Online Trading Academy-HELP!

[new_trader]

How about one of these courses teach someone for FREE then and only charge them if that person is profitable?

TD, you can't teach anyone to be profitable just like you can't teach anyone to be a chess Grandmaster. Sure, you can teach someone the rules of chess and how all the pieces move, but teach them to be a Grandmaster? Like many other professions, you can teach someone medicine but you can't teach them to be a good Doctor. You can teach someone Physics and Chemistry but you can't teach them to win a Nobel prize. This is a concept that very few who aspire to be profitable traders can grasp. This is also why those who offer courses will always be able to avoid paying out a refund.

My humble opinion anyway. But seriously, if it was that simple to teach someone to be profitable or if it was that simple to learn to be profitable, everyone would be rich and forums like this wouldn't exist...not for very long anyway...

 

[trader_dante]

TD, you can't teach anyone to be profitable just like you can't teach anyone to be a chess Grandmaster. Sure, you can teach someone the rules of chess and how all the pieces move, but teach them to be a Grandmaster? Like many other professions, you can teach someone medicine but you can't teach them to be a good Doctor. You can teach someone Physics and Chemistry but you can't teach them to win a Nobel prize. This is a concept that very few who aspire to be profitable traders can grasp. This is also why those who offer courses will always be able to avoid paying out a refund.

My humble opinion anyway. But seriously, if it was that simple to teach someone to be profitable or if it was that simple to learn to be profitable, everyone would be rich and forums like this wouldn't exist...not for very long anyway...

What about the Turtles? Weren't they taught to be profitable?

I agree and disagree. I think you can teach someone to be a proficient chess player but becoming a grandmaster takes something MORE that is unteachable.

Isn't this the same in trading? I think you can teach a trader to be profitable (by this I mean, that they will end up at the end of each week / month with a higher figure in which they started the month...but can you teach them to become one of the upper echelon? The ones that risk the least and make the most? That have an innate sense of where the market is going...No I don't think that is somthing that can be passed on.

 

[new_trader]

What about the Turtles? Weren't they taught to be profitable?

I agree and disagree. I think you can teach someone to be a proficient ches player but becoming a grandmaster takes something MORE that is unteachable.

Isn't this the same in trading? I think you can teach a trader to be profitable (by this I mean, that they will end up at the end of each week / month with a higher figure in which they started the month...but can you teach them to become one of the upper echelon? The ones that risk the least and make the most? That have an innate sense of where the market is going...No I don't think that is somthing that can be passed on.

As far as I know, the 'Turtles' were not taught to trade, they were given a system that they were told to follow without question or discretion. That was the point of the 'experiment'. There is a BIG difference between that and being a profitable trader able to stand on your own two feet.

Do you honestly think there is a difference in understanding between a profitable trader and a hugely profitable trader?

 

[Taylored001]

Hello Everyone,

New to the Trade to Win website today...looking for some help/advice if possible

I am looking at expanding my existing basic buy&hold strategy to that of day trading..

Have come across a company called "Online Trading Academy" or OTA for short, they are based near St Albans Hertfordshire..I went to a free seminar recently & am really sold on what they offer, does anyone have any feedback from attending one of there 7 day courses (which cost £3295).It's alot of initial investment for me, but obviously a good one if I can apply the knowledge and make money.

I have heard of all the negative Darren Winn/Winn investing stories, but these guys at OTA seem really genuine..

Any thoughts would be highly appreciated...
Thanks in Advance,
Darren (Not Winn!)

Don't pay for courses... My dad has paid thousands on courses, i have paid £52 on trading books and i am making money....

My dad is making money but not from information on the courses we went on, actually from an investment book 'How tomake money in stocks' and a large capital with low risk.

Okay, if you want me to check out their office i can do ( I live in St albans) and see what i think????

If you cannot figure out how to trade from free info on the internet and from books, then i recommend you get a job and forget about trading.

