Are you trading a slot machine with payout rules?

[Martin Cole]

Have you ever wondered why, when you enter a market, that market almost instantly (even if you ultimately have the future direction correct) moves against you and takes your position out of the money?

The why, is because 90% of the time when you push the buy or sell button on your dealing platform you have been manipulated into doing so. To this some traders will instantly defend their trading decisions and say “no, that is not so, I only enter when my trading system tells me to” What these traders fail to realise is that the Market Makers are manipulating the traders BELIEFS about future price, and they are doing this by causing standard market indicators to come into play when they want them to. Market Makers MAKE a market, this is their role, THIS is what they do.

How do Market Makers Manipulate
Market Maker manipulation is not carried out on a surface level. By surface level I am referring to the charts that you see on your screens. 90% of traders look at charts to try to glean meaning from movement and patterns. This is a facade, a facade presented by the industry to achieve one outcome, an outcome similar to a slot machine.

Let’s pause for a moment to consider the outcomes of a slot machine.

1. You can win on a slot machine
2. You can lose on a slot machine
3. Slot machines have payout rules.

The outside perception of a slot machine is that it is there for a bit of fun and you can win if you play and this next spin COULD be your big win. At the heart of a slot machine is a set of rules but contrary to popular belief these are not payout rules. They are KEEP PLAYING rules. By paying out ‘just enough’ to keep you interested and presenting to you the POSSIBILITY of the big win you will keep feeding the machine. The machine that is ALWAYS removing a percentage for the machine owner and tax man.
There is nothing covert about this, we know the rules (although there are some that think they have a ‘system’ to beat the slots’) yet you see people pumping in money for hours on end with their own ‘lucky wrist flick’ that gives them the edge over the electronics. Lunacy, yes but that does not stop them playing.

The Market Makers manipulate the biggest slot machine in the world.

Just like the rules of the electronic slot machine, the financial markets have rules. The spinning wheels that you see on the slot machine are the market charts you see on your screen. The ‘patterns’ that you are told to trade provide the payout percentage for you and the payout percentage for the machine owners. (The Market Makers)
This outcome is just like the slot machine that has pre programmed payout rules. The outcome desired has one single purpose which is to KEEP YOU PLAYING.

You will never beat the Market Makers but you can join them.

Joining the Market Makers involves the abandoning of charting patterns, standard indicators, and $97.00 secrets. It involves the learning of how the Market Makers run their business. Learning how to read the one true constant of the financial markets which is the manipulation of traders BELIEFS about future price. Once you understand how your beliefs are manipulated as a trader and then apply that understanding to the market, never again will you look at the markets and experience a feeling of unknowing or uneasiness.
This is an original article by Martin Cole. Forex Trader for near 20 years

Please note* These are MY opinions, I have traded my opinions for near 20 years. If you have different opinions and trade them successfully then they are every bit as valid to you as mine are to me.

 

[Shakone]

Are you a vendor? Can you give an example of what you are saying?

 

[DashRiprock]

if i was knight capital i would paint the chart too

 

[Martin Cole]

Are you a vendor? Can you give an example of what you are saying?

Hi When you say vendor, yes I do offer training however, I have NO intention of promoting anything I do or any links, neither am I giving any reference to my site. Actually I will not if even requested give a link to my site as this simply devalues what I am trying to say in this article and turns it into a self promotion exercise and lets face it the world is full of articles like that.
I have traded my theory for near 20 years and now that I have some occasional time on my hands I thought I would post a few articles to stimulate what others might believe about the market. (Believe being the operative word)
I was thinking of registering under a sexy sounding name to hide my identity but one of my pet peeves is how people hide behind pseudo names so they can often abuse from a distance. People would be a lot more open, honest and considerate to others if they were forced to register and display their real names. (But hey! that's just another one of my opinions)

As for your request for an example, I am willing to answer any direct questions on here but I don't want to get into the personal contact with loads of emails to respond to.

