Lord Anton Kreil

[D70]

Who's enjoying the Anton Kreil "I'll teach you how to trade like a professional because everyone else is a complete idiot" storyline?

Anyone been to a seminar or done a 1-to-1 ?

Thoughts?

 

[BeginnerJoe]

Thoughts?

Why doesn't he trade like a professional and use the market like an ATM instead of looking for training fees ?

I vaguely remember from somewhere that winners amongst professionals are not as high a percentage as one would imagine. So learning to be a professional is no guarantee for success.

 

[D70]

Why doesn't he trade like a professional and use the market like an ATM instead of looking for training fees ?

I vaguely remember from somewhere that winners amongst professionals are not as high a percentage as one would imagine. So learning to be a professional is no guarantee for success.

Easier money to be made from "teaching" and then ongoing income from having an affiliate broker. Every trade a 'student' does pays him a few quid.

 

[bbmac]

He was doing free seminars with ETX a while back to get sign up to SB..I went along as I was at a loose end/it was local to me, it's such an exotic name, and I needed a new mouse mat and thought there would be a few obligatory freebies going and if not - I set myself the challenge of nicking one anyway. Like all good trades - i'd planned for the contingency of getting caught in that I would claim I had ' techno-kleptomania.' Anyways I went along and not a mouse mat to be had anywhere if you please, not so much as a cheap biro splendidly emblazened with the ETX logo or for that matter pad with similar such decoration. Anton duly appeared rather shabbily dressed and gave a 1hr talk full of truisms, sweeping statements and platitudes aimed at not even newbies - more ameba level. His presentation styl;e matched his satire and it was lazily delivered (probably the 454th he'd done that week.) Disappointed at my futile journey across the streets paved with gold that is London town - I eyed a solitary mouse mat in the far corner of the room with a fecthing design not dissimilar to that I have described above - but to no avail - could I get to that yonder side of said room without being entirely conspicous of thought and intent ? - Could I buffalo ! This made me even more angry at the wasted journey so I unlocked my shopping trolley that I had hitched and padlocked in reception, and left with my goal unfulfilled and my dreams shattered by the whole experience ! As I was leaving I could hear the Anton's close - promises of riches beyond youyr wildest imaginings andI have to admit the pang of hope almost tripped me and turned me 180degrees to go back but I tripped on an empty packet of capstan full strength coming out of the lift - which bought me to my senses quick sharp.

G/L

 

[pboyles]

Where were you, the Travelodge in Luton?

 

[Mr Woozel]

He was doing free seminars with ETX a while back to get sign up to SB..I went along as I was at a loose end/it was local to me, it's such an exotic name, and I needed a new mouse mat and thought there would be a few obligatory freebies going and if not - I set myself the challenge of nicking one anyway.

Sounds like you need to find yourself a hobby

 

[cablemonster]

I have got to admit the case of Anton is a bizzarre one. If I recall correctly he has golman sachs, lehman and jp morgan on his CV. It really is strange to pitch to newbies in this way. What I have learnt from some of my aquaintances who are instituional traders is that the information and tools they have at their disposal give them a considerable edge that cannot be used outside of the bank. Lets say they trade a commodity spread and have access to specific relevant flow order info, zero transaction costs you can see how they have a big edge. Also a risk manager who will remove emotion when you are unable to. I guess remove these tools and a former bank trader may struggle on the outside dunno its just bizarre like I said.

 

[the hare]

Why doesn't he trade like a professional and use the market like an ATM instead of looking for training fees ?

Perhaps he's doing it 4 d lulz ? I bet he has right laugh.

 

[wallstreetwarrior87]

I have got to admit the case of Anton is a bizzarre one. If I recall correctly he has golman sachs, lehman and jp morgan on his CV. It really is strange to pitch to newbies in this way. What I have learnt from some of my aquaintances who are instituional traders is that the information and tools they have at their disposal give them a considerable edge that cannot be used outside of the bank. Lets say they trade a commodity spread and have access to specific relevant flow order info, zero transaction costs you can see how they have a big edge. Also a risk manager who will remove emotion when you are unable to. I guess remove these tools and a former bank trader may struggle on the outside dunno its just bizarre like I said.