 

[trader_dante]

As far as I know, the 'Turtles' were not taught to trade, they were given a system that they were told to follow without question or discretion.

Agreed but that's what I mean...you can teach somone to be profitable by teaching them a profitable system and telling them to follow it...

Do you honestly think there is a difference in understanding between a profitable trader and a hugely profitable trader?

Definetly. Of course! Don't you?

 

[Calinor]

I am also doing the Online Academy course.
what is impressive about it is:-
(1) you get assigned a MENTOR to help you - and it is for life - not for a few months
(2) the trainers are TOP TRADERS - not just some novices who trade for a while
(3) all course are for LIFE - free repetition anywhere in the world - for life
(4) course are 7 days - and you get full support for life - not for a while
(5) Yes - they do have follow up courses but not in the same field. so if you want to go into options - yes there is another course - but that is to be expected - they are not pretending that there is just one course for everything
(6) you also get lifetime access to their trading club
so overall - compared to greg or darren winters courses - they offer much more. there is no time limit - you learn until you get it. and your mentors are world class traders

This is obviously complete nonsense (no offence). Does anyone offer their services for life for an amount of money in the thousands. Come on. Nothing is for life. Also read beyond the lines. Why on earth would a mentor need to be there for life. Doesn't that say something about their abilities as a mentor? I would love a good mentor. But if I still needed them after a few years and couldn't learn the rest on my own, then they didn't do their job properly as a good mentor? Shouldn't a mentor tell you where you are going wrong, but also, how you can develop your own way to be profitable, and how you can learn and teach yourself in the future?

The trainers are top traders? What is the definition of a top trader? How are they proving this? Why does a top trader spend his time teaching others? Sure he good do it out of a sense of good will, but then he wouldn't charge a fee. Finally the course is for 7 days. This is one of the reasons I would never take a course like this. You can't even learn the basics of a foreign language in 7 days. I have been learning intensely for months now on trading, and I'm improving, but still a long way to go. I don't believe much can be achieved in 7 days. If I consider what I knew after 7 days of reading and studying books on trading, I have to admit I was a trading moron. The learning seems to be spiral, and as you're learning, you don't really feel like you're going up much much, but a couple of months later when you assess it, you've improved a hell of a lot. Some traders can take years, other traders maybe sooner. But I don't know many that took only 7 days.

 

[new_trader]

Agreed but that's what I mean...you can teach somone to be profitable by teaching them a profitable system and telling them to follow it...

This is where we disagree. According to this logic you are teaching a computer to trade when you automate a 'profitable' system.

Definetly. Of course! Don't you?

I would say that there is a certain level of understanding reached where after that it is a case of experience, courage, discipline and other factors that you can't exactly teach. Going back to the chess analogy, once you know how all the pieces move, and you know all the rules, there is nothing more you can learn about the game. You just have to work on strategies and gain experience through playing. This is what I meant.

 

[Calinor]

Well the Russian system in which they trained grandmaster after grandmaster from a young age would suggest that even grandmaster is something that can be taught. There are many grandmasters though, perhaps mor than you realised, but only a few real chess geniuses and world champions.

 

[Bint_Crusher]

PM me, I will give you the truth about OTA

 

[nboy]

I have spent about £9k with OTA and got nowhere basically over the last 12 months, and there are many others like me i can ssure you. They are either still trading Sim accounts or $1 per pip, neither of which will generate a full time income. I have paid my money so i am entitled to my say, IMHO:

-i think there is a bit of an NLP thing going on where you get swept up with the brand/lifestyle/community thing
-they are always upselling another course or XLT
-they dropped the grads network afternoons as i guess it wasn't profitable
-they replaced it with some sort of once monthly free seminar which is just upselling again
-its all packaging with no content
-there are 50 different tutors with 50 different trading styles worldwide
-i signed up for x1 trading solution not 50!
-free retakes are because they cant fill the courses with paid customers, or they cant communicate it the first time
-they give you the tools but not how to use them precisly and effectively
-they are expensive, you can get the same for 10% of the cost or free with a UK broker
-the tutors are so busy doing courses and XLT webinars when do they trade?
-teaching is obviously more proftable than trading
-look up Sam Seiden or Steve Misic here or on FXstreet.com and they are essentially giving away the main forex couse structure for free, so why pay for it?
-the Sam Seiden Supply & Demand methods mean you need a $25k min account for the Stops he recomends