Basically what I am saying is that my stand on the market is one of manipulation COMPLETE manipulation at all times. I am saying there are rules of manipulation that use 'standard' indicators to cause traders to enter the market at let us say 'less than advantageous times"

The above are MY opinions and the world is full of opinions none of which are necessarily correct.

I think that if a trader is open minded enough to look at things from a different perspective this can never be a bad thing.

 

[Martin Cole]

if i was knight capital i would paint the chart too

Who is knight capital? Have I missed something here?

 

[Shakone]

Ok Martin, can you give an example. And by that I mean, you post a chart(s) of something, including those standard indicators you mentioned are used, you discuss where the manipulation is taking place, and what the manipulators are doing to manipulate/what is their goal, and discuss how this can be spotted in real time.

 

[Martin Cole]

Ok Martin, can you give an example. And by that I mean, you post a chart(s) of something, including those standard indicators you mentioned are used, you discuss where the manipulation is taking place, and what the manipulators are doing to manipulate/what is their goal, and discuss how this can be spotted in real time.

Hi
I cannot post charts as I don't use standard charting software. I use bespoke software that I developed over 15 years and to be honest this software would make no sense to anyone unless they were trained to use it. Again I do not want to get into the promotion of anything here so best we just keep the software out of it.

When I say standard indicators I am referring to anything from a simple moving average upwards to every standard indicator that you will find in off the shelf charting software. Remember that anyone will show you yesterdays chart and tell you how you could have or would have.

Try to come at this from a different angle.......IF you were a market maker looking to accumulate buys, you would need the outside market to SELL to you. IF you were a Market Maker, how would you do this?
The ONLY way you could do this is to convince the masses that it would be in their own interest to SELL to you, once the masses start selling to you, then you as a MM start buying for the ALREADY known about underlying demand in the market place.

Remember.... the 'news' that so many place value on, is generated BY the MM and fed to the media. If you are a journalist you don't go to a don nut factory to find out about the demand for the USD against the GBP.You go the City and here the city feed the media the news they want to be released.

Try asking uncomfortable questions, questions that if you are truthful you already know at least part of the answer to.

Everyone wants you to trade with them. Every broker is the best broker, every broker has the best spreads, every broker gives you free charts with a 100's of indicators, every broker is giving you free trading lessons.
Then you have the army of promoters of brokers who then get a commission on every trade you place, saying these are prolific is an understatement.
The other day I was offered a deal where I could get commission on the money a trader LOST in the market. (this was a broker that was actually trading AGAINST its clients)

To succeed as a trader in the long haul (I am meaning 10 years not 10 trades) you (in my opinion) need to view the market from the inside out, not the outside in. You have to throw away the façade and delve into the dirty workings of manipulation.

Belief is where the answer lies, belief is the underlying single element at the back of EVERY one of your trades, every one of your trading decisions. If you doubt this then try buying something when you believe the price is going to fall.

First you need to understand how a belief is born, goes through its life cycle and then dies. (this can be any belief about any topic, and some beliefs you will take to the grave)
Then you need to apply this same birth death cycle to the market. THEN you add in how beliefs can be manipulated to produce desired results.

Were there Weapons of Mass Destruction or not? The fact of the matter is inconsequential, the only thing that matters is whether enough people are convinced there were.

I have met traders who are in their 10th year STILL looking for and still tweaking every known indicator known to man and then some. This normally takes place at the end of the week when they scan back through the chart with the burning thought......if only!

Why would they do this after 10 years? BELIEF that they will find the secret key.

There is no secret, there is no magic formula, there is no robot that deposits money into your trading account.

The only ONE constant is the BELIEF that you MUST develop within yourself before you commit to pushing the buy or sell button.

 

[Shakone]

All these beliefs about manipulation are fine. But as with any theory, it is useless unless it can be put into practice and explained clearly or demonstrated by example. You haven't provided any clear example.

