine if there had been some bad news while you were dialling and it fell 100+ points. You're a brave man.

The system went down today at about 15.30 GMT, (about half past three in the afternoon). It lasted perhaps 20-30 minutes. The screen was there but dead, ie no data inputting- nothing changing at all. At least that is what was happening to me. I live in Southport Merseyside.

I'm guessing you have a different server in Chelmsford.

frugi said:

Trading the equivalent of 39 lots with no backup datafeed, no hard stop and a phone that puts the PC out of action? Imagine if there had been some bad news while you were dialling and it fell 100+ points. You're a brave man.

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I like the idea of the back up data feed, how do you sort that ? I know I have to get the phone sortred out, but keep putting it off. Brave ? A little too so perhaps.

The usual way is to subscribe to some charting software which will then draw a feed from one of several data providers.

You may want to have a look at SierraChart (www.sierrachart.com) using IQfeed (www.iqfeed.net/sierrachart). Reliable and cheap.

Also have a look at -
http://www.ensignsoftware.com/
http://www.quotetracker.com/index_nn.asp

That way you can have the cash Dow and/or Dow futures running alongside the spreadbetting company's quotes/charts.

If you are fed up with Finspreads and spreadbetting in general the next step is to trade Dow futures in the real market. $5 per point per contract, 1 point spread. Margin required around $1.5-$2k per contract, commission $3-$5 per round trip (i.e. 1 buy and 1 sell). A lot of people use www.interactivebrokers.co.uk as a broker. Their live prices can feed directly into SierraChart, among others.

nkruger said:

I've just read this with horror as I've been watching the Finspreads charts all day live on screen (while watching a trade with tradindex on the computer next to it) and the screen did not go down once. Why has this happened to you and not me ?? Me thinks bad thoughts.....

Click to expand...

I had no unexpected problems this morning and managed to get out of a bad trade. It does look as if large sized bets are monitored, doesn't it? Blades uses the telephone for his, maybe that is a good idea as they do not know the caller, although the line can be busy. I guess for 100 pounds per point one should be with IB or similar broker.

Split

frugi said:

The usual way is to subscribe to some charting software which will then draw a feed from one of several data providers.

You may want to have a look at SierraChart (www.sierrachart.com) using IQfeed (www.iqfeed.net/sierrachart). Reliable and cheap.

Also have a look at -
http://www.ensignsoftware.com/
http://www.quotetracker.com/index_nn.asp

That way you can have the cash Dow or Dow futures running alongside the spreadbetting company's quotes/charts.

Click to expand...

Thanks for the input frugi. I know what you mean now. Yes I have something like this. I use www.insight.net. Its not too bad, worth a look.But I think its about 20 minutes behind real events. I will probably get sharescope when I next have a nice little earner, but I will take a look at your's though. Thanks again.

Splitlink said:

I had no unexpected problems this morning and managed to get out of a bad trade. It does look as if large sized bets are monitored, doesn't it? Blades uses the telephone for his, maybe that is a good idea as they do not know the caller, although the line can be busy. I guess for 100 pounds per point one should be with IB or similar broker.

Split

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Thanks split. I'm sure I am doing the right thing moving. It also happened the previous week.

I was in at £50 per point then, and again wallop THE SERVER IS DOWN when I phoned. I like my horror stories on the television and not my monitor..................

I'll take a look at Etrade, or maybe the IB you mention.

Round our way we have these mobile phone thingies, owning one would save you having to disconnect your computer.

Trading £100 per point you should be using futures with a 1pt spread and around 1pt commission or try futuresbetting.com for spreadbetting.

if you're trading that sort of bet size, you should really be looking into trading with direct-access spreadbet since at least you are then dealing directly on the underlying futures market and not having to fart about with the SB firms pony synthetic market.

check out www.twowayfutures.com

Were you betting on the daily dow, or the dow future?

