Junior trader ... seeking a break

[SLICKtrader]

Hi,

I wanted to ask a question that has been on my mind for a while now and seen as though I only signed up with this website a couple of days ago I figured why not, there are loads of friendly people on this website.

My question is plain and simply, How can I pursue a career in trading?? How can I get into the business within the city of London? Please can someone tell me! Help me!!

I have been round and round in circles, searched long and hard for many hours and spoken to absolutely everybody imaginable, with some advice on how to get into the industry! Now this has been going on for 2 years now since I was 16. I am now almost 19 and still have not gotten any closer to my dream.

I know that this may not be up everybody's street and I know that it is a stressful job, I have done a lot of research but I really would love to trade in the city with the buzz, and the atmosphere of everything!

I am very willing to start right at the bottom and work my way up, I am a very quick learner and extremely positive and enthusiastic!

There are loads of recruiting websites out there that hire traders who have been in the business for many years, or graduates who have a degree in maths and a PhD. I Haven't got time for those things I just want to be trained and a job within this sector.

I have tried:

Newspapers
Emailing Investment banks
Mailing investment banks
Websites
..etc.. but still no luck.

If anyone could help me with my question I would be most greatful, any advice please!!

Thank you very much I very ,much appreciate it.
Kind regards
Andi aka SLICKtrader.

 

[Skimbleshanks]

I've moved your thread onto the Trading for a Living board, as this is where all the chat is about trading for companies and institutions. I presume you've read your way through all the posts on this forum for ideas?

 

[SLICKtrader]

A few yes but thank You anyway, Ishould have thought of that.

 

[TWI]

It is not easy if you want somebody else to pay you to do this job and even harder these days if you do not fall into a category of 1st from top university. Even for the jobs that have a slim prospect of getting to the trading desk one day in the distant future it is only grads that need apply. The reason is simple supply/demand.
Don't give up hope but the best thing to do if you want to trade so badly is to try and save some cash, read all you can and learn from people on boards like this, keep applying for anything and everything as you may get lucky, but ultimately consider that you need to take those savings and learn to trade for yourself.

 

[SLICKtrader]

twalker,

Thanks for the advice, I will bear this in mind. Although I was taking to someone last week who said that he wrote a cover letter to a bank saying that he would work his way up and they accepted him by using him as a tea by for 6 months or so learning the ropes and then eventually letting him trade.

Do you think it is worth trying to get a degree in maths or something?

SLICKtrader

 

[blau]

Possible the easiest way is to start of with some experience in backoffice by learning the markets, then possible onto middle office or front office.

This is exactly what i did and found it to be the easiest route, although i am a graduate and a chartered accountant.

Coldslam all brokerage houses in London and ask for any junior positions within the firm. The most important thing is getting a foot in the door within a trading environment, and if you prove worthy, ask to be moved to the tradning desks.

You may want to use yell.com and search for stockbrokers/brokerage houses/investment houses in london.

OR

Look on the London Stock Exchange webpage to look at members.

Hope this helps. Good luck and dont give up.

Bob

 

[momoney]

Remember people are quick to judge,
get your product knowledge up to speed before asking too many questions on the trading floor

i've seen many a junior permanently relegated to the back/middle office for asking questions they really should have investigated on their own time!!!

 

[Skimbleshanks]

I suggest you also take a long hard look at the way the companies get their first impression of you, in other words the presentation of yourself in your CV and covering letter. Decisions are often made within seconds of looking at a CV, just by the appearance of it. Are you sending your application to the correct person, correctly named, with the correct address - or are you just sending a circular letter? Circulars fly with great speed into the round filing cabinet on the floor. You have to personalise each letter and CV to show that you've at least taken the time and trouble to bother.

 

[SLICKtrader]

Thank you all for the great feed back, Blau your info helps a lot I will be looking on yell and learining much more.

What is back and middle office? may I ask, I don't mean to sound stupied but I am a newbie.

Skimbleshanks, I have a CV and a cover letter which I send around, but I think they may be put off by the CV as it has no relevance to trading what so ever.

 

[olwenh]

I hope you achieve what you dream of, but the things that struck me were that

1. You say you've done loads of research, but don't appear to know too much about the workings of the business - front/back office.
2. You haven't put the effort in to search thru this site.
3. You've wanted this for 2 years and now at nearly 19 your wondering whether to get a maths degree. You know already what they are looking for. Are you doing maths A level? Have you applied to University? If your maths degree material, you should get it anyway.
3. Sorry if it I seem harsh, but it seems to me you just want to trade without the effort required to get there. And I really do wish you well, just the impression I get & believe me it's a tough world out there, no-one will give you anything for nothing. Harsh but true.

