Spread-Betting with IG

[elc]

Hi, I recently started SB with IG, mainly on FTSE 100 DFB and I'm finding it a real pain.

I am new to SB, but I never realised they don't use the real market values but there own... and it's often way off.

For example, right now, their FTSE 100 chart is 4 points off from the real value.

The market is already volatile as it is, and with the way IG are manipulate the levels even further, I'm constantly in positions where I'll make poor/no return or heavy losses.

I feel like I'm being held hostage trying to trade on a platform like this.


Could you reccomend any other alternatives?

 

[Vasco da Banana]

Lotteries and casinos.

 

[Shakone]

IF it is 4 points off, shouldn't you be able to take advantage of the price discrepancy?

 

[capitalspreads]

elc

i hate to say this but IG's price is more likely to be correct than the UKX (FTSE 100) . the spread betting /cfd companies do not price off the index because it is very much slower than the futures market and is subject to the very wide spreads on some of the constituent components. So IG's price will be taken from the futures plus or minus a Fair Value number which is calculated from the dividends due to be paid and the interest cost of positions from now until the expiry of the Future.. (also you cannot actually trade "the FTSE" as it does not exist as a financial product... a case where the future is the derivative of a non existent instrument)

I know it is hard but you must get away from thinking that the quote is 'against you' it is just the quote .. if the futures market rises/falls then the quote will rise/fall by exactly the same amount.

that said you could always go to us (Capital Spreads) and then you would be able to trade on the best price from 2 sources. Not only that but we are only 1 point wide all the way up to 21.00 (IG are 2 after 16.30).... cheeky i know but .. i must advertise where i can

simon

 

[magnet]

I have recently opened an account with IG.They offer tight spreads, the charting is excellent and a trade execution is very fast.
If you are trading long or short based on the spreads quoted and the charts available, the only decision is which way the market is headed,I don't quite see what other market prices have got to do with it.

Hi, I recently started SB with IG, mainly on FTSE 100 DFB and I'm finding it a real pain.

I am new to SB, but I never realised they don't use the real market values but there own... and it's often way off.

For example, right now, their FTSE 100 chart is 4 points off from the real value.

The market is already volatile as it is, and with the way IG are manipulate the levels even further, I'm constantly in positions where I'll make poor/no return or heavy losses.

I feel like I'm being held hostage trying to trade on a platform like this.


Could you reccomend any other alternatives?

 

[gle101]

Hi, I recently started SB with IG, mainly on FTSE 100 DFB and I'm finding it a real pain.

I am new to SB, but I never realised they don't use the real market values but there own... and it's often way off.

For example, right now, their FTSE 100 chart is 4 points off from the real value.

The market is already volatile as it is, and with the way IG are manipulate the levels even further, I'm constantly in positions where I'll make poor/no return or heavy losses.

I feel like I'm being held hostage trying to trade on a platform like this.


Could you reccomend any other alternatives?

Yes you will probably have the same "problem" with all SB companies. SB today are accurate in mirroring a combination of underlaying instruments. Otherwise it would just be easy in taking advantage of incorrect prices. Being a newbie I think you have to concentrate in getting the right money management in place, this in order not to suffer over extensive losses when the market goes against you.

 

[elc]

Thanks for the feedback.

I am currently now in another situation...

I went in a Sell at 5938 on the FTSE 100 DFB, at £9 per point. At that point my equity was around £258.

Around £4:30pm the FTSE shot up to around a peak of 5962. I received an email around that time telling me about my margins and to deposit my funds.
I get home around 6:30pm to check my account, and see I have a balance of £150 and the position I opened is now at £3 a point, not the £9.

I still had enough fund on my account when it 5962 and there was no need for the lower the money I had on per point. So yea, it's obviously hit the peak and started to drop back in my favour, but where I was paying £9 on the raise, now they've lowered my rate without my knowledge, I was making a 3rd back when it fell back down.

