thought i would share this with you folks
http://en.sevenload.com/videos/UsTF3KX-The-Great-Global-Warming-Swindle
http://en.sevenload.com/videos/UsTF3KX-The-Great-Global-Warming-Swindle
jefftheripper
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thanks for sharing Forker.
forker,
Do you have anything to say, or is your "contribution" limited to cut paste jobs of video links that were debunked long ago?
In case you are unaware, every national science academy, scientific society or professional association of international standing that has issued a public position, without exception, asserts that the planet is warming, humans are responsible and there is indeed a problem.
Who is more likely to be correct - the peak bodies of world science or some attention seeking dick making a propaganda video?
Do you have anything to say, or is your "contribution" limited to cut paste jobs of video links that were debunked long ago?
In case you are unaware, every national science academy, scientific society or professional association of international standing that has issued a public position, without exception, asserts that the planet is warming, humans are responsible and there is indeed a problem.
Who is more likely to be correct - the peak bodies of world science or some attention seeking dick making a propaganda video?
The Artist
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Considering repetitive failures to agree on a federal emissions cap-and-trade or tax regime, most American senators must have seen this documentary.
FX Bandit
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This is a pretty gross distortion of the truth, as you're probably aware.
No it is not. It is a fact that no scientific organization of international standing disputes the reality of AGW. If you want to contest that, then produce one that does.
In particular the national science academies of all major nations assert the reality of AGW. As do major bodies such as the American Association for the Advancement of Science, the American Geophysical Union and the World Meteorological Organization.
This is a matter of fact, not opinion.
Shakone
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The planet IS warming. This is hard to argue with. Whether it is humans fault is hugely debatable. You simply can't prove that. It makes some sense, and the consensus is that it is humans fault, but many experts doubt it and in the end it is just a theory. Some doubt that it will be as catastrophic as predicted, that the earth will cope and balance out and others believe it is a natural phenomenon that would have occurred anyway.
Does reciting this stuff make you feel better?
Many "experts" do not doubt the reality of AGW if by expert you mean scientists who are actively publishing research material in climatology and related fields. Surveys of the literature and of expert opinion have repeatedly shown an overwhelming expert assertion of the realities of AGW.
This, incidentally, is why all major scientific organizations that have a public position also assert the reality of AGW.
Newtons theory of gravitation is "just" a theory, Einsteins work on special relativity and general relativity are "just" theories, that HIV is responsible for AIDS is "just" a theory but they fit observational evidence extremely well. The same is the case for AGW.
The nonsense currently being flung about declaring there is not "proof" is utterly irrelevant. There is no "proof" in science and never has been. Science is about observational evidence and testing theory against observational evidence. Formal proof is a matter for mathematics and is not the same thing at all.
Shakone
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Wrong. Here is a list
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_o...tream_scientific_assessment_of_global_warming
Quite a few there, and they obviously can't include everyone on the page. Geologists, professors of earth sciences, physicists, meteorologists, atmospheric scientists etc. That is what I call many experts, all disagreeing with various parts of the standard theory. I assume most of those are more qualified than you to have an opinion on the matter. Therefore their opinion deserves respect, whether they are wrong or right.
Newton's theory and Einstein's theory, both have mathematical proofs, and make predictions which turn out to be largely correct and you can test them repeatedly. Global warming hypothesis has no proof, and its predicitons we won't know if they're correct for many decades or maybe even centuries, and it is not like we can test it. Not even close to the same situation.
Agreed, but as I said, all we know is that the temperature is warming. We don't know why, and we can guess at the cause, but that is all it is, a guess, with no evidence to back it up. The earth has had rising temperatures and even an ice age before humans were alive. Don't attribute everything to humans. If you asked my opinion, I'd guess it was human caused too. But it is far from guaranteed.
FX Bandit
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What of the memberships of these groups? Like I said, a gross distortion of the truth.
