About To Give Up

Hi,

Wondering if anyone can give me hope at trading as this looks like the end for me. Been trading for 10 months now 6 months demo and 4 months live with more losses than winners which where just luck imo.

I have taken the experts advice and devised my own system with no success. I have backtested it 2 years and it works, but hasn't forward testing on live real money. I either get in too early or late or get stopped out early. I use 2 times the ATR.

My only option is to dig through the web to find a proven system or some signal service for how long it lasts to be successful imo or else look for a new career which I am thinking trading may not be for me.

Give it a rest for a while. I've had a couple of enforced breaks, but each time
I came back better. The market can really mess up your mind when it's not working
for you. But surprisingly easy when you've "got it".
Pack it up for a month or six because if you don't, the market will enforce the break (run out of money)
This has been my experience anyway.

You've been at it for less than a year. That's not out of the ordinary in this business. You really should take a short break as Moon suggested to clear your mind. Continuing on while you are in the current frame of mind and depressed about your progress will only lead to further losses.

Signal services or paying for some online marketing hype are not the answer.

If you are not already doing so then start keeping a journal of your trades. This will be the most valuable information you will find because it is YOUR information about YOUR live trading.

Peter

six years after i started I was losing and heavily behind, you can see mine and wackys methods on the thread. What I will say is that it is probably your money management and discipline that failed not the method. Stay with it,it also depends on how much time you have available as to what you should do

Concur with the others. Trading is a mixture of study and experience. You can’t skip the experience bit and 10 months is just a taster. There is no get rich quick in trading. In the last 10 months you have learned a lot – even if it is only how not to trade, but that is knowledge you didn’t have 10 months ago, so imagine how much more you will know in another 10 months.

Pipsaholic said:

Hi,

My only option is to dig through the web to find a proven system or some signal service for how long it lasts to be successful imo or else look for a new career which I am thinking trading may not be for me.

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The problem is that all you have focussed on has been signal services and crappy software products. You must have looked at hundreds of them, you should know by now they are not the answer. As others have said if you keep at it (developing your own system not buying crap) then maybe in another 3 or 4 years you could turn it around. If you cant put in the time or money then maybe its better to give up now.

Even if we have to the best system and all the knowledge, that doesn't mean we can be successful traders. Your psychology may be your greatest enemy. You can defeat it by money-risk management. If you can't defeat it, it is not the end of the world...

Invite your friends/family around for a discussion - about you !! And supply drink/munchies etc. ( very important )
Tell them what you are trying to achieve and invite comments - you know whose views to trust probably.
Give them say 3 months to think about the evening and invite them again to show any developments.

Problem is that he has been following signals etc and all the snakeoil vendors.
Trading takes a lot of study - read the guys on here who trade price. Look at James16 on FF. It takes time and practice. Stick to one approach

Your 2 years back-tested systen/edge: Why has the edge not worked for you in the forward test/live ?

a. Because the edge just hasn't continued to be profitable in this forward test/live period
b. Because you did not stick to the rules oif the edge and entered the market when you should not have done
c. Because you did not stick to the money management rules of the edge
d. A combination of b. and c.

What do you mean when you say '...I use 2 times the ATR...' ?

The first task is to identify honestly why you are in this position. You should not make a decision without this info.

G/L

Keep at it, Pips but, as others have said, give up your quest for an infallible system - there isn't one.

You could do worse than going through what Flash and Wacky get up to - http://www.trade2win.com/boards/general-trading-chat/139984-live-trading-general-chat-lounge.html and have a look at flashy's videos that he has started recently. Yes, they have their lines on charts and their "set-ups" but they know that all these do is point to an area where they are prepared to make an assumption about price - if the assumption plays out they roll with it, if not they quickly wave it goodbye.

practice, practice, practice something like that and you'll be ok.

jon

On a more general point, 10 mths forward test/live trading is nothing and certainly not long enough to form a meaningful conclusion from.