Obviously it was going to drop back after that spike and I feel they knew this too and took action to stop me recouping the losses back.

Now it's dropped all the way back down to 5935 as expected, but I am still significantly down just because they changed my order. I credited another £150 to the account now, but I very unhappy they did this without my consent or sufficient notice.

What can I do about it? Surely I should be protected in some way from such dodgy dealings?

 

[Shakone]

Thanks for the feedback.

I am currently now in another situation...

I went in a Sell at 5938 on the FTSE 100 DFB, at £9 per point. At that point my equity was around £258.

Around £4:30pm the FTSE shot up to around a peak of 5962. I received an email around that time telling me about my margins and to deposit my funds.
I get home around 6:30pm to check my account, and see I have a balance of £150 and the position I opened is now at £3 a point, not the £9.

I still had enough fund on my account when it 5962 and there was no need for the lower the money I had on per point. So yea, it's obviously hit the peak and started to drop back in my favour, but where I was paying £9 on the raise, now they've lowered my rate without my knowledge, I was making a 3rd back when it fell back down.

Obviously it was going to drop back after that spike and I feel they knew this too and took action to stop me recouping the losses back.

Now it's dropped all the way back down to 5935 as expected, but I am still significantly down just because they changed my order. I credited another £150 to the account now, but I very unhappy they did this without my consent or sufficient notice.

What can I do about it? Surely I should be protected in some way from such dodgy dealings?

At 5962, you were 9x24 down, i.e. 216 down. So you had £42 in your account, and a £9 per point bet open. Is £42 really enough margin for a £9 per point bet? I would guess no.

 

[gle101]

Thanks for the feedback.

I am currently now in another situation...

I went in a Sell at 5938 on the FTSE 100 DFB, at £9 per point. At that point my equity was around £258.

Around £4:30pm the FTSE shot up to around a peak of 5962. I received an email around that time telling me about my margins and to deposit my funds.
I get home around 6:30pm to check my account, and see I have a balance of £150 and the position I opened is now at £3 a point, not the £9.

I still had enough fund on my account when it 5962 and there was no need for the lower the money I had on per point. So yea, it's obviously hit the peak and started to drop back in my favour, but where I was paying £9 on the raise, now they've lowered my rate without my knowledge, I was making a 3rd back when it fell back down.

Obviously it was going to drop back after that spike and I feel they knew this too and took action to stop me recouping the losses back.

Now it's dropped all the way back down to 5935 as expected, but I am still significantly down just because they changed my order. I credited another £150 to the account now, but I very unhappy they did this without my consent or sufficient notice.

What can I do about it? Surely I should be protected in some way from such dodgy dealings?

As I see it, you are taking way too much of a risk. Include the stop loss when you are calculating risk, e.g 10 point stop loss x £3. that is £30 point loss in case you were stopped out. £30 loss shouldn't be more than 2-3% of your capital.

 

[malaguti]

Thanks for the feedback.

I am currently now in another situation...

I went in a Sell at 5938 on the FTSE 100 DFB, at £9 per point. At that point my equity was around £258.

Around £4:30pm the FTSE shot up to around a peak of 5962. I received an email around that time telling me about my margins and to deposit my funds.
I get home around 6:30pm to check my account, and see I have a balance of £150 and the position I opened is now at £3 a point, not the £9.

I still had enough fund on my account when it 5962 and there was no need for the lower the money I had on per point. So yea, it's obviously hit the peak and started to drop back in my favour, but where I was paying £9 on the raise, now they've lowered my rate without my knowledge, I was making a 3rd back when it fell back down.

Obviously it was going to drop back after that spike and I feel they knew this too and took action to stop me recouping the losses back.

Now it's dropped all the way back down to 5935 as expected, but I am still significantly down just because they changed my order. I credited another £150 to the account now, but I very unhappy they did this without my consent or sufficient notice.

What can I do about it? Surely I should be protected in some way from such dodgy dealings?

they are dodgy. No two ways about it. Go with somebody else.