If you say standard indicators like moving averages etc are used by the market manipulators, then they must be aware of where these indicators are in order to use them, and if you are aware of that, you too must be aware of those indicators and so you must have a chart of them or their values.

A chart of an instrument on some timeframe should not be hard to access for someone who has traded many years. And you should be able to demonstrate what you're talking about on a chart. But failing that, you can discuss in detail the movements of some instrument recently, and discuss what was occurring and when, and how that relates to what you're talking about. We can then look at our charts and try to relate. Unless you can do that, there's really no substance to anything you say. Sorry if that seems a little harsh, but it's very easy to have long abstract discussions about trading, but eventually you need to get practical.

 

[DashRiprock]

Who is knight capital? Have I missed something here?

http://www.knight.com/

Knight Capital are one of the biggest market making companies in the USA.

but they do what you say they do, they get orders from institutional clients first thing, and then they "paint the chart" to get retail liquidity on the side they want to deal on in the stock. A bit more to it than that but thats the basics. obviousy a bit of a generalisation but I read an interview with a knight trader who basically admitted it. It was a while ago though.

I also agree with you about your beliefs and stuff but your posts are long and I'm too lazy to read them in full.

 

[Splitlink]

Have you ever wondered why, when you enter a market, that market almost instantly (even if you ultimately have the future direction correct) moves against you and takes your position out of the money?

The why, is because 90% of the time when you push the buy or sell button on your dealing platform you have been manipulated into doing so. To this some traders will instantly defend their trading decisions and say “no, that is not so, I only enter when my trading system tells me to” What these traders fail to realise is that the Market Makers are manipulating the traders BELIEFS about future price, and they are doing this by causing standard market indicators to come into play when they want them to. Market Makers MAKE a market, this is their role, THIS is what they do.

How do Market Makers Manipulate
Market Maker manipulation is not carried out on a surface level. By surface level I am referring to the charts that you see on your screens. 90% of traders look at charts to try to glean meaning from movement and patterns. This is a facade, a facade presented by the industry to achieve one outcome, an outcome similar to a slot machine.

Let’s pause for a moment to consider the outcomes of a slot machine.

1. You can win on a slot machine
2. You can lose on a slot machine
3. Slot machines have payout rules.

The outside perception of a slot machine is that it is there for a bit of fun and you can win if you play and this next spin COULD be your big win. At the heart of a slot machine is a set of rules but contrary to popular belief these are not payout rules. They are KEEP PLAYING rules. By paying out ‘just enough’ to keep you interested and presenting to you the POSSIBILITY of the big win you will keep feeding the machine. The machine that is ALWAYS removing a percentage for the machine owner and tax man.
There is nothing covert about this, we know the rules (although there are some that think they have a ‘system’ to beat the slots’) yet you see people pumping in money for hours on end with their own ‘lucky wrist flick’ that gives them the edge over the electronics. Lunacy, yes but that does not stop them playing.

The Market Makers manipulate the biggest slot machine in the world.

Just like the rules of the electronic slot machine, the financial markets have rules. The spinning wheels that you see on the slot machine are the market charts you see on your screen. The ‘patterns’ that you are told to trade provide the payout percentage for you and the payout percentage for the machine owners. (The Market Makers)
This outcome is just like the slot machine that has pre programmed payout rules. The outcome desired has one single purpose which is to KEEP YOU PLAYING.

You will never beat the Market Makers but you can join them.

Joining the Market Makers involves the abandoning of charting patterns, standard indicators, and $97.00 secrets. It involves the learning of how the Market Makers run their business. Learning how to read the one true constant of the financial markets which is the manipulation of traders BELIEFS about future price. Once you understand how your beliefs are manipulated as a trader and then apply that understanding to the market, never again will you look at the markets and experience a feeling of unknowing or uneasiness.
This is an original article by Martin Cole. Forex Trader for near 20 years

Please note* These are MY opinions, I have traded my opinions for near 20 years. If you have different opinions and trade them successfully then they are every bit as valid to you as mine are to me.