 

[tony collins]

Hi Wayne, read the threads that followed your first message, wondered where you are now with trading ? How was OTA ? Are u now successful ?

 

[trade9]

You know who has a great options mentoring program? Market Taker Mentoring. That is Dan Passarelli's company. He taught for the CBOE, traded on the floor, and wrote the book Trading Option Greeks. (And, I think he still trades for himself). He's the real deal. Here's the website:

http://markettaker.com

 

[jaspertrademaster]

I'll check out that link, thanks

 

[magisana]

Gee I am glad that I found this thread before shelling out my hard earned dosh!!!

 

[wistundra]

A lot of OTA courses are available on E-bay.
Can be bought for pennies on the dollar. What
does that say about the value of the course ?

 

[bradhouser]

A lot of OTA courses are available on E-bay.
Can be bought for pennies on the dollar. What
does that say about the value of the course ?

Disclaimer: I have not taken the course, I am researching it though.

I am concerned with the reviews that may have been planted, and yes, I am new to the site, so my post count is low.

One of the things I haven't seen emphasized, is that like the turtles, you get to trade with their money during the class. (I don't know how much money you are allowed to trade with, but obviously decisions on what to buy and sell will need to be made.) They pay the commissions too. Also, they have daily stock tips that historically have earned big returns. I haven't seen any eBay courses do that. They also have weekly conference calls that can be downloaded later if you miss them.

Can anyone who has been to the 7 day Professional Trading class confirm the above?

 

[wistundra]

The courses that are available are the same thing they teach in there live class. If you don't learn anything from the videos I highly doubt that taking the live classes would be any improvement.

 

[bradhouser]

Followup:

OK, I went to the class in Concord last month.

They let you trade on their account (not yours) with their money, but the trades are limited to 10 shares, and you don't get a lot of live trading time. Lots more time with the simulator.

The commissions for their trades are covered by them. The rebate is another deal.

The tips are basic support / resistance breakout long trades.

The class can be repeated for free on a space available basis.

There is something to say for learning from people who trade professionally, as each one adds their own experiences, and teaches things that aren't in the book.

Brad

 

[practical]

Hey, first post. Has anyone tried any of the broker seminars that they could recommend? All the likes of CMC, IG, City Index, etc seem to offer their own versions, but I was wondering if anyone knew of a particular one worth visiting?

 

[ghp3]

If anyone is going to spend money to learn to trade, you cannot get any better than Sam Seiden at OTA. The guy teaches the very basics of what makes price move. He does not try to sell some sort of system that may or may not work. What Sam teaches is pure and simple supply and demand. Sam shows you how to identify that on a chart. Any system or strategy sold will not work if it's not based on the simple laws of supply and demand. It's really very easy to learn with some work and time and then it can become quite profitable. Sam Seiden didn't create or invent supply and demand. It's just the way the markets work. It's how the markets have worked forever and will always work. So, don't waste your money on all the "get rich quick" crap that is out there. If you are new, the course Sam teaches at OTA will serve you the rest of your trading life. The others will come and go. I've been trading for over 10 yrs and spent a lot of money, like most in the beginning, looking for a way to trade. While most of it is useless, I feel it's a process you have to go thru because it still allows you to learn about trading along the way. But, for a solid foundation, the supply and demand lessons are the best way to go. Remember, Sam didn't create or invent what he's teaching, so he really doesn't have anything to sell you. He works for a company that happens to pay him to teach what he does. Good Luck.