The memberships of the national academies is composed of the most eminent scientists of their respective nations generally with distinguished careers and significant research achievements for example being award a Nobel Prize. National academies are the organizations governments draw on for scientific advice for example in establishing an advisory committee on a specific scientific issue and for more general issues of science policy. They are the peak bodies of science around the world.
It is a fact that no scientific organization of international standing disputes AGW. You are flinging around accusations of "gross distortions of the truth" without a shred of evidence to back them up.
Your assertions here are 100% wrong. It is nothing like a guess. There are multiple lines of evidence that all lead to the AGW conclusion. To name a few:
1. Nighttime temperatures are warming more than daytime. This is a direct fingerprint of an enhanced greenhouse effect. If increases in solar irradience were responsible, days would be warming more than nights.
2. It is warming more at higher latitudes than at lower. Again this is a direct consequence of an enhanced greenhouse effect.
3. While the troposphere is warming, the stratosphere is cooling. Again a direct fingerprint of an enhanced greenhouse effect. A correct prediction of climate models.
4. There is a measured radiative imbalance from the planet. More energy is coming in from the Sun than is being radiated back into space. That excess energy is causing temperatures to rise. This is known from satellite and ground based observation. Another direct fingerprint of an enhanced greenhouse effect.
5. Changes in atmospheric composition are confirmed by isotopic studies of atmospheric carbon and also by direct calculation of human originated emissions.
6. The first order feedback mechanism of increased water in the atmosphere is confirmed by observation of rising specific humidity.
These are a but a few of the fingerprints of AGW. There is in fact mountains of evidence which is why organizations such as the American Physical Society make statements like this:
"Emissions of greenhouse gases from human activities are changing the atmosphere in ways that affect the Earth's climate. Greenhouse gases include carbon dioxide as well as methane, nitrous oxide and other gases. They are emitted from fossil fuel combustion and a range of industrial and agricultural processes.
The evidence is incontrovertible: Global warming is occurring. If no mitigating actions are taken, significant disruptions in the Earth’s physical and ecological systems, social systems, security and human health are likely to occur. We must reduce emissions of greenhouse gases beginning now."
http://www.aps.org/policy/statements/07_1.cfm
Carefully notice the phrasing. They do not say "it is our opinion". They do say The evidence is incontrovertible
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counter_violent
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Global warming my ****. Biggest con ever.
We did'nt need the vid to know that natural cycles occur on a universal scale.
We did'nt need the vid to know that natural cycles occur on a universal scale.
I believe that you are right, it cannot be proved that humans are responsible.
Nevertheless, can we afford not to believe it? We are going to be told, by all those who benefit by pollution and they include all multinational airlines and others, that we need not worry, just go on as we are.
This is the same argument put forward by tobacco companies that their product does not cause lung cancer. That took fifty years to convince smokers otherwise. Can we afford to wait another fifty years before we are convinced, one way or the other?
Dare I say this? The BP oil disaster, unfortunately, was not catastrophic enough. We are, already, being told that Mother Nature will take care of it all. Now, we have toxic pollution in Hungary, which is in danger of killing everyone, who ingests it, all the way to the Black Sea and, probably, beyond.
What I mention does not have a direct link to this subject, arguably, but it is an example of the human being's state of mind and capacity for sweeping unpleasant facts under the carpet.
keep on dreaming sunshine.. global warming is nothing more than a man made, like religion. as for debunking why dont you prove it instead of remarking it!
of course they assert it, their funding\jobs depend on it.
An asinine comment. As I said in my first comment on this thread, you are capable only of drive by cut and paste of hyperlinks and nothing more. You would be well advised to educate yourself on a topic you clearly know nothing about.