True, sometimes, but I frequently breakeven and/or go into profit, as well.

 

[Martin Cole]

I have not traded with standard charts or any conventional indicator for possibly 15 years. I have no interest or desire to do so.
You say I am not not practical, but I think I am very practical, I wanted to start a discussion on trading beliefs, you now seem to want chart analysis lessons and how you can then apply these to your trading charts. I am sorry that you find no substance in what I say. I am quite willing to post a chart from my screen but what purpose will that serve other than you asking me to then explain my charts which would instantly be seen as self promotion (which is exactly what it would be)

This is really my first foray into a forum as I have never found any value in them because more often than not it is the blind leading the blind and everyone is looking for what I call the 97 Dollar secret. I suspect I have actually made a serious error of judgement in posting here at all.

I think it wise for a moderator to remove the entire post, so as to not cause any further issues. (If you are a moderator reading this please do this)

 

[Martin Cole]

http://www.knight.com/

Knight Capital are one of the biggest market making companies in the USA.

but they do what you say they do, they get orders from institutional clients first thing, and then they "paint the chart" to get retail liquidity on the side they want to deal on in the stock. A bit more to it than that but thats the basics. obviousy a bit of a generalisation but I read an interview with a knight trader who basically admitted it. It was a while ago though.

I also agree with you about your beliefs and stuff but your posts are long and I'm too lazy to read them in full.

Oh! OK thanks for the heads up.
I will try to post short, but already I have run into trouble with one user wanting me to deliver a 'system' so that they can duplicate something that cannot be duplicated.

Have a great day
Martin

 

[Splitlink]

I have not traded with standard charts or any conventional indicator for possibly 15 years. I have no interest or desire to do so.
You say I am not not practical, but I think I am very practical, I wanted to start a discussion on trading beliefs, you now seem to want chart analysis lessons and how you can then apply these to your trading charts. I am sorry that you find no substance in what I say. I am quite willing to post a chart from my screen but what purpose will that serve other than you asking me to then explain my charts which would instantly be seen as self promotion (which is exactly what it would be)

This is really my first foray into a forum as I have never found any value in them because more often than not it is the blind leading the blind and everyone is looking for what I call the 97 Dollar secret. I suspect I have actually made a serious error of judgement in posting here at all.

I think it wise for a moderator to remove the entire post, so as to not cause any further issues. (If you are a moderator reading this please do this)

There are some trigger happy members here and, sometimes, they have good reason to be so but I sometimes feel that they like to make a name for themselves by being the vigilante on the block.

If you want to post here then you will have to bear with that.

 

[DashRiprock]

Oh! OK thanks for the heads up.
I will try to post short, but already I have run into trouble with one user wanting me to deliver a 'system' so that they can duplicate something that cannot be duplicated.

Have a great day
Martin

i think you are a spammer!!

the reason you won't post a link or anything is that if you google "Martin Cole Forex" your site is the first one! And you pretend that not hiding behind a nickname is a virtue!

Anyway, what you are talking about manipulation and things are OK in thinks like stocks and futures but I'm not sure the same rules apply to forex markets for a few reasons that I won't go into.

 

[Shakone]

Not being a vigilante here Splitlink. I asked for an example to demonstrate what he is talking about, that's quite a normal way of teaching, learning. I also said, he doesn't need to post a chart if he can't, but perhaps pick an instrument of his choice, and discuss how he viewed it explicitly, and what he believed was happening and why. If you can't explain explicitly by an example of what you're saying either visually or with words, then there's not much that can be done is there?

The rest is just general comments, that are fine (as I said), but I've read similar things a hundred times.

 

[the hare]

Time to end this feckin nonsense.

If what this vendor says is true, then simply fading TA patterns would work. It does not work.

