Types of Breakouts?

[AllanXT]

Trade 2 Win, PO BOX 0.312, Cyberspace

price trading is just another fashion in the trading world.

These fashions tend to last a few years before the crowd moves to something else. Indicators, Fib numbers, Gann geometry, breakouts, retracements, system trading, manual trading blah blah blah. . Eventually you get full circle.

Maybe neural-nets will be the next big thing and we will be laughing at ourselves in 5 years time. Who knows! Do you? Answers on a post card please to

I see your point. However I would argue that price trading has been around for a very very long time. I don't think it could be regarded as a fad or a fashion. The same can be said for system trading. The traders in the Market Wizards books and the thousands of hedge funds operating today also show that system trading is not a fad but rather has been around for many many years.

So I am surprised that there is not more support on this board for system trading. However, I am open to learning about price trading so I have gained some important information in that area.

Good Trading to all,

Allan

 

[chump]

A lot of confusion arises simply from terminology..often it appears that the word 'system' means different things to different people...but I suspect if you analyse what price traders are doing you will nonetheless find method and a systematic approach theirin...a systematic approach does not need to incorporate indicators / patterns et al and yet often you will find the assumption that a price trader is discretionary in their approach if they do not use same..I see no basis for that assumption..

 

[AllanXT]

Discretionary

A lot of confusion arises simply from terminology..often it appears that the word 'system' means different things to different people...but I suspect if you analyse what price traders are doing you will nonetheless find method and a systematic approach theirin...a systematic approach does not need to incorporate indicators / patterns et al and yet often you will find the assumption that a price trader is discretionary in their approach if they do not use same..I see no basis for that assumption..

Well, to me a systems trader is one who finds a recurring inefficiency in the market. The inefficiency occurs with a high probability and is stable over a long period (sample data).

A price trader (from what I've been told by you all) is a discretionary trader. However, a price trader is going to be looking for recurring patterns of price and volume and in that sense there is a similarity to a system trader.

I think the difference between systems and price trader is that the systems trader relies mostly on testing, where the price trader relies mostly on experience. In my opinion of course.

Your view implies that a price trader has a method and is also a system trader.

XT

 

[TheBramble]

So I am surprised that there is not more support on this board for system trading.

Allan, there is far more support for systems trading than just on price (& volume). This thread (started off) as a systems issue and has meandered into (amongst a few other things!) price action.

There's 'No Indicators' thread and a few posts of 'Trading ES' which touch on this, but mostly I would say, traders on t2w are systems traders.

I am increasingly drawn to the 'Dark Side' myself, but I keep on open and interested perspective on systems too.

 

[chump]

My view implies nothing..it states specifically that I think you will find that price traders have rules and in the sense that a system trader is also defined by rules then so too can you say a price trader has a system also....why do people always need to try and fit things into neat distinct boxes that state you are one thing or the other..is life really like that?

 

[TheBramble]

....why do people always need to try and fit things into neat distinct boxes that state you are one thing or the other..is life really like that?

Blame Aristotle for that.

However, we did get the binary system and most of current Western philosophical thought from him too. So, credit where credit's due. A small price to pay IMO.

It's us Eastern metaphysical dudes and dudesses that get to play around and enjoy the grey areas...

 

[AllanXT]

Both

My view implies nothing..it states specifically that I think you will find that price traders have rules and in the sense that a system trader is also defined by rules then so too can you say a price trader has a system also....why do people always need to try and fit things into neat distinct boxes that state you are one thing or the other..is life really like that?

Well said Chump. A price trader and a systems trader both have rules and a system that they follow. Got it.

Good Trading,

Allan

 

[AllanXT]

The Undertaker

I am increasingly drawn to the 'Dark Side' myself, but I keep on open and interested perspective on systems too.

So a "Price Trader" is one who has been called to the "Dark Side." I like that. Maybe I'll change my user name to "The UnderTaker", more fitting I'd say!

Good Trading to you friend,

Allan