Its their fault and not yours the server went down . You telephoned fins, but it was a while before you got an answer and when you did they put you on hold. I hope you have recorded the time of your phone calls to show they admit the server did go down and if can prove they hang up on you this will help you case, all this will show up on the recordings and if they cant prove it to you, but you can prove to them, the time you called them. this will help you case even more. ask BT for this weeks calls to be sent to you.

The first thing you should do is write to them and explain what I said above and ask for the telephone times and what was said on the recordings. . Tell them you will find out if CBOT went down at this time, so fins cant blame CBOT and you can rule that out. But I can assure you CBOT was OK.

I don't know the full story and how long you looked at the screen before you realised the platform was down.You could ask them in the letter or try this one by phone,ask for half of the loss paid back to your account. I would wirte a letter though. they got to get back to you within 5 days. PM if you wish me to help you more....

frugi said:

Trading the equivalent of 39 lots with no backup datafeed, no hard stop and a phone that puts the PC out of action? Imagine if there had been some bad news while you were dialling and it fell 100+ points. You're a brave man.

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Hi again Frugi

Do you remember the Dow in July 2006 ? Do you rememder that huge nose dive ? At that point I had been studying spread betting for a few months. I saw what was happening and decided that I was ready to have a go.

I went in with a very modest £1 per point, and having read V Stanziones book, placed a stop where it seemed appropriate.

As you know there is quite a bit of up and downing for want of a better phrase. The Dow went up just enough to stop me out. It then sank to the depths. I nearly cried when I came home.

Since then I have opted for sitting beside the monitor and watching in the certain knowledge that I cannot be stopped out. But of course you must be vigilant, no nipping out to the shops or anything ! Thats why I do it this way.

I can see it is not perfect but it works. Well it works if Finspreads or whoever you choose don't have servers that keep going down.

Arbitrageur said:

if you're trading that sort of bet size, you should really be looking into trading with direct-access spreadbet since at least you are then dealing directly on the underlying futures market and not having to fart about with the SB firms pony synthetic market.

check out www.twowayfutures.com

Were you betting on the daily dow, or the dow future?

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It was the daily.

juanbyte said:

Round our way we have these mobile phone thingies, owning one would save you having to disconnect your computer.

Trading £100 per point you should be using futures with a 1pt spread and around 1pt commission or try futuresbetting.com for spreadbetting.

Click to expand...

Thanks I'll take a look there.

Yes I have one of those thingies, but I think the money-fairy moved out of it. I'll have to charge it up some. You know its a little like camping, you get there and hey presto you've forgotten something important like the tea-bags or the stove. I must credit it tomorrow.

splorff said:

It was the daily.

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then you should know that you handed your entire loss to Finspreads pockets.

The daily bets are based on the cash index, which is of course untradable in the real world, and therefore unhedgeable.

so forget handing them their spread, since they took the other side of your trade they take your loss of £4k in its entirety including the spread as their profit.

I opened an account with Finspreads, despite reading all the bad reviews on this discussion forum. The forum proved to be so accurate that I decided to become a member here. I think it's really vital for everyone to share their experiences about these spreadbetting cowboys.

I opened my account yesterday and I thought I'd just watch to err on the side of caution due the bad reviews. Then I got a call from a guy from Finspreads to fund my account. I thought I’d put a few hundred pounds in there to keep them happy. I kept an eye on their platform and the prices as various bits of news came out on the Dow during the day. I noticed that every time I wanted a quote on their so-called brand new trading platform, it took about 10-15 seconds before a quote came up and their screen apparently closes down after about 2 minutes – which I just can’t understand. Anyway, this happened to me about 3-4 times! Luckily I hadn't placed any orders! I waited until further news came out. What I found was that every time a key bit of news came out that shifted the Dow, the trade button on their screen would disappear and it would come up with another button called "indicative prices" (ie, telephone bets only) which really pissed me off. Furthermore, to top it all off, their trading platform crashed! (Although I wasn't paying much attention as I was already logged on to my other spreadbetting accounts.)

