Concept FX

[jason0181]

Sandy

With the other systems you are looking at, are they also EOD? I know that the GBPUSD pair fell very sharply when the last concept trade failed, and not sure how quickly concept could have reacted to it. There was still movement for a few days after, and with the way they like to set things up, there may have been too much risk for them to think it was still going down. If they had got the sell trade instead of buy, maybe they would have kept moving the limit each day to take more profits.

Always talking in past tense makes it easier to predict what should have happened.

It would be good to see other trading styles, and this may come in when they get the 'risk' feature to work corectly. It all depends on the style of traders we are, and if large risks are acceptable. They have played many trades safe, but I wont complain as long as they keep producing the goods.

Jason

 

[SandyW]

Sandy

With the other systems you are looking at, are they also EOD?

No not EOD. But the system I like best (Sniper Forex) rings bells and sends email to you, if action required is imminent and when it is necessary. The one hour time frame is proving very easy to handle. Maybe only one trade a day.

They are trend following systems, which I feel is a healthy way to trade. Of course the difficulty with trend following is the whipsaw effect if a trend is not sustained long enough. But it is possible to filter trades by looking at the longer term trend, and only taking trades which are in that direction. Nothing's perfect as we know. It is a question of probability.

You are right, that Concept might have been able to catch the GBPUSD down move, but it didn't. The only effect was a stop out of a trade in the wrong direction, and then sitting out the best dance of the year.

Interestingly, the current trade with Concept triggered before the change of trend, making it "risky". This other system triggered the trade when the new trend looked to be in place, making it less risky (the trend is your friend stuff). Of course Concept got a better entry, but at higher risk.

I am sticking with Concept, but I think these systems, quite apart from their own profitability, may be good tools for hedging Concept. Neil at Concept did say to me that he thought the Concept exit strategy had some scope for development, so I don't feel too "disloyal"! And it is better to have a disciplined system to do the hedging than be constantly in dilemma (and victim of emotion) when trying to decide whether Concept needs a little help.

 

[stevespray]

The discusion seems to be one of 'glass half empty' vs 'glass half full'. Whilst we could look on past movements as 'missed oppertunities' I find it better to draw strength from the fact that we lost very little on the trades which were placed. I've handed back about 25% of the profit that I've made in the last 3 months of trading. I consider this to be very good. Of course, once you have your profits in the bank, human instinct make you want to keep hold of it but the reality with trading is that you will not always be making gains week in week out.

For what it's worth I feel that the Concept system has been pretty unlucky over the last few weeks when you consider that a) we had a very nice looking trade stop out on a data spike by just a few pips before going on to hit its target just an hour or so later (which would have been double the profit!) and, b) We had a limit sell order on the EUR/JPY cross which missed being filled by less that 20 pips before going into a 700 pip free fall.

I'm more than happy with the system so far and I feel that it is standing up well.

Steve.

 

[SandyW]

The discusion seems to be one of 'glass half empty' vs 'glass half full'. Whilst we could look on past movements as 'missed oppertunities' I find it better to draw strength from the fact that we lost very little on the trades which were placed. I've handed back about 25% of the profit that I've made in the last 3 months of trading. I consider this to be very good. Of course, once you have your profits in the bank, human instinct make you want to keep hold of it but the reality with trading is that you will not always be making gains week in week out.

For what it's worth I feel that the Concept system has been pretty unlucky over the last few weeks when you consider that a) we had a very nice looking trade stop out on a data spike by just a few pips before going on to hit its target just an hour or so later (which would have been double the profit!) and, b) We had a limit sell order on the EUR/JPY cross which missed being filled by less that 20 pips before going into a 700 pip free fall.

I'm more than happy with the system so far and I feel that it is standing up well.

Steve.

Steve,

I for one will stick with Concept. I paid for it and I will use it. But it is healthy and intelligent to explore ways of improving one's OWN strategy. Concept is one tool, not the only one. What is not intelligent or healthy is randomly trying to second guess it.

As I said the Concept people themselves readily acknowledge that it is possible to modify the way one uses the signals, and especially to try to improve the exit strategy. There was a trade not too far back (you may have been in it) which made 1200 points then fell back by 500, before closing. That exit could have been improved!

Furthermore, although the early part of this year was spectacular, there is no telling whether the next 6 months will be awful. If it is, those without another string to their bow will feel utterly helpless. I don't believe a successful trader and business man like you has all his eggs in the Concept basket! That might even explain why you are so cool about it!

Winning or losing, Concept offers scope for some serious learning. It must be used with strict disciplne but not mindlessly, unless that is what people want. But most traders are inherently inquiring I believe, and fascinated by this very difficult art.

 

[SandyW]

Sandy

.........the way they like to set things up, there may have been too much risk for them to think it was still going down. If they had got the sell trade instead of buy, maybe they would have kept moving the limit each day to take more profits............

