Tightest bid/ask spread ?

[JohnDoe]

They are now offering 3 pip spread on mini-YM with mini account (5k opening deposit required)...

Steve

CRIMINAL!!

The futures market offers 1 tick spread, and the ability to use Limit orders, so you dont even have to pay any spread if your tactics permit.

Commissions should be equal or less to 1 tick as well making it cheaper to transact in a baby contract like the Dow.

I'm sure some smart egg will come back with the fact that spread betting is tax free. Seeing as how 80% of futures traders lose overall and 90% of spread betters lose overall, I imagine being able to be in a position to pay tax on trading income would be nice for most people here (i.e. irrelevant).

One step at a time.

 

[SOCRATES]

All of this without considering problems involving lagging. The extra work involved makes it not an easy venture for most traders.

 

[cj12]

3 ticks seem an odd number. so you be paying 2 tick spread on the bid, and 1 tick spread on the offer. its still works out you paying 4 ticks,you can get thei with C/S

do the math based on 3 ticks


Example real market bid 10451 offer 10452 1 tick soread

FuturesBetting. bid 10449 offer 10453 3 tick spread."but you are paying 4 ticks".

 

[jas-105]

Thanks for all your help with this guys (and girls !).

I've opened an account with futuresbetting.com after spending a while on their trainer (the real thing seems way faster BTW !). Only trading 1 lots in bund futures but works very well and the sqwawk means I have been able to drop all my (overpriced) news feeds.

I'll keep you posted.

 

[capitalspreads]

we also like the look of the futuresbetting lot as they do seem to be offering a service that could work in the future.

our problem is whether they will really be considered to be betting. You will have to follow closely here... If you are only filled in your order when they are filled in the market and you can only trade in market size and are then effectively charged brokerage (Iknow they call it something else) the inland revenue may very well say that this is not betting but trading because you are not trading on their price but on the actual futures price.

We were originaly going to open a similar company called ProSpreads (early monitors of our home site may remember it) which would work in the same way. We were informed by m'learned council that the IR would not see this as spread betting but as trading and thus subject to capital gains.

If after adding all costs you are trading on no better than Capital Spreads prices why bother or take the risk.

We would be happy to be proved wrong as this would open up another avenue to ourselves.

Simon

 

[cj12]

simon

I was going to open an account with them but o qualify for 1 tick either side of the bid and ask, I would have to trade more than 1001 $5.00 lots a month. if you below this you would get 2 ticks either side of the bid and ask.

Since I told them no thanks they have come back to me saying we offer you 1 tick either side and don't worry about you volume.

They are hedged 100%.I pay 1 tick above market price to get in and 1 tick below market price to get out,(2 ticks), You don't pay commission, if you do the math it works out you only 1 tick worse of than real market price because you don't pay commission.

This could be the way to go in the future.simon could you offer this and base it on $$$ for the usa markets. with a spread of 2 ticks. you could hedged 100% and for every 1 lot one trades, you would make 1 tick on every trade.

 

[jas-105]

Simon,

From what I can gather, futuresbetting.com operate in exactly the same way as every other spreadbetting company , except they offer a tighter spread. The price that I have been trading on has been different from the actual underlying

Their (Ffastfill) software automatically makes a spread price around the underlying market and I believe all client positions are fully hedged automatically (in fact their narrow spread would probably make it prohibitive to take the other side of a client bet, unlike some other spreadbetting companies that have the "built-in" edge of a wider spread price initially).

It is the closest thing to trading the futures through an arcade in my opinion and, for a similar volume that a professional may reach, is comparable on costs, except that the software (remember that FFastfill is a front-end used by a lot of arcade traders), charts and live sqwawk are all free.

Please feel free to comment Simon as I imagine you have a lot of experience in this industry,

Thanks.

 

[capitalspreads]

As i say it could be the way forward ...

When I read their brochure ( a while ago admitedly) it seemed that you were only filled if their corresponding trade was done in the market ( I may be wrong here). If not then you miss the deal. With the SB companies in the Wall Street you will nearly always get your deal done even if the market has pipped in your favor.

jas 105 I struggle to understand... if they are quoting a 1 pip wide price (when available) in the mini dow how can this differ from the market quote as this is also 1 pip wide. If they quote a different price they cannot fill you surely (!?) because they cannot make the hedging trade at the corresponding price at which you have traded.

I am talking through ignorance here .... I will have to open an account myself and see how the mechanics work. As I would always recommend any trader doing. If another trading platform suits your style (or pocket) it is better to go that way.

Simon

 

[Verno]

CS, is are there any plans to offer mobile enabled betting. I had a look on cityindex and they offer it, however their spreads are worse and as I mainly trade FX they have 10 pip spread (due to it being the future) but CS offers 4-5pips which suits me much better.

Thanks
Verno

PS I don't mean PDAs either.

 

[capitalspreads]

verno

i will answer this on the Capital Spreads thread as this is not really my area

simon

 

[A Dashing Blade]

Simon,

From what I can gather, futuresbetting.com operate in exactly the same way as every other spreadbetting company , except they offer a tighter spread. The price that I have been trading on has been different from the actual underlying

Their (Ffastfill) software automatically makes a spread price around the underlying market and I believe all client positions are fully hedged automatically (in fact their narrow spread would probably make it prohibitive to take the other side of a client bet, unlike some other spreadbetting companies that have the "built-in" edge of a wider spread price initially).

It is the closest thing to trading the futures through an arcade in my opinion and, for a similar volume that a professional may reach, is comparable on costs, except that the software (remember that FFastfill is a front-end used by a lot of arcade traders), charts and live sqwawk are all free.

Please feel free to comment Simon as I imagine you have a lot of experience in this industry,

Thanks.

Just had a long chat with these guys at the FOW ehxibition at the Barbican
They basically provide a "straight through trading facility" to the underlying exchange.
The exchange prices and depth are total transparent, the software goes like s**t off a shoval.

As to pricing, take the bund as an example. The contract size is EUR10 a cent.

You see the live, real time quote on the exchange (I phone my trading desk and verified this)

Say this is 123.34 - 123.35 (0.01 = 10EUR remember)

the futuresbetting quote would be 123.336 - 123.344 if you want to sell/buy at the bid or
123.346 - 123.354 if you want to sell/buy at the offer

ie EUR4 per contract.

If you want to sell at the bid or buy at the ask then the order goes stright thru and is executed on the exchange, buying at the bid/selling at the ask means you join the queue on the exchange (Eurex is a first come first filled)

There's a 200 millsecond time lag between your button click and their execution on the exchange.

I take the point about this being a grey area wrt tax treatment but they spent over 2 years clearing the regulatory hurdles with the Gibralter FSA.

Also, it's segregated client accounts held in a British based account at Barclay's so you money is about as safe as you can get in this business.

 

[jas-105]

Yes, the guys from Futuresbetting.com are at the FOW exhibition in the Barbican and are definately worth visiting to answer any questions and to have a go on the software to see what it is like.

Good luck.