Best Thread Capital Spreads

Slorm said:
No charts again this morning! Come on CS sort out your IT.
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I've had a FTSE 3 min chart running on CapSprds since 7.00am and it's been working fine, but I've just tried to open a DAX one and the error note comes up.

I suppose that's the advantage of having 3 SB accounts - one can switch if tech glitches occur.
 
it seems that some nonFins traders are having trouble!!!:p :p

What a surprise! :D

You are missing some good shorts.:devilish:

Split
 
charts

it appears that there is a problem with some charts depending on which server you are connected to on our trading platform as when i checked chart data i got no problems (and was therefore wondering what everyone was talking about)

it seems that the problem has now been solved but we are doing further testing to see how it went wrong in the first place.

this did not affect the trading platform

simon
 
lurkerlurker

if Ian wishes to comment that is his right...I hope you would not expect me to comment on individual clients who may be known to third parties !!

simon
 
capitalspreads said:
if Ian wishes to comment that is his right...I hope you would not expect me to comment on individual clients who may be known to third parties !!

simon
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Absolutely not. I think what we were looking for here was a more general (ie policy related) answer to Ian's question:

ian said:
Simon. What would be the reason a client is on constant dealer execution when trading between £1 - £10 per point?
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Naturally you cannot comment on specific cases. However, you have gone as far as to state that it is the right of CS to do this, which nobody would dispute, and that it would be down to dealer choice. What we are yet to hear from you are some hypothetical examples of what would cause your dealers to select a client for "constant dealer execution".

I hope this makes the query clearer somewhat. I'm sure a comprehensive answer to this question would interest quite a few members here. Thanks.
 
I have been finding it increasingly difficult to trade using the CS platform over the past month.What was once a very reliable service seems to have gone downhill rapidly.Trades now take an age to be accepted or declined,its almost as though they are waiting to see if its it moved in their favour before accepting the trade,today I was shown an error message trade declined,only to find out several minutes later via my open position balance that the trade had actually gone through.The attitiude of the dealers,one in particular,overly defensive and aggressive,makes me very wary of using CS in the future.Pity as they used to be so reliable.Anyone else suffering similar problems?
 
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Yes, we've had a few of these

HarryHill said:
I have been finding it increasingly difficult to trade using the CS platform over the past month.What was once a very reliable service seems to have gone downhill rapidly.Trades now take an age to be accepted or declined,its almost as though they are waiting to see if its it moved in their favour before accepting the trade,today I was shown an error message trade declined,only to find out several minutes later via my open position balance that the trade had actually gone through.The attitiude of the dealers,Hendrik in particular,overly defensive and aggressive,makes me very wary of using CS in the future.Pity as they used to be so reliable.Anyone else suffering similar problems?
Click to expand...

I can second most of your issues there. I closed my account with them, and to be honest 80% of this decision was due to the attitude of their staff, with 20% being due to recurrent technical issues and of course the slow and rejected fills. I am a patient and reasonable person. Until very recently, the CS staff were always extremely polite and helpful. However, when dealing with some issues where CS were clearly at fault (and even when their staff admitted this was the case) I felt their tone was becoming increasingly prickly and hostile.

Simon has since explained here that CS are needing to put through more IT upgrades, and that quite a few of his staff were on leave during the time in question. This may account in part for their harassed attitude, and it is important to be balanced. However, this is not the quality of service I had come to expect from CS.

Thanks for your post Harry. It is always good to have a wider perspective of the issues experienced. I do not think it is in order to mention specific dealers here though. If you have a complaint about an individual dealer, there are more appropriate channels. General comments are fine, but I would think it is slightly unfair to post in a forum where they do not have the chance to respond directly!

I really hope CS get their issues sorted out - they did seem like a very good firm for quite some time, and I believe there is still potential there. However, there are plenty of competitors; do not be afraid to vote with your feet if you do not find their quality of service acceptable. Quite a few firms have tight spreads, and if CS no longer wishes to compete on customer service...
 
