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If you use 10 pip stops ,your stop loss is more likely to be hit , 20 pips stops are less likely to be hit .Traders with 10 pips stops are less likely to be taken out of good trades , if spread widens or you get false 10 pip spikes or volatility increases or possibly other reasons. If your target is 10 pips with 20 stops ,traders will be more profitable than traders with 10/10.There is no reason why trader can not exit manually at 10 pips.This does not alter your risk /reward in actual trading.
Whatever stop loss I use for scalping , whatever losses I incur , my losses are recovered.I get a hit rate of 60 % plus and use a method of position sizing which enables me to recover earlier losses , based on probabilities.
This scalping for 10 pips doesn't add up , if volatility is low or very low . market is ranging and by Bob's own thinking style , that if a trade is likely to give you only 10 pips then it should not be put on.
It occupies a chapter in just about every trading book ever written. It’s been preached by every lecturing market guru/ trading coach and likely he or she will utter will be these chosen words and those words are, “Limit your losses and let your winners run”nowadays , cut your winners and limit your losses.Serious traders need to work on this aspect.
15 min tlb
First I have to agree with Mark 1979
Why don't you let the people in this thread get on with doing what they were doing quite pleasantly before you decided to hijack it.
Secondly, I am confused why a trader of such obviously superior skills would waist his time on us silly Scalpers?
I would like to point out one thing that you somehow missed as you intensely studied and dissected Bob's book. As he so graciously pointed out to me in an email response to a question. The book is not so much about a method, "as many seem to think" as it is about an "approach" to the battle between the Bulls & Bears. Bob also makes it clear that every trader is different and should use the information to at some point create their own style which most closely fit's their personal needs and personality.
Please do us all a favor and stop waisting yours as well as our time with your negativity. You obviously do not appreciate the book, method or approach so move on and count your money.
BLS
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I took the more aggressive RB entry when I saw that mini false break to the 60 level. Price was ranging around the 60 for about 4.5 hours and I was waiting for it to pop to upside for about half an hour. I guess I got a bit excited.
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samich1262
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I took that one too, nice trade. I also took a flag about an hour later. Glad to see some breakout movement today, the US session has seemed slow lately.
I'm supplementing my Volman trades with the Al Brooks breakout method on the 5m chart right now. Sometimes I see a trend take off without a good Volman setup, but I will see a Brooks setup on the 5m chart. Problem is, the Brooks method doesn't limit losses as well as Volman's method. I seem to be having some success with it because I do not have to make decisions as quickly, but ultimately I still want to use the Volman method as my "bread and butter." I guess I just got bored with the overlap session because it's been so slow, and some trends lately haven't provided a Volman setup. I tried trading the European session for awhile and liked how the market moved, but it's at 2am and I got too tired to stay on that schedule. I don't want to go into detail here on the Brooks method, but since people often ask about it here I thought I would post my thoughts. Both methods will get you in on this ARB but you've basically got a 1/1 risk reward ratio with the Brooks method, which isn't quite as comfortable to me. I was able to get a 2nd lot on the 5m chart later though.
cha-ching
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Hi samich1262,
Haven't seen you for a while. Welcome back. Would you mind posting your flag trade?
smilingsynic (the one who wrote a summary of Bob's book) wrote one for Brooks too: http://www.elitetrader.com/vb/attachment.php?s=&postid=3671591
shotgun77
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I also was having trouble finding volman setups on the stock charts I trade.
So I started looking at a "simpler" Brooks price action method here:
youtube videos
I've watched many of Mack's videos and his method might put some off if you don't keep watching. He initially might go for a 2 point stop to scalp out 1 point on the ES futures 2000 tick chart. He lets 20-25% of his position run. He moves his stop to breakeven or breakeven+1 very quickly after his scalp out, which is a Volman no-no. But the reason he does that is not for "sound technical reasons" because, like Volman says, most of the time you'll get stopped out. He does it just in case his trade "runs" for 4 to 8 points -- rare but it might happen a few times a week.
Anyway, I'm experimenting to see if I can use Volman and Mack's strategies on the same timeframe. So far I'm having a little trouble getting a good line/channel going on the smaller timeframe which is needed for Mack's style.
I don't want to hijack the thread! But as Volman says on page 70, patterns that occur regularly need to be implemented into your trading strategy.
So I started looking at a "simpler" Brooks price action method here:
youtube videos
I've watched many of Mack's videos and his method might put some off if you don't keep watching. He initially might go for a 2 point stop to scalp out 1 point on the ES futures 2000 tick chart. He lets 20-25% of his position run. He moves his stop to breakeven or breakeven+1 very quickly after his scalp out, which is a Volman no-no. But the reason he does that is not for "sound technical reasons" because, like Volman says, most of the time you'll get stopped out. He does it just in case his trade "runs" for 4 to 8 points -- rare but it might happen a few times a week.
Anyway, I'm experimenting to see if I can use Volman and Mack's strategies on the same timeframe. So far I'm having a little trouble getting a good line/channel going on the smaller timeframe which is needed for Mack's style.
I don't want to hijack the thread! But as Volman says on page 70, patterns that occur regularly need to be implemented into your trading strategy.
samich1262
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Thanks. Here's the flag I took. I'm not sure if Bob would take it or not, will be interested to see. It has a couple things going against it, but also a few things going for it.
Positives: Strong momentum, potential round # pull, and the market was trending at this point. There's no significant level to break (no 20 or 50 level in the way)
Negatives: Broke from the bottom of a range, however after it broke, it looked like the market was now in trending mode. If the market had not been trending, I think this would have been a sure skip.
The trade doesn't quite reach the average, but a couple weeks ago Bob marked a couple flags after strong momentum that also did not reach the average.