 

[x4x]

They're not dodgy, I've traded with them for many years and have never had a trade closed or altered by them, but that's because I use proper money management and trade well within their clearly defined margins - elc is going to give them all his money anyway, they don't even need to be dodgy.

 

[BeginnerJoe]

They are not dodgy, but the market is dodgy. It doesn't matter where you go, you will end up the same way. The mistake is to believe the market is a dumb and stupid ATM. It isn't, it is comprised of intelligent people who know they will make a profit the moment they take the other side of your trade. To beat them, you have to be more intelligent than they are. At the moment, you don't even know those people are there. So you have zero chance.

 

[malaguti]

They're not dodgy, I've traded with them for many years and have never had a trade closed or altered by them, but that's because I use proper money management and trade well within their clearly defined margins - elc is going to give them all his money anyway, they don't even need to be dodgy.

well i guess its my own personal experience then. Never have any of the issues I had with IG when I moved to ETX. Just really good trading without the second guessing as to whether something is going to happen unexpectedly. I put them in the ranks of pure scum.

 

[x4x]

So you think they should have kept his trade at £9 per point, even though he had exceeded their margin requirements....?

I think he should thank them for not fully closing him out.

I don't think he mentioned a stop loss - I wonder if he would have complained that they hadn't reduced or closed his position if it had kept going up, and ended up owing them a few hundred.

 

[Vasco da Banana]

Thanks for the feedback.

I am currently now in another situation...

I went in a Sell at 5938 on the FTSE 100 DFB, at £9 per point. At that point my equity was around £258.

Around £4:30pm the FTSE shot up to around a peak of 5962. I received an email around that time telling me about my margins and to deposit my funds.
I get home around 6:30pm to check my account, and see I have a balance of £150 and the position I opened is now at £3 a point, not the £9.

I still had enough fund on my account when it 5962 and there was no need for the lower the money I had on per point. So yea, it's obviously hit the peak and started to drop back in my favour, but where I was paying £9 on the raise, now they've lowered my rate without my knowledge, I was making a 3rd back when it fell back down.

Obviously it was going to drop back after that spike and I feel they knew this too and took action to stop me recouping the losses back.

Now it's dropped all the way back down to 5935 as expected, but I am still significantly down just because they changed my order. I credited another £150 to the account now, but I very unhappy they did this without my consent or sufficient notice.

What can I do about it? Surely I should be protected in some way from such dodgy dealings?

The main things you can do about it are,
a) fully understand the way SB works
b) not stake more than £1 per point with such a small account

 

[elc]

At 5962, you were 9x24 down, i.e. 216 down. So you had £42 in your account, and a £9 per point bet open. Is £42 really enough margin for a £9 per point bet? I would guess no.

It was enough to open the bet. I didn't put a stop-loss because was pretty sure it would follow the wall street suite and drop near the end of the day.

I didn't expect a huge increase, but I wasn't going to pull out on a loss for nothing, when(as I said) I expected it to drop back down.

£42 left on the account was enough to cover me a 4 more points at least, and not owe them a penny. What risk do they run in leaving me to lose another £36 after already taking £216 from me? Who were they looking out for? Me?

So they can just manipulate my bets when and hwo they see fit, even though I never told them to, and it doesn't benefit(quite the contrary actually) me, but in fact does them.

And also, to the person who put the intelligence of these people on a pedestal. That just strengthens my position in that these people are thieves. They knew damned well the FTSE would drop and I would recoup my money back, that's why they altered so I was unable to do so.

They could have at least called/texted me before doing what they did and asked me to increase the funds on my account before making such a critical move.

And for the person who said I would complain if they didn't alter my account and I lost all my money... No. Don't be silly.
I chose not to put a stop-loss for a reason.

But yes, I wasn't expecting a heap of smartarse remarks from seeking advice after just being robbed.