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Thanks lurkerlurker,having read back through some of your earlier posts my being put on "dealer confirm" would explain why I have been suffering some of the difficulties I have.
 
Twenty minutes after my post this morning I received a phone call from CS,informing me that a trade I placed nearly one month ago had been erroneous and that my account had been debited by some sevaral thousand pounds.Coincidence? Do I have any redress against the company for renaging on a trade that was offered to me and taken by me in good faith,and if so does anyone know of a good lawyer experienced in dealing with spreadbetting disputes or even a financial journalist who may be interested in my story?
 
HarryHill said:
Twenty minutes after my post this morning I received a phone call from CS,informing me that a trade I placed nearly one month ago had been erroneous and that my account had been debited by some sevaral thousand pounds.Coincidence? Do I have any redress against the company for renaging on a trade that was offered to me and taken by me in good faith,and if so does anyone know of a good lawyer experienced in dealing with spreadbetting disputes or even a financial journalist who may be interested in my story?
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Would you care to outline the nature of the 'erroneous trade'? In other words is it obviously an error?

What do the terms and conditions say on the issue? Industry practice appears to be notification within 2 days - 1 month does appear a little unreasonable.

Steve.
 
Over a month? That is not in order. What if you had withdrawn or spent that, or lost it trading? Not in order at all. These things can happen, but I would submit that CS has a duty to confirm trades and correct errors within a reasonable period of time. Very unhappy to be hearing this, and I am glad I closed my account. While my account was not affected by erroneous prices prior to closing it, this seems like further bad practice from them. They appear to have turned from a good firm into an inefficient bucket shop. Not good.
 
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Many thanks

I have taken advice from several sources,including the one below.Many thanks to those who have messaged me but for their own reasons didn't wish to post on the thread.


Palpable errors are a tricky subject for the firms. Basic contractual law does not allow for such a situation as the one that you outline. In simple terms a deal is a deal. The various firms all say that they have the right to cancel trades for whatever reasons but legally they are on thin ice as contract law and, more importantly, the Financial Services and Market Act of 2000 appears to state otherwise. The Act appears to state that all spread bets are enforcable by either party. So, in the case that you outline, you would appear, by law, to be able to enforce the contract which they entered into with you (be that the opening or closing of a bet as technically they are the same thing ie 'a contract').

I'm guessing that Capital phoned you and told you what action they are taking ie removing funds to the value of?
Technically I doubt that they can really do this - all they can do is phone you and ask that you might act reasonably and in good faith towards them - in other words to 'adjust' the closing level to one which is more in keeping the market conditions at the time. Ultimately the choice in this matter is yours and not theirs since it is them that is seeking to break a contract (the closing order) which exists between them and yourselves. The problem from Capital's point of view is that the individual spread bet executions are individual contracts in their own right regardless of the main contract which is made up by the Terms And Conditions of The Customer Agreement. Because the law recognises spreadbetting contracts the firm would find it hard to show that they could use a wording in another document (ie the T&C) to cancel a contract (the spreadbet contract note) which is a seperate contract in its own right.
 
HarryHill said:
I have taken advice from several sources,including the one below.Many thanks to those who have messaged me but for their own reasons didn't wish to post on the thread.


Palpable errors are a tricky subject for the firms. Basic contractual law does not allow for such a situation as the one that you outline. In simple terms a deal is a deal. The various firms all say that they have the right to cancel trades for whatever reasons but legally they are on thin ice as contract law and, more importantly, the Financial Services and Market Act of 2000 appears to state otherwise. The Act appears to state that all spread bets are enforcable by either party. So, in the case that you outline, you would appear, by law, to be able to enforce the contract which they entered into with you (be that the opening or closing of a bet as technically they are the same thing ie 'a contract').