Clearly your'e an expert on the subject. I could choose to play your childish games all day bye posting articles such as:
http://www.dailyexpress.co.uk/posts/view/204880/Global-warming-is-the-greatest-fraud-in-60-years-/
or
http://www.dailytech.com/NASA+Study...Responsible+for+Past+Warming/article15310.htm
or
http://www.oism.org/pproject/s33p36.htm
or
how about 30 000 scientists (9 000 phd's)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FfHW7KR33IQ&feature=player_embedded
but i would only be wasting my time on an ignorant moron that reads the BS data compiled by corrupt scientists\reporters and other various sources that basically pull a salary from funds focused on the subject that are driven by political and economic reasons. as for cutting and pasting links, they prove more significant than the absolute crap that is coming our of your mouth. All your posts are backed by what? exactly nothing... The fact that this world is so screwed up is because idiots such as yourself believe anything and cannot think for yourselves. No wonder scams are so easy to pull off, maybe ill sell you a Co2 mask for a quick buck some day..
Shakone
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Lol, oh dear. If the evidence is incontrovertible, why do you have that long list of professors who disagree with the standard theory about man made global warming? These guys have spent decades studying climate and geology and researching it, and you're going to come along with your naive understanding and tell them that the proof is incontrovertible?! Lol. At least have some respect for people that know much more about the topic than you or I do. They have their doubts. That's enough for me to think it is not as clear cut as you make out.
As I said the globe is warming. That is hard to argue with and there is data supporting it. Nobody is certain of the cause. And nobody is certain about the long term implications. Mayeb we'll all be burned alive or frozen to death, or maybe the earth has a way of regulating itself, and we're panicking over nothing. The earth has its own system which is not so easily influence by man.
You also seem to have a weird understanding about scientific organisations. They are not the powerhouses of truth you think they are (and I say this as a former academic). No great theories were created by Scientific Societies. General relativity didn't come from a scientific society, it came from an individual. If you've spent time around scientists and academics, you'll realise that it isn't always about the truth, it is about funding. It is easy to get funding to investigate global warming, just as it is easy to get funding for string theory. Of course String theory hasn't produced anythign useful, and many people think it is a waste of time, but you can get funding, so I'm sure there are plenty of societies supporting it and saying how sure they are about it.
hows this for a tit bit.. top scientist Dr. Harold Lewis resigns from APS.
here is his resignation letter:
“When I first joined the American Physical Society sixty-seven years ago it was much smaller, much gentler, and as yet uncorrupted by the money flood (a threat against which Dwight Eisenhower warned a half-century ago). Indeed, the choice of physics as a profession was then a guarantor of a life of poverty and abstinence—-it was World War II that changed all that. The prospect of worldly gain drove few physicists. As recently as thirty-five years ago, when I chaired the first APS study of a contentious social/scientific issue, The Reactor Safety Study, though there were zealots aplenty on the outside there was no hint of inordinate pressure on us as physicists. We were therefore able to produce what I believe was and is an honest appraisal of the situation at that time. We were further enabled by the presence of an oversight committee consisting of Pief Panofsky, Vicki Weisskopf, and Hans Bethe, all towering physicists beyond reproach. I was proud of what we did in a charged atmosphere. In the end the oversight committee, in its report to the APS President, noted the complete independence in which we did the job, and predicted that the report would be attacked from both sides. What greater tribute could there be?”
“How different it is now. The giants no longer walk the earth, and the money flood has become the raison d’être of much physics research, the vital sustenance of much more, and it provides the support for untold numbers of professional jobs. For reasons that will soon become clear my former pride at being an APS Fellow all these years has been turned into shame, and I am forced, with no pleasure at all, to offer you my resignation from the Society.It is of course, the global warming scam, with the (literally) trillions of dollars driving it, that has corrupted so many scientists, and has carried APS before it like a rogue wave.”
“It is the greatest and most successful pseudoscientific fraud I have seen in my long life as a physicist. Anyone who has the faintest doubt that this is so should force himself to read the ClimateGate documents, which lay it bare. (Montford’s book organizes the facts very well.) I don’t believe that any real physicist, nay scientist, can read that stuff without revulsion. I would almost make that revulsion a definition of the word scientist.”