In reality, they only have a tiny edge, which is of no benefit to a private trader.

Its the size they deal in that makes it worthwhile.

The term professional means nothing:

Lower league football pros - £300 per week
Premier league £100,000.

Local golf pro - £22,000 per year
Tiger Woods - $10Mln

Not many of them are Tiger Woods or Fernando Torres.

 

[cablemonster]

In reality, they only have a tiny edge, which is of no benefit to a private trader.

that doesn't tally with my homework on institutional traders. one commodity trader I regularly speak to (works for large IB) say they focus on markets (Real or synthetic) where they have the greatest edge. 2 straight losing weeks and their card is already marked, back onto paper trading and increased supervision.

 

[wallstreetwarrior87]

that doesn't tally with my homework on institutional traders. one commodity trader I regularly speak to (works for large IB) say they focus on markets (Real or synthetic) where they have the greatest edge. 2 straight losing weeks and their card is already marked, back onto paper trading and increased supervision.

But does this edge still exist if they were trading their own account from home/in private?

For example;

At his/her IB a 2% return on their £1m play nets them £20,000, but would he/she be able to do this in private? Is the same edge worthwhile on a £10k account? Taking their cut into account. In relative terms its a small edge, but financially worthwhile, hence these guys stay at the IBs because they would not be able to do this in private, as they dont have the facilities to do so.

Just something to think about?

At the end of the day, if these guys are so good that they get marked after 2 weeks, why would they stay there once they knew what they were doing? Logic says its because their financial cut from the edge (even a tiny edge) they have (at an IB) is greater than they can generate on their own in private.

Comparing institution to private is very chalk and cheese.

 

[cablemonster]

But does this edge still exist if they were trading their own account from home/in private?

in this case it wouldn't be as the order flow information which is shared interbank is not accessible to the public.

At the end of the day, if these guys are so good that they get marked after 2 weeks, why would they stay there once they knew what they were doing? Logic says its because their financial cut from the edge (even a tiny edge) they have (at an IB) is greater than they can generate on their own in private.

yes I concur. the IB's hire in young, qualified, intelligent team players who are green. Train them up, put them into am experienced small team. Team has access to fundamental and technical analysts. Team has access to order flow. i.e. middle eastern chap calls up looking to hedge a **** load of something. Team has risk manager who keeps everyone in check, emotions don't take over. team focuses on non directional trades where they have the best edge.

if said trader leaves he is on his todd. his chances of success are clearly much higher due to his training but he still has to work his edge without the order flow info and manage his own risk.

 

[D70]

in this case it wouldn't be as the order flow information which is shared interbank is not accessible to the public.




yes I concur. the IB's hire in young, qualified, intelligent team players who are green. Train them up, put them into am experienced small team. Team has access to fundamental and technical analysts. Team has access to order flow. i.e. middle eastern chap calls up looking to hedge a **** load of something. Team has risk manager who keeps everyone in check, emotions don't take over. team focuses on non directional trades where they have the best edge.

if said trader leaves he is on his todd. his chances of success are clearly much higher due to his training but he still has to work his edge without the order flow info and manage his own risk.

And let's not forget. Your mate at bank x gets 120k a year whether his 'trading' makes money or not.

 

[cablemonster]

And let's not forget. Your mate at bank x gets 120k a year whether his 'trading' makes money or not.

sure the lack of monetary pressure really helps. make no mistake though 2 losing weeks on the bounce and you will be put on sim, keep on down that route and you would be out 3 months tops.

 

[Trader333]

In my view it is not possible to trade successfully as a home based trader using the same strategies as an institution and make any real money doing so. As others have said, the profit margin is too small and as such it is not viable.