Good luck.

 

[neil]

She's right you know

I hope you achieve what you dream of, but the things that struck me were that

1. You say you've done loads of research, but don't appear to know too much about the workings of the business - front/back office.
2. You haven't put the effort in to search thru this site.
3. You've wanted this for 2 years and now at nearly 19 your wondering whether to get a maths degree. You know already what they are looking for. Are you doing maths A level? Have you applied to University? If your maths degree material, you should get it anyway.
3. Sorry if it I seem harsh, but it seems to me you just want to trade without the effort required to get there. And I really do wish you well, just the impression I get & believe me it's a tough world out there, no-one will give you anything for nothing. Harsh but true.

Good luck.

Get a maths degree to provide you with a spring board to several careers - THEN try trading; if you fail then you have a degree sought after by employers to enable you to have a crack at another career.

 

[Chrissy T]

I think the advice that has been posted above is very useful. At 19 I was in my 2nd year at Uni and just thinking about a career in the City. I suggest (like several above) that you get a good degree, such as Maths (I got Mechanical Engineering with Financial Management). I also suggest that over the first few years you should really push to get summer placements in either Investment Banks or a Hedge Fund, in the Back Office. Even if it is Data Input for the first placement it at least gets it on your CV. Once you have started a basic job in the City then you will know people who know people and you can start trying to get friendly with traders, and hopefully your final year placement will be a front office one.
After Uni it took me a year to get a job in the City (moved from Glasgow) and it was a back office job. I already had several (top) Trader contacts in the City at this point but you need some experience generally before you can make way onto the Trading floor. Within four months of starting the Back office job I was lucky enough to get onto the Graduate scheme at GNI. Unfortunately this ended when we got bought over but that experience meant that I found i easier to get a Trading job (Futures spreads). I did this for a while then moved onto Options Market Making for a Hedge Fund.

So, at 26, and determined to be a Trader 7 years ago (but not really knowing much) , I have finally made it as a Junior Trader. So again, the advice to you is get your degree, get some relevant (financial) experience, make contacts and fight your way through to the front office....

If you are determined enough you WILL succeed...

Good Luck,

Chris

 

[SLICKtrader]

Chrissy T,

I think I am just looking for the easy root to the top but what you have said has put things into perspective for me and as well as olwenh, even if it was a slap in the face good advice any how.

So your all suggesting that I get a degree, learn as much as I can and then make the move. I now know that I should have started earlier with Uni. I'm not sure if it is to late to start now, but I am determined so I think I will have to.

 

[olwenh]

Slicktrader,

I'm glad you took the advice in the manner it was intended.

After all, why would any bank put £000,000 (add as many 0's as you like) of their money and their client's money in your hands unless you can prove you've got a track record of commitment (ie studying for a degree).

Good luck

 

[Chrissy T]

I did a 5 year course at Uni (Masters in Scotland) and finished this when i was 23, so you are not too old to start Uni - just find the right course at the right uni at start it in sept!

A I said earlier, if you really want it....

 

[Robertral]

Plain and simple...there are four routes: Grad scheme at an IB (forget a hedge fund as they don't recruit grads, execpt PhD's and masters -if in FM), being the son of the MD, starting in the back office, or call up a stock broker and start on 12K......
If you want I can send you some sites where there are loads of trainee trading or broking jobs......
Just make sure you know your stuff....You have to think "Why should they hire me?"...know the products liek the back of your hand......You only need maths if you are going onto a derivatives desk...
What kind of trading do you want to do? buy side, sell side? prop???
What si your background??? tell us all more and maybe we can help more.......

 

[olwenh]

Great signature Robert - love it.

 

[SLICKtrader]

Nice one guys! I am seriously thinking about going to uni then now.

 

[SLICKtrader]

Robertral, The would be great if you could send me those websites, I have got some more address which I will be sending my cover letter to.

I am reading and trying a lot of different trading methods but I defiantly need to think about what I want to focus on. I really would like to be at IG index as a spread trader though.

My experience is minimal but I am trying hard!

 

[blau]

If you are looking to go into Spradbetting or CFD then try other trading houses.

There are many in the market ie CMC, Cantor Index, finspreads etc.