Calling all "Senior Members T2W" Experienced traders! Help Newbies?

Will all senior members experienced traders please help us "Newbies"? It would be great from my point of view and I am sure a lot of other inexperienced traders my agree if we could get some views on the items I have listed below.
My plan is to try and get more experienced and learn more about charting and training is to go on QUALITY training courses read as many books as possible and listen an follow experienced traders threads on this site. What is obvious, is we know nothing! and may easily be lead to part with our cash in the hope of getting expert tuition. Please Help!

What opions do the Experienced traders on this site have on the list below?

1, What are the best training courses available for learning Charting/Money Management/building a System ,that experienced traders went on when they were learning? are there any courses in the north of the county?

2, Are there any experienced traders who might allow a newbie to sit with them for a day or two,to allow them to see how they trade. This is something I would Love to do and believe would be priceless to a newbie.

3, Do traders have any thoughts on who are the good guys-gals /bad guys-gals to watch for on this site ( I appoligise in advance if people think this one may be a bit ambiguous, who knows?)

4, Have any of the experienced traders been on T2W courses and whata ya tink?
( I have looked at reviews section of this site but would rather hear it from the "horses mouth" so to speak.

5, Any views/help experienced traders may think is relevant to above.

I will post a thread on the newbies discussion forum linking it back to here, should this thread get off the ground.

Many Thanks in Advance

To save me posting lots of links, Helenqu has done a good job here:-

http://thetradepit.com/forum/viewforum.php?f=25

It might be worth asking about the 'TA in a nutshell' course. I think it is generally held 'up north' and has good reviews here http://www.trade2win.com/reviews/product.php?id=139

Gardan, good intent and I hope you get lots of reasoned and pertinent replies, but I'd like to put the record straight on 'that' thread.

When I started the thread I had no idea what the relationship was and at the time, thought they were one and the same. They are not.

Unfortunately, although Duncan Robertson (allegedly a former student of Chief Wizard) is probably one to avoid, the thread 'developed' into a fairly out-and-attack on another t2w member who had and has not to my knowledge indicated any desire or intention to charge members for anything.

Be very careful to clearly separate those responses from people who have direct experience of the trainers/courses being discussed and those that have a hidden agenda or perhaps a vested interest.

I think you're more likely to benefit from the PMs which will inevitably wing their way to you (especially regarding your poiint #3!) and you can also check out the various, fairly recent, threads relating to coaches/courses throughout these forums.

Good luck.

the only real way to learn to trade is to work for a trading company that gives you access to daily support until you are a successful trader or have failed - at least a year of day in day out trading

getting training for a day or two is a complete waste of time - and worse, you will probably be learning from someone who has never made it as a trader, so you will be learning how to fail as a trader, not how to succeed

stevet

While I agree that one or two days with a proffessional is probably not going to make that much difference I totally disagree that the only way you can learn to trade is to work at a trading company. On the contrary you can learn a good deal about good trading styles from reading books, talking to other traders on this and other sites, and experimenting with trading systems that you think of. Even if from all of these you only learn about the power of compound interest and the dangers posed by active trading you will be well ahead of most of the public when it comes to managing your money.

Gardan - i've not gone on any trading courses but I know a few people who have gone on some - in particular one run by Mr. Charts who posts on here regularly. In general the overall opinion is that you can learn some things from such courses but in no way should you consider yourself a trader having attended one or two courses. Be very wary at giving money to people who will a) make you a million as a property developer b) give you to tools you need to make a million from stock trading and c) teach you how to read stock charts like a professional in one day - they are all frauds!

All IMHO

ew.

Read 'Come into my trading room' by Dr Alexander Elder. It will discuss among other things a trading plan. You will come to realise you need to find your own. You might like the examples within the book or it might just provide you with a starting direction. It is an easy read and does not cost a fortune.

You will need to establish what style of trading suits you and what time frame. Then you need to develop your trading strategy around this. Your p;an should consider all aspects of what is required as you approach a trade, while open and when you come to close. The books can start you off but then you will need to practise as you trade and this will help you find your way and what suits you best.

Good luck

Kevin

I have been on some courses but don't think you can get away from just plain learning by experience! You can only take in so much information on a course.
Lots of reading around the subject helps but a lot of books are the same stuff put in a different way by traders who weren't that good in the first place so sell books instead.. the same with the courses.. easier to make a quick few bob out of just talking about trading than actually doing it.
I have found regulaly talking face to face with lots of other traders/investors very helpful and it is free!

Thanks to all above, I am going to research some of the link/advice.
Racer: I did you get the opportunity to speak to other traders face to face??
Kevin: "Come into my trading room is on order,Thanks"
ewilcox: I totally agree with your statement about courses that promise to much, I'm looking for courses that may help with the basics to perhaps speed my apprenticeship up a little.
Bramble: Thanks I will take up all your suggestions.
Stevet: I can not believe that QUALITY training of any length of time is a waste of time, the problem I and we newbies face is finding the best value for money quality training I think?
Bigbusiness: Thanks for the links-I off to check them out.
Many thanks all.