 

[elc]

well for £9 bet they would need £225 margin....so if anything they let the bet run too far before cutting or may be they did cut it sooner....

what guarantee was there that it would not have gone further up...taking such risk specially on such heavy news day the end results are not surprising

IG practice is absolutely correct and what the OP is doing is gambling...

high leverage, high position size, assuming the market will definitely go onside before going much offside, no stop loss, poor risk reward ratio for 3 points gain position was allowed to run 24 points....

to conclude IG and other profitable punters should welcome the OP with both hands, encourage him to keep depositing his funds and take even higher sized bets with no reasonable stop loss and based mainly on hope that it will come alright

Spread-betting is gambling... Unless you Spread-Bet on information you're not supposed to make financial gain from?


If I had a stop-loss on, I would have certainly lost money.

And before a typical smartarse answer of "you lost a heap more with no stop-loss", that's irrelevant to the point.


The fact is, if they didn't touch my account or at least gave me direct and due notice before doing anything, this never would have happened and I wouldn't have lost anything. What right do they have to alter my bets without informing me, even though they are at no financial risk by letting it continue, but in fact, seek to gain by altering it?

That's the point.

It's a serious conflict on interest and it's mind-boggling how the typical answer is just "you took too much risk". :

 

[x4x]

If you still don't get it, I would advise you to take your remaining money out of IG and permanently stay away from any sort of trading, whether it be buying/selling tomatoes, cars, financials or sweeties - the principles are the same and definitely not for you.

 

[Vasco da Banana]

Spread-betting is gambling... Unless you Spread-Bet on information you're not supposed to make financial gain from?


If I had a stop-loss on, I would have certainly lost money.

And before a typical smartarse answer of "you lost a heap more with no stop-loss", that's irrelevant to the point.


The fact is, if they didn't touch my account or at least gave me direct and due notice before doing anything, this never would have happened and I wouldn't have lost anything. What right do they have to alter my bets without informing me, even though they are at no financial risk by letting it continue, but in fact, seek to gain by altering it?

That's the point.

It's a serious conflict on interest and it's mind-boggling how the typical answer is just "you took too much risk". :

It might be mind-boggling to you, but it's true. You may think we're all smart arses, but why not consider what's been said before you throw away all your money? No-one knows what the FTSE is going to do. If IG knew, they wouldn't need to bother running a spreadbet company to take money off naive punters like you.

 

[Shakone]

It was enough to open the bet. I didn't put a stop-loss because was pretty sure it would follow the wall street suite and drop near the end of the day.

I didn't expect a huge increase, but I wasn't going to pull out on a loss for nothing, when(as I said) I expected it to drop back down.

£42 left on the account was enough to cover me a 4 more points at least, and not owe them a penny. What risk do they run in leaving me to lose another £36 after already taking £216 from me? Who were they looking out for? Me?

So they can just manipulate my bets when and hwo they see fit, even though I never told them to, and it doesn't benefit(quite the contrary actually) me, but in fact does them.

And also, to the person who put the intelligence of these people on a pedestal. That just strengthens my position in that these people are thieves. They knew damned well the FTSE would drop and I would recoup my money back, that's why they altered so I was unable to do so.

They could have at least called/texted me before doing what they did and asked me to increase the funds on my account before making such a critical move.

And for the person who said I would complain if they didn't alter my account and I lost all my money... No. Don't be silly.
I chose not to put a stop-loss for a reason.

But yes, I wasn't expecting a heap of smartarse remarks from seeking advice after just being robbed.

It's irrelevant that you had enough money to open the initial bet.

You didn't have enough money to maintain the bet at the size you were. Your fault. You didn't cover the margin, ergo they closed part of your position. I think you got away lightly. You weren't robbed, you gave away your money.

You don't know what you are doing, and are complaining about a company when it is you who were at fault.

You think, incorrectly that they should let you lose another 4 more points at £9 a point, because you don't understand the purpose of margin, and you don't understand that price can gap and move quickly, much more than the 4 points.

Whenever you play a game, at least learn the rules.