Today, I was going to give them the benefit of the doubt. But since the Dow was quite volatile, I decided to use my other accounts to trade. I'm glad after reading your comment about the servers going down that I didn't bother to even log on to Finspreads today! And, just as you have said, tomorrow I will say goodbye to Finspreads and give iii.co.uk a try since they offer the same service – 50p a point online.

If you want to share any trading techniques, drop me an email.


Goodbye “bin”-spreads!

tokool said:

I And, just as you have said, tomorrow I will say goodbye to Finspreads and give iii.co.uk a try since they offer the same service – 50p a point online.

Goodbye “bin”-spreads!

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"be careful" there - I believe iii spreadbetting is a white label of finspreads, though check for yourself.

UTB

splorff said:

Hi again Frugi

Do you remember the Dow in July 2006 ? Do you rememder that huge nose dive ? At that point I had been studying spread betting for a few months. I saw what was happening and decided that I was ready to have a go.

I went in with a very modest £1 per point, and having read V Stanziones book, placed a stop where it seemed appropriate.

As you know there is quite a bit of up and downing for want of a better phrase. The Dow went up just enough to stop me out. It then sank to the depths. I nearly cried when I came home.

Since then I have opted for sitting beside the monitor and watching in the certain knowledge that I cannot be stopped out. But of course you must be vigilant, no nipping out to the shops or anything ! Thats why I do it this way.

I can see it is not perfect but it works. Well it works if Finspreads or whoever you choose don't have servers that keep going down.

Click to expand...

Yes, but you said previously that the server went down on you last week, when you had 50 pounds per point on. Now you have done it again with more money, not less! Fins have an unreliable site that can crash, either deliberately or by accident.

So, what did you learn from this experience.?

You HAVE to have a stop on, especially with the Dow and overnight trading. With brokers, clients have their stops at the exchange, so they are safe, but IB warn their clients about a possible site crash and make trailing stops at clients risk, because they are not accepted by the exchanges and are triggered by the broker but not guaranteed by them

Spreadbetting at 100 pounds per point is expensive and represents 10 contracts. Those sizes should be traded with a broker, the spread is less for a start but, if you are not more careful you will lose your money, just the same. To not have a stop, even at a level that you expect will not be reached, is very imprudent and shows a lack of respect for one's own capital.

Don't take this wrong, it is meant for others, not just you. It's a jungle out there!

Split

iii.co.uk white lable of fins

the blades said:

"be careful" there - I believe iii spreadbetting is a white label of finspreads, though check for yourself.

UTB

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Thanks for the tip mate. Yes you are right indeed! I opened an account with them this morning, and the application form came up with finspreads at the bottom of the page. This really annoyed me. I thought surely this can't be right. Why would iii tarnish their name with bin-spreads?

Anyway I completed the form and it got accepted. After this I decided to call iii to ask them what the heck was going on and indeed - they admitted that they were a white lable of fins.

So I proceeded to ask them how many times their servers have gone down and how often - I also explained that I have/had a fins spreads account and was looking to move due to this reason.

The woman came back really aggressively and said "servers do go down. We can not tell you how often. You can't ask us that as we don't know when it will go down next". I felt like saying I can tell you when it will go down next; when the next bit of news comes out.

You would think that if the indeed just lay off your bets in the market and only benefit from the spread, no business would do something that is unprofitable for them i.e. have servers that go down. Can someone tell me how they lay off a £1 or 50p bet in the market if the contract on a dow future is £5per point in effect?

Anyway So I said well here is a factual question for you - "How many times in the last week/month has the server gone down?" To which she didn't reply.

Looks like I will have to be patient and wait to see what happens with these jokers as well.

Anyone had a bad experience of iii? Please let me know so I don't waste my time watching them.

Apparently world trade too use the same platform as fins! Are they also a white lable?