Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

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Old Sep 7, 2010, 4:44pm   #121
 
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

amit1986 started this thread Boring, choppy markets these days. Scalping seems to be the only thing that seems to work best in this environment.
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Old Sep 7, 2010, 5:10pm   #122
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

do you ever do a bit of making markets on the illiquid stocks?
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Old Sep 7, 2010, 5:15pm   #123
 
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

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do you ever do a bit of making markets on the illiquid stocks?
Never tried it. Are you referring to the activity of putting in bids and offers to get rebates from exchanges?
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Old Sep 7, 2010, 5:27pm   #124
 
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

amit1986 started this thread Watching ATHR for a possible trade. Nice trending stock.
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Old Sep 7, 2010, 5:44pm   #125
 
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

amit1986 started this thread No trade on ATHR at the moment. Was looking to see if I could get some sort of reversal trade, but given the choppiness of the market and the falling Nasdaq e-mini futures, along with very little momentum on level 2, I decided not to take it. A decision well made

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Old Sep 7, 2010, 8:15pm   #126
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Never tried it. Are you referring to the activity of putting in bids and offers to get rebates from exchanges?
nah, just meant like setting limit orders inside the spread, buy bid sell ask sort of thing
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Old Sep 7, 2010, 8:31pm   #127
 
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

amit1986 started this thread Nah, I don't use limit orders - only market orders. Although I suppose, with level 2 type of trading, you could get a much better feel for a stock by doing what you propose. And in the process, you could actually **** off a lot of big market makers this way lol.

I read about a trader in Chicago who continuously posts bids and offers to get a feel of what a stock could do next. He does this to see if the big market makers get annoyed at this bids and offers and then trades with that information.

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nah, just meant like setting limit orders inside the spread, buy bid sell ask sort of thing
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Old Sep 7, 2010, 8:33pm   #128
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

yeh well a limit order would leave you in the dust in some cases
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Old Sep 7, 2010, 8:38pm   #129
 
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

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yeh well a limit order would leave you in the dust in some cases
True. But market orders aren't that great either - even half a second too late can get you a bad fill.
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Old Sep 7, 2010, 8:53pm   #130
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was just thinking; what are your reasons for stocks over futures? reasons i can think of are cheaper comissions and a lot more choice, but less liquid/clean than say ES and whats the limit with stocks? i mean, a £100000 account would be fine, what about £1-2 million?
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Old Sep 7, 2010, 9:28pm   #131
 
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

How I can learn technical analysis and what is best penny stock now a days to buy?

please also comment about it.
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Old Sep 8, 2010, 3:09am   #132
 
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

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Boring, choppy markets these days. Scalping seems to be the only thing that seems to work best in this environment.
Agreed - I stopped trading stocks for a while because of this & moved to the futures - now they are doing the same thing.

I think it's me.
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Old Sep 8, 2010, 4:44am   #133
 
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

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was just thinking; what are your reasons for stocks over futures? reasons i can think of are cheaper comissions and a lot more choice, but less liquid/clean than say ES and whats the limit with stocks? i mean, a £100000 account would be fine, what about £1-2 million?
I have nothing against trading futures - I simply don't find it practical to trade them, especially in this type of environment. Out of 2000+ stocks in the U.S., there's realistically only a few hundred that are good enough to trade - low spreads, decent volume and good range. With futures, there's really only a handful of them to trade (the ES and NQ being the top two). So, if it's difficult enough to find stocks to trade out of the few hundred that are available, it's definitely not going to be any easier to find a futures contract to trade out of the very few that are there.

Also, note that futures contracts are used heavily as hedging tools. If a hedge fund manager's got a large position going against gold and he knows that there's a negative correlation (albeit a small one) between gold and the equity markets, then he's definitely not going to buy the basket of stocks that represent the S&P 500 Index to protect against in an increase in gold prices. Instead, he'll most likely use the E-Mini S&P futures to hedge. This happens everyday with many hedge funds, investment banks, etc...This means, that there are going to be less "one-sided" traders - that is, any directional move in the futures will be accompanied by a relatively larger number of traders who will bet against that move as opposed to individual stocks.

While your liquidity argument makes sense, here's one thing to think about: I personally don't like trading very liquid stocks. I definitely won't trade MSFT, ORCL, DELL, etc...as they are influenced heavily by the overall market movement. Instead, I like stocks like CREE, CRUS, DNDN, BIDU, etc...They are liquid enough to get good fills on, but definitely won't be affected by the overall market on days when they behave mostly independent of the markets. Furthermore, level 2 is less noise and more readable on less popular stocks.

You definitely don't need a 2 million pound account to trade stocks the way I do, even $35,000 is more than enough. Interactive Brokers gives you almost 4-to-1 leverage, so your buying/shorting power is quite big. Trading anything more than 1500-2000 share positions on less-liquid stocks would be pointless as you'd get a bad fill. So I am slightly picky about liquidity, but over the short amount of time I have spent trading, I have found what works for me and what I am comfortable with.

Hope it helps,

Amit
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Old Sep 8, 2010, 4:50am   #134
 
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

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Agreed - I stopped trading stocks for a while because of this & moved to the futures - now they are doing the same thing.

I think it's me.
Nah, it's not you. I keep up a chart of the ES and NQ at all times and these days, I don't know how it is possible to make any money trading futures, except for in the first 30 minutes of the market.

Stock trading has also been quite difficult these days. One thing I am finding is that you really have to be flexible and adjust your trading-mentality as the market changes. 3 months ago, I could get a nice 30 cent per share move in any one stock, but nowadays, I really do close out any position that goes about 20 cents in profit.

Most of the time, I'm putting on a few scalp trades, getting about 5-10 cents per share on each one. While they all add up, I do feel your frustration...
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Old Sep 8, 2010, 4:56am   #135
 
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Re: Breakout Trading using Time and Sales

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How I can learn technical analysis
Ask arabianights for advice about technical analysis - you'll be a millionaire in no time

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what is best penny stock now a days to buy?
Wouldn't know. I wouldn't touch penny stocks even if they were the last type of trade available to mankind
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