It would help to set clearly defined and timed objcetives along the way to help you achieve your goal (whatever that is - buit it should be defined.) ie your objectives might look like this (assuming you have a profitable edge)

1. By year end to haver achieved 1week's trading at a gain of x pips
b. By end of Jan to be profitable overall in the month
c. By end of Feb to be profitable ocverall in the month and on more days than not

Just an example - but you get the idea. Ie be claer what it is you are trying to achieve, the timescale and the steps/incriments by which you hope to achieve it.

Underneath the Goals>Objectives, is ' Activity ' and you again can list here specific steps you need to take to achieve the objectives, - these will be more to do with thye mechanics of your trading - ie like '..ensure that I hold each trade for either the pre-defined stop or target...' etc..

Have a plan ! Write it down, and follow it.

G/L

neil said:

Problem is that he has been following signals etc and all the snakeoil vendors.
Trading takes a lot of study - read the guys on here who trade price. Look at James16 on FF. It takes time and practice. Stick to one approach

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Exactly, he has been listening to a bunch of idiots that said they were millionaires, now the damage has to be undone.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/general-trading-chat/127520-daily-trading-system-las-vegas-3.html

BE GUIDED "MY DEARS" BY UNCLE FAGIN

[sung] In this life, one thing counts
In the bank, large amounts
I'm afraid these don't grow on trees,
You've got to make a trade or two

You've got to make a trade or two, boys,
You've got to make a trade or two.

[BOYS]
Large amounts don't grow on trees.
You've got to make a trade or two.

[FAGIN (spoken)]
Let's show Oliver how it's done, shall we, my dears?

[sung] Why should we break our backs
Stupidly paying tax?
Better get some untaxed income
Better to make a trade or two.

You've got to make a trade or two, boys
You've got to make a trade or two.

[BOYS]
Why should we all break our backs?
Better make a trade or two.

[FAGIN (spoken)]
Who says crime doesn't pay?

[sung] Robin Hood, what a crook!
Gave away, what he took.
Charity's fine, subscribe to mine.
Get out and make a trade or two

You've got to make a trade or two, boys
You've got to make a trade or two.

[BOYS]
Robin Hood was far too good
He had to make a trade or two.

[FAGIN]
Take a tip from Bill Sikes
He can whip what he likes.
I recall, he started small
He had to make a trade or two.

You've got to make a trade or two, boys
You've got to make a tradet or two.

[BOYS]
We can be like old Bill Sikes
If we make a trade or two.

[FAGIN (spoken)]
Stop thief!

Dear old gent passing by
Something nice takes his eye
Everything's clear, attack the rear
Get in and make a trade or two.

You've got to make a trade or two, boys
You've got to make a trade or two.

[BOYS]
Have no fear, attack the rear
Get in and make a trade or two.

[FAGIN]
When I see someone rich,
Both my thumbs start to itch
Only to find some peace of mind
We have to make a trade or two.

You've got to make a trade or two, boys
You've got to make a tradet or two.

[BOYS]
Just to find some peace of mind

[FAGIN AND BOYS]
We have to make a trade or two!

as plagiarised by yours truly

barjon said:

Keep at it, Pips but, as others have said, give up your quest for an infallible system - there isn't one.jon

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Oh Really !

pboyles said:

Exactly, he has been listening to a bunch of idiots that said they were millionaires, now the damage has to be undone.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/general-trading-chat/127520-daily-trading-system-las-vegas-3.html

Click to expand...

Yes, some of us have been pretty hard on him in a few of his threads. I hope he understands why now.

Peter

Pipsaholic said:

I use 2 times the ATR

Click to expand...

why should this work?

barjon said:

Keep at it, Pips but, as others have said, give up your quest for an infallible system - there isn't one.

Click to expand...

My mates masters tutor (who frequently invited in his millionaire hedge fund trader buddies for talks - so you know he's the business) reckons he's got a model that does it. He's a consultant on teh side too.

Well - I for one am all for you quitting.

You obviously realise you aren't cut out for it. Some people go on for decades spending all their free time on failing at trading.

DT, how long do you think is a reasonable time to realise that you just aren't cut out for trading? I mean, is a year or two of losses normal/acceptable?