Gardan, I organise the monthly SW meetings and have done so for 5 years! (see T2W home page and social forums)

ewilcox

perhaps we need to define "learn" - sure someone can learn some of the technicalities of trading by reading books and looking at posts etc - but there is a big big big gap between the technicalities and making a profit at trading - and that gap normally ends up costing people a lot of money in losses

any comment i make is specific to becoming a profitable trader

Gardan

you might not believe it - but perhaps you will one day!

if you cannot get a job as a learner trader - the best value for money way to at least start to learn about trading is to read as much stuff as you can for free and watch markets day in day out to figure out whats going on - the more you do this - the more you will realise that everything you read or hear is just repeating the same old stuff over and over - just dressed up differently

and trainers make their money by offering paid services to people who know nothing about trading - trainers may seem like nice people, they may make it seem they are doing you a favour, they may seem to know something you dont, they may allude to their trading capabilities - but ultimatly they are marketing themselves to get money from you and the trainer is not a trader - and whatever you get for your money you can get for free anyway - but without th danger of learning the same things that stopped the trainer being a successful trader

There's one huge problem when starting out - deafness.

That's because 99% of newbies are deaf when they are told by genuine traders the real hard facts that they need to know about trading. First of all they put their hands up in horror, then they give a mouthful to the person who has told them, and then they firmly slap their hands over their ears so that they can't hear any more.

And then someone comes along who tells them all the sorts of things they want to hear. Wonderful cosy things such as how easy it all is, how it only takes a few hours to master the markets, how money just falls over itself to jump into their accounts, how special software will only select winning stocks, how a newsletter will reveal all the secrets, how there are secret formulae and secret pivot levels which are guaranteed to work, there's a guaranteed money-back offer, etc, etc. They are wooed by these softly spoken people and happily hand over thousands of pounds and wait eagerly with their wheelbarrows to cart off all the promised riches from the market. And they end up having to sell the wheelbarrow to get the bus fare for the trip home.

There are things newbies NEED to know, but these are never the things they WANT to know.

Skimbleshanks

wow - guess you are in a not holding back mood!

well done for telling it as it is!

this site is definetly getting into the real world

perhaps we need to define "learn" - sure someone can learn some of the technicalities of trading by reading books and looking at posts etc - but there is a big big big gap between the technicalities and making a profit at trading - and that gap normally ends up costing people a lot of money in losses

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Ok - I can certainly agree that it is one thing that to read books and trade is a different thing but I still don't understand your comment that you must work for a trading firm to become a trader. Indeed some of the more interesting and profitable people I know have never been a "trader" in city lingo.

Walk a little slower

stevet said:

Skimbleshanks

wow - guess you are in a not holding back mood!

well done for telling it as it is!

this site is definetly getting into the real world

Click to expand...

Yeah - I agree..

I've stopped telling people how much hard work is involved, albeit I can be rather blunt at times. After a while I felt I was banging my head against the wall.

Reminds me of the tale of the Walrus and the Carpenter, how the little oysters were taken for walkies, then scoffed by the "friendly" duo.

We still get the oysters seeking anything that precludes them using their own brain and perspiration.

But some heed the warnings, so it's worthwhile for other expereienced traders to ring the alarm bells at times.

Reminds me of the tale of the Walrus and the Carpenter, how the little oysters were taken for walkies, then scoffed by the "friendly" duo.

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You've had enough for one night ;-)

ewilcox

i didnt say you must work for a trading firm in order to learn - i said that it was the only real way to learn

sure it might be possible to learn just through having a go yourself - reading everthing you can find and losing a bunch of money and spending a long time to possibly become a profitable trader - but that does not make it a realistic way to learn - in the same way that someone might become a brain surgeon by having a go themselves - reading books about brain surgery and checking out brain surgeon forums - but that dont make it a real way to learn - just ask their patients!

by the way - brain surgery is way way easier than trading - thats why you earn much much more in trading

re your more interesting and profitable people - who never had exposure to a professional enviroment - i have never met one yet - so you are lucky to know so many!

but i assume they are in professional establishments now or else have professional brokers?

the only real way to learn to trade is to work for a trading company that gives you access to daily support until you are a successful trader or have failed - at least a year of day in day out trading

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errr...yes

i didnt say you must work for a trading firm in order to learn

Click to expand...

...thats exactly what you said..

Racer said:

Gardan, I organise the monthly SW meetings and have done so for 5 years! (see T2W home page and social forums)

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Thanks Racer: I have to admit just still finding my way around this site I completely missed the "Social Forums" Just had a look and seems a great way to meet other traders. Looking forward to going to one of the meetings. Was the last one in the Northwest last year?
Thanks

Skimbleshanks said:

There's one huge problem when starting out - deafness.

That's because 99% of newbies are deaf when they are told by genuine traders the real hard facts that they need to know about trading. First of all they put their hands up in horror, then they give a mouthful to the person who has told them, and then they firmly slap their hands over their ears so that they can't hear any more.

And then someone comes along who tells them all the sorts of things they want to hear. Wonderful cosy things such as how easy it all is, how it only takes a few hours to master the markets, how money just falls over itself to jump into their accounts, how special software will only select winning stocks, how a newsletter will reveal all the secrets, how there are secret formulae and secret pivot levels which are guaranteed to work, there's a guaranteed money-back offer, etc, etc. They are wooed by these softly spoken people and happily hand over thousands of pounds and wait eagerly with their wheelbarrows to cart off all the promised riches from the market. And they end up having to sell the wheelbarrow to get the bus fare for the trip home.

There are things newbies NEED to know, but these are never the things they WANT to know.

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On the contrary,surely by my first post I (newbie) have asked for the help from the more experienced in the group.I (newbie) do not have rose tinted specs and appreciate what a long and difficult road it will be to learn the art of trading.If 99% of newbies are deaf as you have pointed out ,where did all the experienced traders come from? If I have implied anywhere in my posts that I fall into the 99% I would like to assure you,nothing could be further from the truth.
Please tell us the "real hard facts" I for one need to know!
Thanks

Was the last one in the Northwest last year?

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Being in the SW I can't really answer that!
But think it was this year??