What's this Elliot Wave Indicator for the FX market all about?

[ChowClown]

Hi BB,

Before opening a live account with FXCM, I requested two demo extensions. Customer service / support side has been very good, so far.

Today's mission is to work out how the 3 indicators need to 'line up' (as stated by the 4xtrend blurb). We already know the numeric values are more important than the visual pattern and there are a few sites detailing EW Oscillators, so it might not be too difficult to work out.....;-)

 

[Mark Hellikson]

Curious New 4X Trader

I check my charts at either 17:00 (est) that 10pm uk that is when my chart plug-in for FXCM has its end of day or at 5am uk time ( I have found trading from 5am is more profitable then over night)

Let’s work on 5am UK time. I place my buy or sell on each currency as the indicator tells me, set stop losses then forget about it until I get to work. Now this seems very simple and some people may say very stupid and I would have agreed but at the moment it’s profitable not stupid.

Example: yesterday I placed 2 trades at 5.30am. got to work at 7am then checked my trades and guess what 65pip profit in 2 hours, my days money made, I should have gone home

Hello Carpe,

I could really use your help...

I'm new to 4X trading and trying to use the 4X Made Easy software. Can you tell me if you're talking about two different days in regards to the time (17:00 est) you look at your charts to the time you place your 4x orders (5:00 AM)? The times above are confusing to me.

Thanks a lot.

 

[Salty Gibbon]

Does the 4xTrade method advocate the use of a spread betting company or a Direct Access broker and is any special costly software required ?

 

[Torch]

You can extend your FXCM demo for as long as you need to practise, is what I was told at a seminar in July. However, I'd have thought it would be better to have the indicators installed on the platform you're actually trading on, as there is always going to be variation between MM quotes. (I like Dealbook 2 which is the GFT platform, whose charting etc is really nice.)

Carpe, does the system make it easy to install the indicators manually on other platforms (such as CMS Visual Trading or Dealbook etc) or are you kind of dependant on FXCM?

Also, does it say that the indicator is equally as successful for intraday/scalping style trading? (The website is a bit fuzzy about this I thought.) For example, could someone just use it with a 5 min chart?

Thanks in advance for any info.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Update (October 8th) - my platform concern later turns out to be justified!

Caution;- to anyone reading this thread and getting excited; do you feel your hand going to your pocket?
Are you saying to yourself 'Ah what the hey, it's only thirty quid and it looks great!'

For the fullest picture (pros and cons), keep reading right to the end ... there are troubled waters ahead...

 

[Salty Gibbon]

Are the trade entry and exit signals which are generated by the 4xTrade method clear and unequivocal ?

How easy is it to mis-read the signals and enter a trade incorrectly ?

 

[CarpeUK]

You can extend your FXCM demo for as long as you need to practise, is what I was told at a seminar in July. (Then again, they said a lot of stuff.) However, I'd have thought it would be better to have the indicators installed on the platform you're actually trading on, as there is always going to be variation between MM quotes.

Carpe, does the system make it easy to install the indicators manually on other platforms (such as Visual Trading or Dealbook for example) or are you kind of dependant on FXCM's demo platform (which I would ideally never have to look at again in my life)?

Also, does it say that the indicator is equally as successful for intraday/scalping style trading? (The website is a bit fuzzy about this I thought.) For example, could someone just use it with a 5 min chart?

Thanks in advance for any info.

Torch,

i only use FXCM as the indicators are a plug-in for FXCM only. i would assume they would not work with other platforms but i cannot comment on this as i have never tried.

The stratagy is designed for day trading/screen watching so you can enter & exit as you need to. I am only trying out a possible thery i have come up with to try EOD trading so you dont have to screenm watch but no the original system is for day/sreen watching

The indicators can be used with a tick chart if you like but the noise is to much for me. i use a 15min chart when i get chance to screen watch..

Hope this helpds
Carpeuk

 

[CarpeUK]

I check my charts at either 17:00 (est) that 10pm uk that is when my chart plug-in for FXCM has its end of day or at 5am uk time ( I have found trading from 5am is more profitable then over night)

Let’s work on 5am UK time. I place my buy or sell on each currency as the indicator tells me, set stop losses then forget about it until I get to work. Now this seems very simple and some people may say very stupid and I would have agreed but at the moment it’s profitable not stupid.

Example: yesterday I placed 2 trades at 5.30am. got to work at 7am then checked my trades and guess what 65pip profit in 2 hours, my days money made, I should have gone home

Hello Carpe,

I could really use your help...

I'm new to 4X trading and trying to use the 4X Made Easy software. Can you tell me if you're talking about two different days in regards to the time (17:00 est) you look at your charts to the time you place your 4x orders (5:00 AM)? The times above are confusing to me.

Thanks a lot.

