Be A Master Trader In Any Market You Choose, Very Simple

[TradingMasters]

You guys are making so much sense, I never looked at it in that way. you sure opened my eyes to alot of stuff. Even thought you may want to help people, the intention is good but can be just as bad because people have different trading attitudes etc.

 

[SOCRATES]

You guys are making so much sense, I never looked at it in that way. you sure opened my eyes to alot of stuff. Even thought you may want to help people, the intention is good but can be just as bad because people have different trading attitudes etc.

Not quite, your sentiments are admirable but naive.

You will find, as time goes by and you gain experience, that the the great majority are beyond help.

 

[Splitlink]

rols, I like what you said in the thread trading ideas, I have read alot od posts here and on other forums and it seems as if 90% or them are looking for help with something

These forums would not exist if it was not for the fact that traders, especially new ones, are looking for a form of communication with their own kind. Web trading is a very lonely business and there is, in most of us, a part that wants to get out and express itself to someone who, it is hoped , has similar interests. These forums provide that service.

Unfortunately, this has many drawbacks. It does not take into account that we will, probably, never know who the other poster really is, whether he is successful, or not, whether he has ever traded in his life or, even, how old he is. Therefore, seeking people who know, a mentor, to help one through a trade is more than one should hope to find, although it is possible. The site should only be used to express oneself and to kick around ideas. I have received any number of good ideas here and from unexpected quarters, not always from the experts who, I may add, may be well meaning , but allow their egos to occupy 80% of what they want to say.

Split

 

[epic767]

I Dont understand how you can lose money in a market whose average return during the last 12 month was 28 percent.

 

[Splitlink]

Epic767,

It is not only possible, but likely for most of us who trade short term. In today and out tomorrow means getting involved in short term market movements and most get it wrong. Unfortunately, those who get it wrong may come to boards, such as this, and may come across another who got it wrong but who pretends that he got it right. These traders' egos will not admit to being wrong and they are the ones most dangerous, as they give a false impression that everything in the garden is rosy.

Split

 

[Charlton]

Trading - a journey ?

You guys are making so much sense, I never looked at it in that way. you sure opened my eyes to alot of stuff. Even thought you may want to help people, the intention is good but can be just as bad because people have different trading attitudes etc.

According to my OED a mentor is an experienced and trusted advisor, whose root 'men' means to think.

You have, unwittingly, come to a realisation as I have done myself through observing for a couple of years these threads (especially those of Socrates) that you cannot be taught to become a trader by anyone. However, if you are ready for it, your thoughts and intuition may be "switched on" by the words you read here bringing you to a point of reality and awareness.

My dictionary also states that Mentor was adviser of the young Telemachus in Homer's Odyssey. This is a story of the treacherous journey by Odysseus through many lands facing many adversities over 20 years. He wished to return home to Ithica, but he could not truly return home for he was changed by his journey. He could see more clearly.

 

[scrappy]

According to my OED a mentor is an experienced and trusted advisor, whose root 'men' means to think.

You have, unwittingly, come to a realisation as I have done myself through observing for a couple of years these threads (especially those of Socrates) that you cannot be taught to become a trader by anyone. However, if you are ready for it, your thoughts and intuition may be "switched on" by the words you read here bringing you to a point of reality and awareness.

My dictionary also states that Mentor was adviser of the young Telemachus in Homer's Odyssey. This is a story of the treacherous journey by Odysseus through many lands facing many adversities over 20 years. He wished to return home to Ithica, but he could not truly return home for he was changed by his journey. He could see more clearly.

The problem, in my opinion, many would be mentors face and are unaware of , including socrates, is creating a structure of understanding and then the ability to convert that understanding to realisation, through a process of guidance (one which only experienced traders will have knowledge of). The understanding part of the equation is easy, the realsation part requires something else.

Books cannot achieve this, only an excercise in intellectual understanding. The process of realisation can either be learned by going through the mill that many traders attempt solely, or be guided by someone who understands the elements of trading and knows how to 'interact' with the maket.

Not all succesful traders are unable to bring this process of realisation about because they don't think about the teaching, just the doing.