Overall, it seemed like there was more on the positive side than the negative side. I might have been a little biased since I had the 5m chart up too, I will have to make sure that doesn't make me biased when I'm looking for Volman setups.
I haven't posted much lately but I've still been trading and checking the forum. I had a few bad IRB reads last week that kind of rattled me a bit, so I went back to "study mode" for a few days. Doing better this week.
shotgun77
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I could write a 1/2 page summary of Mack's method. That is how simplified it is compared to Brooks.
samich1262
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Yup, I understand. Seems like the setups are there, but if I miss the initial break I'm not comfortable jumping in late, and then I don't get to participate. I switched back to the demo account so I could get myself to practice participating more. On the live account I'd let days go by without participating, even when I saw pretty good setups. I felt like I had gone through the book and charts so many times that I understood the concept and I just needed a lot of live experience. So I started adding a supplementary strategy, but I don't want to confuse myself or lose any progress on Volman's method so I may not go very far into it.
cha-ching
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Yes please :cheesy: I liked your chart summary.
samich1262
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Hey Vanica,
I think it would've been okay to stay in this trade because that tick that hit your stop was actually a perfect ceiling test of the arch before the break. After that, you could move the stop, but I don't think you would want to before that. I guess I can see wanting to trail that sharply after the uptrend, so I can kind of see both sides, but allowing one ceiling test is usually a good play.
stehlikpetrmsncom
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My charts with notes.
I did about every foolish mistake I could today - forgot about news announcement, accidently exited a valid trade and missed a textbook setup because I was surfing the web. Nevertheless, I really liked the market today, I think it behaved very technically
P.S.: I'd love to hear your comments on that particular BB (3rd chart) setup in general.
I did about every foolish mistake I could today - forgot about news announcement, accidently exited a valid trade and missed a textbook setup because I was surfing the web. Nevertheless, I really liked the market today, I think it behaved very technically
P.S.: I'd love to hear your comments on that particular BB (3rd chart) setup in general.
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Last edited:
samich1262
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My charts with notes.
I did about every foolish mistake I could today - forgot about news announcement, accidently exited a valid trade and missed a textbook setup because I was surfing the web. Nevertheless, I really liked the market today, I think it behaved very technically
P.S.: I'd love to hear your comments on that particular BB (3rd chart) setup in general.
I didn't even think about that BB, I don't know why I overlooked it. It's in the bottom of a range after a move up, and possibly a good spot for continuation. Longing from the bottom of a range ought to be a high odds trade. The double top probably threw me off, but being a 50% retracement, it's probably tradeable.
cha-ching
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My charts with notes.
I did about every foolish mistake I could today - forgot about news announcement, accidently exited a valid trade and missed a textbook setup because I was surfing the web. Nevertheless, I really liked the market today, I think it behaved very technically
P.S.: I'd love to hear your comments on that particular BB (3rd chart) setup in general.
I never traded BB. My concern would be the double top near 80 level.
Regarding news, the first thing I do in the morning is to add alerts 15 minutes to news on the chart, so that I stop trading from that point until spread comes back. I just found that you use OANDA as well. Have you noticed that yesterday the spread stayed at 2 pip for half an hour after news (US retail sales)? I'm seriously thinking about changing broker, but many good brokers with tight spread don't do business with US people. Fsck Dodd-Frank, what can I say. I wish I lived in Europe so that I could use Dukascopy or LMAX...
Anyway I'm going to research the following brokers, based on the spreads I have been watching since yesterday here: https://www.myfxbook.com/forex-broker-spreads
Admiral Markets Pro 0.90
Alpari ECN 0.80
Armada Markets 0.40
AxiTrader Pro 0.65
FinFx 0.85
FXOpen ECN 0.55
FXPIG ECN 0.59
FXPRIMUS ECN 0.90
Gallant Capital Markets Pro 0.75
IC Markets 0.65
MB Trading 1.20
Pacific Financial Derivatives 0.6
Pepperstone Edge 0.65
Pepperstone Razor 0.68
RoboForex ECN 0.70
RVD Markets - ECN 0.55
Traders Way 1.02
Tradeview 0.9
Vantage FX 0.4
samich1262
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Who is your current broker? If you're in the US check into Fastbrokers too. I'm using the Alpari feed through them but it comes out to be like half a pip cheaper than going straight through Alpari. Plus I can get the odd pairs like AUD/JPY for a full pip cheaper than other brokers. Some of the international brokers have better prices, it's a bummer. My current spread on EUR/USD probably averages around .7 pips and then there's a small commission equal to about .5 pips, so it's probably 1.2 or 1.3 pips most of the time. It's possible to get a spread of .5 pips with some brokers in the US but you have to deposit $50,000, otherwise you get a spread like 2.3 or so. Bummer!
stehlikpetrmsncom
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Yes! That widened spread yesterday was strange. I am staying with Oanda through my learning curve though, because a) you can trade very small sizes, b) I like the simplicity of the platform a lot, c) most of the time the spread is ok, I don't even mind the 1.2 (which happens often), it really wouldn't alter my performance, which is what I need to improve now.
Hit me up with a PM though if you find some alternative broker with better spreads and smooth platform. Although I'll most likely go with the LMAX in the future, it's always nice to know some alternatives.
BLS
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I'm using Traders Way right now. It's a Russian broker regulated in the Dominica. It sounds sketchy but I opened an MT4 ECN account with only $30 ( I think the minimum is $100 now but they might have another $10 minimum promotion in the future again). I picked this one out of convenience and the low minimum account balance. I found ForexPeaceArmy to be a good place for broker reviews and it helped me settle on TradersWay. If I ever get around to trading a larger account I might look elsewhere though.