There are some very stupid dunces posting at the zoo, but even creatures of this limited intelligence would soon work out that doing the opposite of what they are being conned into doing by an indicator might just be profitable.

I'm not sure where exactly the 90% of positions immediately go against you nonsense comes from. I'm sat here looking at MFE and MAE data obtained from RANDOM entries pratically pissing myself laughing.

My method employs a directional bias (based on TA), and as part of my ongoing monitoring I also trade the inverse of that bias (on a small live account). If my bias wasnt working, the inverse would result in an increase in win rate and profits from the inverse trades. Trading the inverse signal has lost me **** loads of money for the last 8 years !

T2W really is a marketers paradise,

 

[DashRiprock]

Time to end this feckin nonsense.

If what this vendor says is true, then simply fading TA patterns would work. It does not work.

There are some very stupid dunces posting at the zoo, but even creatures of this limited intelligence would soon work out that doing the opposite of what they are being conned into doing by an indicator might just be profitable.

I'm not sure where exactly the 90% of positions immediately go against you nonsense comes from. I'm sat here looking at MFE and MAE data obtained from RANDOM entries pratically pissing myself laughing.

My method employs a directional bias (based on TA), and as part of my ongoing monitoring I also trade the inverse of that bias (on a small live account). If my bias wasnt working, the inverse would result in an increase in win rate and profits from the inverse trades. Trading the inverse signal has lost me **** loads of money for the last 8 years !

T2W really is a marketers paradise,

to be fair I don't think that's what he said.

what i think he meant that sometimes, when market makers or big buyside / sellside traders have an order to work, they will manipulate the price action in some way that encourages flow onto the bid or offer depending on what they want to do.

that isn't bullsh!t, that happens every day.

 

[Splitlink]

Not being a vigilante here Splitlink. I asked for an example to demonstrate what he is talking about, that's quite a normal way of teaching, learning. I also said, he doesn't need to post a chart if he can't, but perhaps pick an instrument of his choice, and discuss how he viewed it explicitly, and what he believed was happening and why. If you can't explain explicitly by an example of what you're saying either visually or with words, then there's not much that can be done is there?

The rest is just general comments, that are fine (as I said), but I've read similar things a hundred times.

There's nothing wrong with being a vigilante,mate, as long as they are right. He wants to express his views here,well, he will have to gain the respect of the people who read him, otherwise he will go the way of a lot of others.

In any case, I was not meaning you. The ones I mean will not be long in making an appearance.

 

[the hare]

to be fair I don't think that's what he said.

what i think he meant that sometimes, when market makers or big buyside / sellside traders have an order to work, they will manipulate the price action in some way that encourages flow onto the bid or offer depending on what they want to do.

I dont deny that happens. His pitch however is that there is deliberate manipulation that effects indicators. I know that that this sort of manipluation strategy is taught as part of quantatative finance courses at least within 2 UK universities, and is possibly even more widespread.

However, there's a few problems, the lagging nature of indicators for a start means that any any price action manipulation needs to be of a longer term nature before it even shows up on the radar. Lets be honest, by the time the dunces at the back of the class has worked out a short term move is underway, its generally over. If there's longer term manipulation, then its generally of a magnitude great enough to benefit from.

Its the comments about 90% of positions immedately move against you when taking a TA based signal. I've never heard anything quite so ridiculous, how long do you think such a massive edge would sit there undiscovered ?

 

[megamuel]

He's not gonna tell anyone how its done you need to buy his software which shows you where the market maker manipulation is! After all, "Learning to see clearly Market Maker money making activity, using my software, is what my method of trading is all about." According to his website.

Martin sir, maybe a better way of promoting your product would be to A. Register as a vendor. This is because you have commercial interests. That's fair, nobody minds that (with a few exceptions) as long as you register. And, B. Maybe offer someone free training in return for a review. A positive review from a well respected member of this forum could bring in a lot of business for you.

Good luck,

Sam.