Jason

Jason,

When you say "they" you imply human intervention. Concept is simply applying a preset algorithm. All "they" do, once the program has been written, is ensure the thing is switched on and the server is connected.

Unless you have reason to believe we are being misled.

I would be surprised however if "they" just trade it themselves without checking out the signals, tweaking them if necessary. That only seems intelligent to me. I don't mean for the published trades, which obviously conform to the standard signals, but the personal ones.

 

[jason0181]

Sandy

I use the 'they' as in Concept system. There was a theoy early on this thread, that someone went to meet concept, and were told that someone was just picking the trades and publishing them under the disguise of a computer automated system. I dont believe that for a moment.

 

[SandyW]

Sandy

I use the 'they' as in Concept system. There was a theoy early on this thread, that someone went to meet concept, and were told that someone was just picking the trades and publishing them under the disguise of a computer automated system. I dont believe that for a moment.

I guessed you would mean that, but I felt some clarity was called for. Pendantic as ever.

What would be helpful, and educational, would be if they told us on what technical basis each signal is being generated. When I was using Tradewin, they gave users a list of the types of signal, eg "bounce off 200MA" or "breakout of resistance". They also gave us the historical success rate of each of the signal types, so that users could decide to give some a miss if they chose, and only take the higher probability trades. Every signal was accompanied by the information on its basis. This was a development after the system had been in place for some time, not the original deal.

Now that might be interesting with Concept.

 

[pvisser]

It's the EURCHF, which did trigger on Friday, but I guess pvisser had entered the numbers for his first trade over the weekend when it was below the entry price, and it triggered on a stop to open as it bounced, rather than the original signal giving a limit to open (??)

Yeah thats right I only recieved the system on Friday, but I definately didn't know that the trade has already been triggered. It was a stop to open not a limit. I read what you said about improving on their exit strategy, do you know if there are plans plans for them to do it rather than us tweaking the system?

 

[SandyW]

I read what you said about improving on their exit strategy, do you know if there are plans for them to do it rather than us tweaking the system?

Hi pvisser,

No plans that they have spelt out. Neil just said he thought there was scope for improvement, and had it in mind.

I have no sense of your experience in trading. But I would say that "if it ain't bust don't fix it". There is no evidence at all that Concept is bust. But that does not mean it cannot be improved. But to improve on it you must have a distinct strategy for doing so, and the trading skills to apply it. If you try to just randomly beat it at its own game I think that on balance you will lose out.

Certainly any new users should stick as closely as possible to the signals.

 

[Arek Okrasa]

WINrar - free key licence

Hello SandyW

Thank you for the last tips!

I bought Sniper (it cost around £8) and instaled Metatrade but I cannot unpack Sniper. My Winrar licence has expired - I try buy new one but I couldnt so I get stuck.

DO you know another way - how can I get a key to Winrar...

Thank you
Arek

Hi pvisser,

No plans that they have spelt out. Neil just said he thought there was scope for improvement, and had it in mind.

I have no sense of your experience in trading. But I would say that "if it ain't bust don't fix it". There is no evidence at all that Concept is bust. But that does not mean it cannot be improved. But to improve on it you must have a distinct strategy for doing so, and the trading skills to apply it. If you try to just randomly beat it at its own game I think that on balance you will lose out.

Certainly any new users should stick as closely as possible to the signals.

 

[stevespray]

Hello SandyW

Thank you for the last tips!

I bought Sniper (it cost around £8) and instaled Metatrade but I cannot unpack Sniper. My Winrar licence has expired - I try buy new one but I couldnt so I get stuck.

DO you know another way - how can I get a key to Winrar...

Thank you
Arek

Arek - Not being rude here but this is completely off subject and doesnt belong in this thread. You can private message people with these kind of questions or, even better, research the matter online.

WinRAR archiver, a powerful tool to process RAR and ZIP files

Lets try and not let this thread go like so many where the original subject is lost with meaningless nonsense.

Steve.

 

[SandyW]

Hello SandyW

Thank you for the last tips!

I bought Sniper (it cost around £8) and instaled Metatrade but I cannot unpack Sniper. My Winrar licence has expired - I try buy new one but I couldnt so I get stuck.

DO you know another way - how can I get a key to Winrar...

Thank you
Arek

I can only say I use Winzip. You may be able to get a trial version. If this doesn't work you must contact Gary at Sniper for help, not me. He is usually quick to help.

 

[Arek Okrasa]

Thank you SandyW

Garry helped me so I am working on Sniper

Thank you a lot
Arek

I can only say I use Winzip. You may be able to get a trial version. If this doesn't work you must contact Gary at Sniper for help, not me. He is usually quick to help.