I'm guessing that Capital phoned you and told you what action they are taking ie removing funds to the value of?
Technically I doubt that they can really do this - all they can do is phone you and ask that you might act reasonably and in good faith towards them - in other words to 'adjust' the closing level to one which is more in keeping the market conditions at the time. Ultimately the choice in this matter is yours and not theirs since it is them that is seeking to break a contract (the closing order) which exists between them and yourselves. The problem from Capital's point of view is that the individual spread bet executions are individual contracts in their own right regardless of the main contract which is made up by the Terms And Conditions of The Customer Agreement. Because the law recognises spreadbetting contracts the firm would find it hard to show that they could use a wording in another document (ie the T&C) to cancel a contract (the spreadbet contract note) which is a seperate contract in its own right.
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Perhaps the Court would also consider that Capital Spreads are excluding liability for their errors to the detriment of the consumer. My advice: try and speak to the staff at Capital Spreads - notwithstanding my issues with them, they have always appeared to be reasonable people. See if they will meet you half way by perhaps closing the bet at the actual market price, not the erroneous quote.

If you cannot get anything reasonable from their head dealer, I would suggest you telephone their compliance officer for an informal chat prior to making a written complaint. Explain your point of view, and see if the firm will make you a reasonable offer. If not, your next course of action is to contact the FSA and ask them to investigate what you believe to be unfair terms in the Capital Spreads standard consumer contract (ie the sections allowing them to exclude liability for pricing errors). Get a reference number, and have their supervisory department look into it.

Next, call Capital Spreads and ask them to designate the issue as a formal complaint (which I believe must be reported to the FSA by the close of the next business day regardless of whether the firm believes the complaint will be upheld). Write the matter in full to their compliance officer, making it clear that if you do not receive a satisfactory resolution you intend to pursue the matter through the FOS and the Courts. At this stage it may be wise to withdraw your funds and close the account.

Let all of us here on T2W and other public forums know of your progress. Be detailed if you can. Perhaps consider contacting some consumer advocacy groups and some newspapers.

I am sorry this has happened to you, and furthermore I am disappointed that you feel CS has not resolved the matter to your satisfaction. I wish you all the best in your claim.
 
Hi HH,

I must say I am shocked to be reading about these machinations.

Here are the complaint procedures as taken from their website.

"Complaints Procedure

If you have a complaint, please contact our Customer Support team either by telephone on +44 (0)20 7456 7020 or via email to: [email protected]. Alternatively, you may write to us with your complaint to:

Customer Support
Capital Spreads
4th Floor
12 Appold Street
London EC2A 2AW

Very often problems may arise as a result of misunderstandings and can be easily resolved by our Customer Services staff. However, we recognise that there may be occasions when you feel that our service has not met your expectations and you wish to raise this with us more formally.

In this case, please, contact our Compliance Officer, Guillermo Lopez, either by email, in writing or by telephone.

Mr Guillermo Lopez
London Capital Group
4th Floor
12 Appold Street
London EC2A 2AW

Telephone: +44 (0)20 7456 7000
Email: [email protected]

If are not satisfied with our response, you are entitled to contact the Financial Ombudsman for an independent view.

Financial Ombudsman Service
South Quay Plaza
183 Marsh Wall
London E14 9SR
Telephone: 0845 080 1800
www.financial-ombudsman.org.uk

They will provide you with a form to complete with details of your complaint. To be eligible for the service, you will need to submit details of the complaint within six months of the date of our final response to you. Please note that the Financial Ombudsman Service can only consider complaints, which we have not been able to resolve to your satisfaction through our own internal procedures.

[return to top of page]"

Keep us updated.

Good luck

Fibonelli
 
Bottom line is, thy offerd you a price to deal and you excepted the trade if you can prove this on one of your statements, CS have no grounds especially after 30 days have past, this is not a reasonable time on they side. You should raise questions to CS in writing as to how they may substantiate their claims.. In your letter to them I would refer to the FSA Handbook below.....


http://fsahandbook.info/FSA/html/handbook/COB/3/8#D229

I would refer specifically to 3.8.5E (b) AND (i) within this section.

(b) any statement of fact, promise or prediction is clear, fair and not misleading and discloses any relevant assumptions;

(i) the accuracy of all material statements of fact in it can be substantiated.