Mark,

The difference between EST & UK time is 5 hours. the UK is 5 hours ahead of EST. when i refer to 5am uk time this would be 00:00 EST (midnight)

If you look at the FXCM plug-ins you will notice the end of day for FX trolls over to the next day at 5pm (est) 10pm uk time. FX does not really have an EOD as the market is 24hrs so an EOD has to be set somewhere.

The EOD stuff i am trying, i do at 5am UK time (00:00 midnight EST)

Does that make sence?

Regards
CarpeUK

 

[Mark Hellikson]

Mark,

The difference between EST & UK time is 5 hours. the UK is 5 hours ahead of EST. when i refer to 5am uk time this would be 00:00 EST (midnight)

If you look at the FXCM plug-ins you will notice the end of day for FX trolls over to the next day at 5pm (est) 10pm uk time. FX does not really have an EOD as the market is 24hrs so an EOD has to be set somewhere.

The EOD stuff i am trying, i do at 5am UK time (00:00 midnight EST)

Does that make sence?

Regards
CarpeUK

That's a clearer picture for timing of your steps. I guess an outline of one of your complete trading days with labeled steps and times might help as well though.

Thanks Carpe. By discovering your thread, I may have saved around $7K by not having to purchase other FX programs/software. By the way, what does FA mean?

Incidentally, I was laid off from the IT industry in San Diego, CA, and am trying to find something I can do from home to replace that income. I'm trading with two options services right now, but would like to know more about FX.

 

[Mark Hellikson]

Carpe,

One observation I have about your remarks is that it seems you have more wins with GBR/USD than with the other two currencies related to the GBR/USD pair. I know of another FX trader who's using the eur/usd pair only as an indicator for determining the strength of entering a GBR/USD pair trade. That trader is making 200 pips/week on average. Why not trade just the GBR/USD pair?

 

[ChowClown]

...some googling has been fruitful today:

EWTrend: -1 = falling prices likely; 0 = neutral prices; +1 = rising prices likely

EWN: Elliott Wave counts (1,2,3,4,5)

EWO: difference between the 5 and 35 ma. Useful for determining whether wave 5 is likely to exceed wave 3's high (based on divergence).

Possible setups?

Buying at the end of a fourth wave retracement. Wait for the EWO to pull back to zero. Historically, this happens most of the time wave four retracements. When prices break the channel, buy the market for a wave five rally.

Selling at the end of a fifth wave rally. When wave five makes new highs, make sure the Elliott Oscillator shows divergence with its wave three peak. When five waves are complete, the market changes trend. Wait for the price to cross the channels and sell the market. The initial target is the previous wave four.

It will be interesting to see how the signals pan out over an extended period.

Good luck!

 

[CarpeUK]

Carpe,

One observation I have about your remarks is that it seems you have more wins with GBR/USD than with the other two currencies related to the GBR/USD pair. I know of another FX trader who's using the eur/usd pair only as an indicator for determining the strength of entering a GBR/USD pair trade. That trader is making 200 pips/week on average. Why not trade just the GBR/USD pair?

Mark,

You are correct i begun to notice this myself a week ago but rather then just limit myself to one currency, whilst playing with a demo account i thought i would try them all out. This strategy was designed for screen watching not EOD and in the book it tells you do not limit your self to just one currency pair because others do make big moves, this is where experience comes in and i have none

When i come to open a real account i will begin trading with only one currency pair (GBP/USD) and see where that takes me

Regards
CarpeUK

 

[CarpeUK]

...some googling has been fruitful today:

EWTrend: -1 = falling prices likely; 0 = neutral prices; +1 = rising prices likely

EWN: Elliott Wave counts (1,2,3,4,5)

EWO: difference between the 5 and 35 ma. Useful for determining whether wave 5 is likely to exceed wave 3's high (based on divergence).

Possible setups?

Buying at the end of a fourth wave retracement. Wait for the EWO to pull back to zero. Historically, this happens most of the time wave four retracements. When prices break the channel, buy the market for a wave five rally.

Selling at the end of a fifth wave rally. When wave five makes new highs, make sure the Elliott Oscillator shows divergence with its wave three peak. When five waves are complete, the market changes trend. Wait for the price to cross the channels and sell the market. The initial target is the previous wave four.

It will be interesting to see how the signals pan out over an extended period.

Good luck!

Chow,

well done for finding all the out on the web but i must say the way it is explained there as to the way it is in the book, the above makes no sense to me (well it does because i have been using it and had it explained in plain English first) but if i was new to fx and read the above i would be confused as hell

But yes the EW principle is based on the above....Now you can all see what i mean when i say you dont need to know what bloody chart pattens to look for, its all numbers

Note: there is a little more to it then just the above so please do not take that as the EW principle, it is some of it but there is a lot missing...dont want you all going broke now :cheesy:

Play Safe!!!!
CarpeUK

 

[ChowClown]

Yes, you're quite right - it shouldn't really be followed blind, as there are so many if's and buts to the analysis. Probably best to read around Elliott Basics first, which again, is freely available on the web these days and can be understood quickly (the basics that is).