 

[navtis]

Yes, I'm using it a the moment. I was initially extremely sceptical, as I am of any supposedly automated system, but so far my trades have duplicated the performance of the historical trades on their website fairly accurately. You get periods of losing 3-4 trades consecutively, and only about 50% are successful overall, but so far at any rate (I have been using it for about 2 months) the net results are positive.

The downside is that the program is expensive and you have to pay a yearly subscription thereafter. I will run it for a year to see if it does what they claim it will do, and then decide whether or not to continue. If you like experimenting and have some money to spare (or maybe lose) then it may be worth giving it a try.

It's a 'black box' system so one knows nothing about how it works or to what extent the trades are deicded mechanically or by members of the company who market it.

UK FX trader

Hi, As you posted this three months ago, would you mid saying if you're still using it and if it works? Thanks in advance.

 

[avtarsaini]

I'm using city index to place the concept trades. You have to place a rolling bet, which means the bet closes and reopens simulateously at approx. 11.00pm. The profit/loss is added/subtracted to you account. This is a nuisance because even though the trade is closed a few days latter at a profit, you may have made a loss on the nights close for the past few days - so your overall profit might not really be a profit at all! It does work the other way though, the current EurChf closed at a small loss friday night and a bigger profit monday night and is currently break even.
Do all the brokers close and reopen these currency positions every night or do some simply keep them open till you close the bet, whenever that is? Any thoughts any one. Thanks.
Avtar

 

[jason0181]

All brokers will take something from the trade when rolling it over. This is either by closing and reopening the trade, or by charging a small portion of interest on the trade. This is typically 2.5% above LIBOR (London interbank rate) I think that is it.

I use IG index who do close and open the trade, so this is their rolling payment. It may be best to check with other brokers and see how they calculate the daily rolling charge, and if they pay you interest on short trades.

It is confusing, and you would need to check all of the transactions on the trade to calculate the final profit / loss. There is also the spread that they charge, which you will need to consider.

 

[Arek Okrasa]

cheap spread bett company...

Hello All

Jason from GFT spread betting company said that they charge 1 and 2 pips. I opened a demo account with them but it is not true. They charge more and their portal is too complicated. Maybe someone alse can find it easer for them self...

SandyW...how the Sniper works for you? I tested today...but probaby need another day or two.

Arek

All brokers will take something from the trade when rolling it over. This is either by closing and reopening the trade, or by charging a small portion of interest on the trade. This is typically 2.5% above LIBOR (London interbank rate) I think that is it.

I use IG index who do close and open the trade, so this is their rolling payment. It may be best to check with other brokers and see how they calculate the daily rolling charge, and if they pay you interest on short trades.

It is confusing, and you would need to check all of the transactions on the trade to calculate the final profit / loss. There is also the spread that they charge, which you will need to consider.

 

[Torran]

Have any of you guys heard of Alpari.co.uk? I just got an advert for it through T2W. If you do use it can you please let me know if it's worth opening an account with? They claim that their speciallity is the Forex market so it could be interesting.

Yes I know Alpari, in fact have a paper trading account running with them at prsent. The do not provide a SB service but a full blown Forex trading service. The platform they use is Metatrader which, to me, is much better, much more versatile and much easier to adapt to user requirements. It seems to me the IG platform is very much 'take it or leave it'

Have also bought SniperForex which Sandy W pointed us to about a week ago. Will run it in parallel to Concept - incidentally much, much cheaper to buy, and so far service superb. Cannot comment on results yet but looks promising.

 

[SandyW]

Daily Rolling Bets

Any thoughts any one. Thanks.
Avtar

Avtar,

It does not matter which SB co you use, if you place a daily bet it lasts till the end of the day if you have not closed it. If it is still open it closes automatically. Just as a monthly bet closes automatically at the end of the month. If you wanted to continue with it, you would have to reopen it the next morning. To save you the trouble, they will roll it over for you. But effectively they close it at the bid price and open it at the offer price, just as you would have had to do if you had done it manually.

If you want to avoid the overnight charge you need to close it yourself and then reopen it. But you cannot avoid the bid/offer spread.

 

[pvisser]

Yes I know Alpari, in fact have a paper trading account running with them at prsent. The do not provide a SB service but a full blown Forex trading service. The platform they use is Metatrader which, to me, is much better, much more versatile and much easier to adapt to user requirements. It seems to me the IG platform is very much 'take it or leave it'

Have also bought SniperForex which Sandy W pointed us to about a week ago. Will run it in parallel to Concept - incidentally much, much cheaper to buy, and so far service superb. Cannot comment on results yet but looks promising.

When you open an account with alpari and trade with metatrader don't you have to pay tax?

Can you please keep us posted about the SniperForex results, because I'm always interested in new ventures. Thanks