Is the crisis really that bad?

Is the crisis really that bad?

Well...I could write more later, but long story short:

I believe I have enough skills and sufficient background in finance...but while recently looking for a job, I sent a resume to like 40 potentials employers and I got 2 replies - asking me to pay them $5000+ in order to get a job? On top of that i offered all these "firms" to work totally free in the beginnign for they can test me and then their answer is like: "yeah...you can work for free...but why not pay me some cash - you have money right...with all these terms that you use" - these are the replies i am getting so far, losely translated.
I mean come on...i am still schocked and can't even react to such horrendous bull****. There must be something terribly wrong in the economics today. 10x

thenmmm said:

I believe I have enough skills and sufficient background in finance...

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Maybe you're wrong.

I don't believe I have the background and applied for 2 internships, got both, and neither wanted a penny, and to cap it off, both were filled with idiots.

Hotch said:

Maybe you're wrong.

I don't believe I have the background and applied for 2 internships, got both, and neither wanted a penny, and to cap it off, both were filled with idiots.

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Perhaps, but a wild guess is that this intern doesn't offer any compensation at all?
And of course - it's absolutely possible that i am just terribly unlucky and need to apply for a few more jobs...will see.

What job are you applying for? A prop trader?

Bear in mind there are a lot of people out there looking for work. I know someone who has sent his CV to 20-30 agencies and is happy to do anything, temp or perm, but has had no luck. I think he only has education up to A-level standard, though.

thenmmm said:

Perhaps, but a wild guess is that this intern doesn't offer any compensation at all?
And of course - it's absolutely possible that i am just terribly unlucky and need to apply for a few more jobs...will see.

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Well, soon as you said you were willing to work without pay for a month, I figured that's what you were wanting.

Hotch said:

Well, soon as you said you were willing to work without pay for a month, I figured that's what you were wanting.

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As most people here (and...worldwide...) I want cash (surprisingly or not .

To Shakone: Good guess, not just for a prop trader but: risk analyst and a software developer in a bank/hedge fund.

To shadowninja: Yeah, I know there's some huge competition out there (speaking of which, most people here are aware of the famous youtube video "a hedge fund manager now delivers pizza"...or whatever the title was). The point is that different people look for different things - I mean some employers will be more likely to get a mathematical genius (like rensec, de shaw, etc) while others (prop firms, many hedge funds) will prefer someone with a proven track reckord and an expert in fundamental analysis etc.

I am just thinking on how to make my chances bigger - that is...what I consder my advantages would be: I have worked 6 months at a well known Swiss bank (software developer), have worked for 2 years at a hedge fund which did pretty well by the time when i was there (now...in backpruptcy but anywhow...), have MBA from the university of Liverpool, have developed many programs. models, etc like: Derivatives pricing (options, bonds, swaps, futures, accruals, CMS, CDO, forwards, repos, MBS, CFDs, ASX listed CFDs, CDS, warrants, turbos, FX – others), risk management (kelly criterion, hedging, diversification, var), econometrics (sharpe ratio, sortino ratio, treynor ratio, beta, omega, kurtosis, skewness, variance, standard deviation, moments, CAPM), trading (quantitative analysis, fundamental analysis, pure arbitrage, statistical arbitrage, neural networks, mispricings, high frequency trading, emerging markets).

What i consider my disadvantages are that...i am still relatively young for the field: 26,
I am non native to USA, UK, Australia, Japan, Germany, etc., my english skills are very good perhaps but not perfect, i don't have a phd let alone from harvard, princeton, oxford etc - and I will need 2 months to relocate to the states or one month to the UK.

But even then...come on - when you offer them a free work and they say you gonna need to pay them - it's ridiculous, even slaves in the roman empire weren't treated that badly.

Now anyway this message is already too long...

No reputable bank/hedge fund would ask a potential risk analyst and a software developer to hand over cash to work there. Lift your sights and apply to more reputable banks and hedge funds.
Where you from?

traderman1 said:

No reputable bank/hedge fund would ask a potential risk analyst and a software developer to hand over cash to work there. Lift your sights and apply to more reputable banks and hedge funds.
Where you from?

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Again...i am not saying that i want 100% to work for an "reputable" bank...second - I am not saying i want to "hand over cash" - if under this definition - you mean a "trader" - then again I already mentioned that i am not looking for a trader position 100%.

Anywhow...

Try on here. I've seen programmer type jobs at funds going on there before.

Whatever you do don't pay anyone for work experience.
Its illegal for them to offer that. Probably illegal to take you on for free too these days.
And be sure whoever you work for is FSA authorised (or equivalent).

http://www.efinancialcareers.co.uk/

ps 26 is not too young.

thenmmm said:

Again...i am not saying that i want 100% to work for an "reputable" bank...second - I am not saying i want to "hand over cash" - if under this definition - you mean a "trader" - then again I already mentioned that i am not looking for a trader position 100%.

Anywhow...

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Keep trying. To answer the title of this thread. I'm afraid that we have not seen the worst, yet, as far as unemployment is concerned. However, pay to be employed? I was an apprentice in the MN many years ago. The wages were rock bottom but never so bad as having to buy ourselves into a job.