Many thanks for bringing the EW indicators to our attention.

 

[Mark Hellikson]

You could read the book in about 1& half to 2 hours but with me it took about 2/3 days because I made notes whilst i was going and had to stop and start, also i was looking at the chart plug-ins to check what i was reading matched, it did

it will also depend on how much knowledge you currently have on FX, if you have the very basics like me then you may find you can do it even quicker but if you are a total beginner then it may take you a little longer. There is also a free book you can download about the basics of FX that you will be given. They suggest you read that first that will take about 30min.

If you do buy it its the Educational Manual you want not the Advanced Options Strategy.

CarpeUK

So Carpe, you didn't buy 4xTrend.com's Ultimate Trading Package offered for $169, but rather the Educational Manual for $49.00, right?

 

[CarpeUK]

Carpe,

I'm real new to Forex trading and just purchased the 4X Made Easy software which I'm trying out for a few days before the formal trading class next Thursday. I have a demo account with FXCM, and was wondering if you could help me understand how you use their "EW Indicators, and free chart plug-ins" to help you make 35-50 pips/day? I don't even know what EW stands for...

Thanks a lot.

Mark EW stands for Elliott Wave he was the gentleman that originally started predicting movement on the Dow Jones, he even predicted the 1987 market crash...freaky. If you do a search on the web you will find lots of info out about EW and if used right they can be a very good tool, some say they are still the best indicators to use.

From what i have read the EW is easy to learn (well sort of) but can take years to master

I am happy to help you install the plug-ins but i am still very new to the EW principle and i do not think i would be qualified as yet to help you with this as i am still learning myself plus i bought the book so i feel obliged not to give away the info as it would be unfair.

Hope this helps
CarpeUK

 

[CarpeUK]

So Carpe, you didn't buy 4xTrend.com's Ultimate Trading Package offered for $169, but rather the Educational Manual for $49.00, right?

yes thats right, i first bought the Educational Manual and that was so good i decided to buy the Advanced Options Strategy as well. I only bought this the weekend, i have started to read it but it is more involved then the Educational Manual.

If your new to FX do not buy the Advanced Strategy yet, it will only confuse you. Start with the Educational Manual first then see how you go with it. Remember this is for daily trading/screen watching, what i am doing is playing about with my own theory on end of day charts using the EW indicators as i am unable to screen watch all day.

If anyone does buy it we can all get together and work on some nice strategies for EOD

Regards
CarpeUK

 

[Bigbusiness]

Mark EW stands for Elliott Wave he was the gentleman that originally started predicting movement on the Dow Jones, he even predicted the 1987 market crash...

Where did you read this? I thought he died in 1948. I have also read that he couldn't make any money trading. Doesn't mean Elliott waves are not usable but I don't think they are something I would rely on.

http://www.futuresmag.com/industry/references/prechter94.html

 

[CarpeUK]

Where did you read this? I thought he died in 1948. I have also read that he couldn't make any money trading. Doesn't mean Elliott waves are not usable but I don't think they are something I would rely on.

http://www.futuresmag.com/industry/references/prechter94.html

Thats right he did die in the 194x something. when i first started looking into EW there where a few articles on the net (ok you dont know how reliable they are) he was a mathematician and designed this EW theory and taught it to others. within the article it said he was predicting future events on the DJ and the overall market and he predicted the 1987 crash.

like i said how true this is i dont know, info form the net can be sketchy at best but i thought it was very interesting.

CarpeUK

Update: well i have just read that article and most of it is about the same as i read except a few parts. How i see it is the only reason he did not trade is own theory and got Collins to do it for him was because his first attempt failed and made him poor so he did not have the money to continue until Collins accepted he would try his theory for 2 years and see how it went.

Like it said in your article his theory predicted the market with some accuracy.

 

[CarpeUK]

Yes, you're quite right - it shouldn't really be followed blind, as there are so many if's and buts to the analysis. Probably best to read around Elliott Basics first, which again, is freely available on the web these days and can be understood quickly (the basics that is).

Many thanks for bringing the EW indicators to our attention.

hay you are welcome. When i first read up about EW i was fascinated by it, then when i found this strategy, by pure luck i could not believe it but hay i have a long way to go yet before i even think about playing with read money

Regards
CarpeUK

 

[Roberto]

There are 3 books about the Elliott Wave principle by Robert (Bob) Beckman: "The Elliott Wave Principle As Applied To The UK Stockmarket", "Supertiming" and "Powertiming" (this third one is subtitled "The Amazing Wave Principle" and was one of the first "investment" books I ever read when it was originally published in 1992.

The author claims that of all the technical analysis tools he's ever investigated, the Elliott Wave principle "has always been the most profitable, being the only method capable of forecasting future market movements with any useful of meaningful degree of accuracy" (I'm quoting that from the blurb on the book's sleeve).