Good luck.
 
error on trade ...lets get some facts rather than fiction

actually this is to do with a £1 trade in the S&P .... £1

due to a price feed error the client managed to buy at some 7000 points lower than the correct price... 7000 points!... and then uses words like good faith !!.. sorry pull the other one.. then when he realised that the error had not been noticed transferred the funds out of his account !! The only good faith involved here was on our part, not the client, I am actually pretty amazed that he has even mentioned the fact on this thread.

The only reason we found the error was because we happened to do a back audit trail on all trades done last month as an exercise. For some reason the previous check was done without the last day of the month, which was why it remained undetected.

Palpable errors happen every day across the globe.

I get e-mails every single day (virtually without fail) from one or other of the various exchanges ..LIFFE, CBOT, CME, EUREX etc changing lows on day, breaking deals correcting prices.... real financial exchanges with confirmed deals over two professional counterparties..

there is no time limit on trade error corrections and this is not because the SB companies wanted it that way but because the regulators insisted. For those of you with longer memories, there used to be a four day closure on errors with SB companies which meant that if you did not spot the error in that time then tough luck. The FSA quite rightly shut this very unfair cut off time down but the rules work both ways ... a palpable error is just as binding on Capital Spreads as it is on a client. (i.e if we had stopped out a client at a 7000 point error and he only noticed a year later, it would still be a pricing error and we would have to refund the client his money)

simon
 
Many thanks

Many thanks guys for your advice and support.I have proof of the price offered and accepted.I feel any mistake made was theirs and not mine.I acted in good faith and entered into a contract with them which they accepted 28 days ago_Over the last month I have had trades refused that initially showed to be good.......and trades that were initially refused appearing as good after a minute or so.Rudeness from staff and general poor service,of course I now understand from reading more of this thread that for some reason I've been put on dealer execution only....which in some part goes to explain the staff reaction to my calls and the recent unreliability of the dealing platform.Strange that my phone call informing me of the trade in question happened twenty minutes after my first post on this thread.
 
Funds

As I understand it,it is not illegal to withraw funds for your account.You insinuate I'd cleared out my account.....not so,hence the balance of £4500 pounds in there this morning.
 
i repeat the statement made.....

...........there is no time limit on trade error corrections and this is not because the SB companies wanted it that way but because the regulators insisted. For those of you with longer memories, there used to be a four day closure on errors with SB companies which meant that if you did not spot the error in that time then tough luck. The regulators quite rightly shut this very unfair cut off time down but the rules work both ways ... a palpable error is just as binding on Capital Spreads as it is on a client. (i.e if we had stopped out a client at a 7000 point error and he only noticed a year later, it would still be a pricing error and we would have to refund the client his money)

....the time limit on price errors is effectively infinite because that is the only fair (on both client and broker) way to apply it.

harryhill

i notice that there is no dispute as to the actual error, lest a new reader wonder, a 7000 point error ! (hardly one that anyone could claim he thought was correct).

I have posted a message to Mr Harryhill privately which, if he wishes, I shall add to this thread.

Very occasionaly I listen to telephone recordings of conversations with clients who claim that a dealer/customer services personel was impolite or rude. On assessing the conversations it is almost always the case that the Capital Spreads staff member is unfailingly correct in their telephone attitude. Our staff are trained to be impartial, polite and curteous against even the most extreme provocation. Just because they may not agree with the client does not make them rude. I listened to one where the client was literally screaming abuse at one of our female dealers and then had the gall to complain about her being rude.

There are cases where we make errors and we are happy to pay for them (well maybe, happy, is not quite the right word !).. but in this case where is our error?... what have we done wrong? Pricing errors are defined, meticulously, on our T&C's and our T&C's have been inspected by the relevent regulatory body .. As I have mentioned before (quite recently on this thread) if we do not spot a trade error going against us that is our problem. I do not expect a client to get all altruistic and inform us (although I would hope that they would). BUT if we do spot it then I do expect the client to at least admit it and not go whinging about how unfair we are.

On this particular matter this will be my last comment, no matter what is subsequently added

Simon
 
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