Without this, traders are lost in a boundless world of opportunity. It is this world of immense opportunity, without order, that brings rise to all the emotions associated with trading.

 

[bodebliss]

This is absolutely correct. My compliments to you.

And you can talk yourself blue in the face and not only does it not land, but the rewards are abuse and disrespect in exchange for the benefits of hard earned knowledge and experience over many years at enormous personal cost.

Therefore there is a line in the sand that must prudently not be crossed, except in exceptional circumstances and with regard only to what can be described as truly gifted individuals.

That is why I keep saying that traders are born and not made, but very few indeed are able to understand this or indeed accept it.

Oh this is so good!

'You can lead horses to water , but you can't make them drink"

You try(out of human compassion) to teach someone to make profits by trading and you will get slapped so much it will make you bitter.

The prob is first they have to master their emotions, so they can follow detailed instructions.

It takes years, and new traders want it all now. They think that if they aren't immediately successful your holding back on them(cause markets look simple) and they wander off.

If you think you'd like to teach new traders, just get a dog and teach it tricks. It would be vastly more satisfying.

 

[scrappy]

'That is why I keep saying that traders are born and not made, but very few indeed are able to understand this or indeed accept it.'

Is this a reflection of a mentors incompetency to teach?

 

[bodebliss]

"The process of realisation can either be learned by going through the mill that many traders attempt solely, or be guided by someone who understands the elements of trading and knows how to 'interact' with the maket. "

I'd prefer the former for most would-be traders know-it-alls.

"Without this, traders are lost in a boundless world of opportunity. It is this world of immense opportunity, without order, that brings rise to all the emotions associated with trading."

No, that does not bring rise to all the emotions associated with trading. You can't sit there and say people can be saved from themselves. Emotions must be mastered internally, till that is complete info is useless.

I could say concentrate on one market(let's say Forex) and one contract (euro) and you will never have to learn any other means of making money till I'm blue in the face. The rest of your trading carreer could be spent there. The trouble is new-bes don't want to do the work it would take to master this one small task. They want the solution handed to them, and handed to them each and every time. Experienced traders don't want to babysit a trader for the years it would take to make them whole.

I think Socrates is right. Traders who will sit and watch charts till their eyes turn red. Go w/o sleep while they work a job and try to understand trading 3-6 hrs per day.Lose their account several times, but keep coming back. Drive their friends and family crazy with their desire to trade. Finally making the breakthru, after many , many dark days are rare and born to it.

God Bless the Traders!

 

[scrappy]

"The process of realisation can either be learned by going through the mill that many traders attempt solely, or be guided by someone who understands the elements of trading and knows how to 'interact' with the maket. "

I'd prefer the former for most would-be traders know-it-alls.

"Without this, traders are lost in a boundless world of opportunity. It is this world of immense opportunity, without order, that brings rise to all the emotions associated with trading."

No, that does not bring rise to all the emotions associated with trading. You can't sit there and say people can be saved from themselves. Emotions must be mastered internally, till that is complete info is useless.

I could say concentrate on one market(let's say Forex) and one contract (euro) and you will never have to learn any other means of making money till I'm blue in the face. The rest of your trading carreer could be spent there. The trouble is new-bes don't want to do the work it would take to master this one small task. They want the solution handed to them, and handed to them each and every time. Experienced traders don't want to babysit a trader for the years it would take to make them whole.

I think Socrates is right. Traders who will sit and watch charts till their eyes turn red. Go w/o sleep while they work a job and try to understand trading 3-6 hrs per day.Lose their account several times, but keep coming back. Drive their friends and family crazy with their desire to trade. Finally making the breakthru, after many , many dark days are rare and born to it.

God Bless the Traders!

You are quite right, maybe from your own experiences, i dont know. This is the exact experience of most of the traders. I have been through the same process, some of my trader friends have too, other trader friends experienced sucess through the mentoring process. The difference in our experiences and learning is defined by how we mastered these emotions. One experience through anguish and emotional turmoil, the other a more controlled and organised approach. All arrived at the same goal.

Unfortunatly many tradres will disagree because they can only relate their own experiences.From my own experience the turmoil only stopped once guidance began to create order in the chaos of it all.

God bless the mentors