Dr. Lewis closes with:
“I do feel the need to add one note, and this is conjecture, since it is always risky to discuss other people’s motives. This scheming at APS HQ is so bizarre that there cannot be a simple explanation for it. Some have held that the physicists of today are not as smart as they used to be, but I don’t think that is an issue. I think it is the money, exactly what Eisenhower warned about a half-century ago. There are indeed trillions of dollars involved, to say nothing of the fame and glory (and frequent trips to exotic islands) that go with being a member of the club. Your own Physics Department (of which you are chairman) would lose millions a year if the global warming bubble burst. When Penn State absolved Mike Mann of wrongdoing, and the University of East Anglia did the same for Phil Jones, they cannot have been unaware of the financial penalty for doing otherwise. As the old saying goes, you don’t have to be a weatherman to know which way the wind is blowing. Since I am no philosopher, I’m not going to explore at just which point enlightened self-interest crosses the line into corruption, but a careful reading of the ClimateGate releases makes it clear that this is not an academic question.”
“I want no part of it, so please accept my resignation. APS no longer represents me, but I hope we are still friends.”
the article can be found at:
http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/28550
here is his resignation letter:
“When I first joined the American Physical Society sixty-seven years ago it was much smaller, much gentler, and as yet uncorrupted by the money flood (a threat against which Dwight Eisenhower warned a half-century ago). Indeed, the choice of physics as a profession was then a guarantor of a life of poverty and abstinence—-it was World War II that changed all that. The prospect of worldly gain drove few physicists. As recently as thirty-five years ago, when I chaired the first APS study of a contentious social/scientific issue, The Reactor Safety Study, though there were zealots aplenty on the outside there was no hint of inordinate pressure on us as physicists. We were therefore able to produce what I believe was and is an honest appraisal of the situation at that time. We were further enabled by the presence of an oversight committee consisting of Pief Panofsky, Vicki Weisskopf, and Hans Bethe, all towering physicists beyond reproach. I was proud of what we did in a charged atmosphere. In the end the oversight committee, in its report to the APS President, noted the complete independence in which we did the job, and predicted that the report would be attacked from both sides. What greater tribute could there be?”
“How different it is now. The giants no longer walk the earth, and the money flood has become the raison d’être of much physics research, the vital sustenance of much more, and it provides the support for untold numbers of professional jobs. For reasons that will soon become clear my former pride at being an APS Fellow all these years has been turned into shame, and I am forced, with no pleasure at all, to offer you my resignation from the Society.It is of course, the global warming scam, with the (literally) trillions of dollars driving it, that has corrupted so many scientists, and has carried APS before it like a rogue wave.”
“It is the greatest and most successful pseudoscientific fraud I have seen in my long life as a physicist. Anyone who has the faintest doubt that this is so should force himself to read the ClimateGate documents, which lay it bare. (Montford’s book organizes the facts very well.) I don’t believe that any real physicist, nay scientist, can read that stuff without revulsion. I would almost make that revulsion a definition of the word scientist.”
Dr. Lewis closes with:
“I do feel the need to add one note, and this is conjecture, since it is always risky to discuss other people’s motives. This scheming at APS HQ is so bizarre that there cannot be a simple explanation for it. Some have held that the physicists of today are not as smart as they used to be, but I don’t think that is an issue. I think it is the money, exactly what Eisenhower warned about a half-century ago. There are indeed trillions of dollars involved, to say nothing of the fame and glory (and frequent trips to exotic islands) that go with being a member of the club. Your own Physics Department (of which you are chairman) would lose millions a year if the global warming bubble burst. When Penn State absolved Mike Mann of wrongdoing, and the University of East Anglia did the same for Phil Jones, they cannot have been unaware of the financial penalty for doing otherwise. As the old saying goes, you don’t have to be a weatherman to know which way the wind is blowing. Since I am no philosopher, I’m not going to explore at just which point enlightened self-interest crosses the line into corruption, but a careful reading of the ClimateGate releases makes it clear that this is not an academic question.”
“I want no part of it, so please accept my resignation. APS no longer represents me, but I hope we are still friends.”
the article can be found at:
http://canadafreepress.com/index.php/article/28550