One poster suggested writing to the better firms. That is what you have to do. Best of luck to you.

Splitlink said:

Keep trying. To answer the title of this thread. I'm afraid that we have not seen the worst, yet, as far as unemployment is concerned. However, pay to be employed? I was an apprentice in the MN many years ago. The wages were rock bottom but never so bad as having to buy ourselves into a job.

One poster suggested writing to the better firms. That is what you have to do. Best of luck to you.

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hmm, 10x mate,

Just to mention a few indicators to remind how bad the situation really is:

- Unenployment in the states - 30 years highest rate.
- Dollar - 15 years bottom.
- LIBOR...virtually nonexisting these days.
- Mean average of unenmployment worldwide (highest in...history!)
- 99% of the "employers" are nothing but brokers looking to match employers and an employee.

I know i sound overly pesimistic - but these are the facts...if I had enogh money to buy gold or short the dollar and at least pay my bills this way, then i would probably do it (though directional strategies aren't my cup of tea - market neutral makes you sleep better).

and...good luck to you 2.

thenmmm said:

$5000+ in order to get a job?

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I also fell for this trap. I thought I was applying through an employment agency where the employer pays the fee. It turned out in the fine print these were agencies who charged the employee an upfront fee to market them. I don't know if they also collected a fee from the employer.

I ended up starting my own businesses and getting some consulting gigs. Now that I'm retired I trade for a living and teach and give talks on my methods for additional income. Since you are just starting out you need to inventory your skills as well as your education. This may lead you to some outside-the-box opportunities to make enough money so that you can transition to doing what's fun for you to make a living.

HowardCohodas said:

I also fell for this trap. I thought I was applying through an employment agency where the employer pays the fee. It turned out in the fine print these were agencies who charged the employee an upfront fee to market them. I don't know if they also collected a fee from the employer.

I ended up starting my own businesses and getting some consulting gigs. Now that I'm retired I trade for a living and teach and give talks on my methods for additional income. Since you are just starting out you need to inventory your skills as well as your education. This may lead you to some outside-the-box opportunities to make enough money so that you can transition to doing what's fun for you to make a living.

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you mean you paid them?
I should most likely change my strategy and send the cv only to employers and not brokers, but they are the overwhealming majority, so far I've see only one job classified from an employer and that is...deutsche bank - where i don't think i'll be qualified enough to work atm.

thenmmm said:

you mean you paid them?
I should most likely change my strategy and send the cv only to employers and not brokers, but they are the overwhealming majority, so far I've see only one job classified from an employer and that is...deutsche bank - where i don't think i'll be qualified enough to work atm.

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Did not pay them money. Paid them a visit. Let them move me up the executive chain making the pitch with increasingly grandiose claims. I had already traveled an hour to get there so I thought I'd spend some time to learn as much as I could about their operation.

From an employer's point of view, agencies can be a benefit, but mostly they are not. The good ones will screen the potential applicants and only submit qualified ones. Most will submit anyone who is on their list and let the potential employer sort it out. As an employer, I preferred those applicants who took the initiative to contact me directly. But then I had to qualify them. It's my preference, not everyone's.

HowardCohodas said:

Did not pay them money. Paid them a visit. Let them move me up the executive chain making the pitch with increasingly grandiose claims. I had already traveled an hour to get there so I thought I'd spend some time to learn as much as I could about their operation.

From an employer's point of view, agencies can be a benefit, but mostly they are not. The good ones will screen the potential applicants and only submit qualified ones. Most will submit anyone who is on their list and let the potential employer sort it out. As an employer, I preferred those who took the initiative to contact me directly. But then I had to qualify them. It's my preference, not everyone's.

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ah ic now .

But still, to quote perhaps the father of modern day capitalism: time is money (b.franklin), so wasting time should be the same as losing money.
Not that i am not wasting my time with agencies online...

The answer is simple, you don't have the experience to be employed in the position you want.
You don't have the skills to be a trader and potential employers can see this, that's why they're asking for a deposit. For this reason you can't be a financial analyst and if you can't trade, how could you possibly write software????

If you are lacking the technical qualifications you could try the direct approach.
Frequent the area the employees work, chat to them, buy a few drinks etc

Find out who to talk to and what they like etc. bluff and brown nose your way in if you have enough personality.

If you have to write anything then for Gawds sake read it through and correct the spelling mistakes etc. Your posts are loaded with them and it only takes a minute. Mistakes look sloppy. Dress right for the country and job, but well.

good luck

Depth Trade said:

The answer is simple, you don't have the experience to be employed in the position you want.
You don't have the skills to be a trader and potential employers can see this, that's why they're asking for a deposit. For this reason you can't be a financial analyst and if you can't trade, how could you possibly write software????

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You're funny... (or sound like that... - no offense).

What do you consider a qualified candidate then? Not everyone employed has a Phd from Oxford, right?

thenmmm said:

You're funny... (or sound like that... - no offense).

What do you consider a qualified candidate then? Not everyone employed has a Phd from Oxford, right?

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