Refco - Anyone Long?

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$spreader

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• Oct 12, 2005

• #1

Has anyone got info regarding the refco trading arcades - are they safe, following the recent collapse in share price?

Just scanning the net we've found some US clearers(who clear thru refco) are seriously considering their position.

 

Directional

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• Oct 12, 2005

• #2

have heard no word in the London offices other than business as usual. Refco apparently have $20bn in segregated customer funds, and even at the $10 share mark they are capitalized at $1.5bn or something, and cleared around $170m in profit last year. Not exactly a shaky business model.

 

J

JP1966

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• Oct 12, 2005

• #3

But any institution relies on liquidity not profitability. If enough large players decide to withdraw funds then the situation could get horrible very quickly. I am not saying it is the most likely sceanrio but in my view anyone keeping funds with Refco at the moment must be mad.

 

Directional

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• Oct 13, 2005

• #4

yes, and they also rely on trust, which seems like Refco have lost at the moment.

 

$

$spreader

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• Oct 13, 2005

• #5

Arbitrageur said:

yes, and they also rely on trust, which seems like Refco have lost at the moment.

Click to expand...

With the boss hiding $400m in bad debt ,is it a surprise trust is in short supply?

Add to that the law suits that are being filed against them for misleading potential shareholders at their IPO in August where they arranged $580m by allegedly providing false accounts and now they themselves are saying the accounts going back to 2002 cannot be relied upon.

 

Last edited: Oct 13, 2005

TWI

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• Oct 13, 2005

• #6

It is lights out . Everybody is getting their money out, the business is illiquid. They are finished.

 

Q

Quenkish

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• Oct 13, 2005

• #7

twalker said:

They are finished.

Click to expand...

Is it really that bad?

 

darktone

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• Oct 13, 2005

• #8

QuenkishZakos said:

Is it really that bad?

Click to expand...

do a google!!

sobering!

 

M

mickandpete

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• Oct 13, 2005

• #9

Just a thought
Where does it stop?
How many other broker/SB firms have money tied up with them?

 

C

Calypso

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• Oct 13, 2005

• #10

I wonder which is the safer arcade to join now ? Is it TCA or Refco

 

$

$spreader

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• Oct 13, 2005

• #11

Does it matter - The flipper is gonna get everyone's money eventually anyway!

 

Last edited: Oct 13, 2005

P

Pitscum

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• Oct 14, 2005

• #12

anyone here dealing thru refco and is worried? i might have an out for you if you have form...segregated accounts too, i.e. not domino effect....

 

O

okwon

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• Oct 14, 2005

• #13

twalker said:

It is lights out . Everybody is getting their money out, the business is illiquid. They are finished.

Click to expand...

I know Refco Capital Markets is illiquid b/c of this, but is RTS really closing up shop as well?

 

B

badtrader

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• Oct 14, 2005

• #14

okwon said:

I know Refco Capital Markets is illiquid b/c of this, but is RTS really closing up shop as well?

Click to expand...

Few! I had a futures account with them not so long back. I now have a new broker based in London. Lucky I got out

 

Directional

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• Oct 14, 2005

• #15

okwon said:

I know Refco Capital Markets is illiquid b/c of this, but is RTS really closing up shop as well?

Click to expand...

Business as usual here at RTS

 

J

jondoe

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• Oct 14, 2005

• #16

Nothing seems to have changed here at RTS, I came in this morning expecting a padlock on the door, but nothing has changed. I think the panic which set in yesterday has calmed down now. The LCH and CME have put out statements saying our money is whole and safe, I along with other guys are waiting for Eurex to say the same.

 

P

Parky

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• Oct 14, 2005

• #17

Calypso said:

I wonder which is the safer arcade to join now ? Is it TCA or Refco

Click to expand...

Not TCA, the difference here is that eveyone will get their money back it just may take a little time. This is not a bad trade, this is bad news and the flood of clients taking their money out on the back of the news and snowballing the situation.
Refco have a good balance sheet and are FSA registered to hold client funds so under FSA and CFTC rules will have too make good all client balances. Refco have a substantial balance sheet so this is not a "Griffin" or "ICA".
My advice would be to find another high quality balance sheet arcade where you would enjoy the same level of protection.

 

H

holy man

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• Oct 14, 2005

• #18

A couple of comments

this would never have happened if dick & bunker were stll running the show.!!

who do you think constitutes a better arcade if rts&tca are ignored??

 

Directional

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• Oct 14, 2005

• #19

and excluding arcades that clear through refco? that will cut the number by a large percentage

 

M

Mint Futures

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• Oct 14, 2005

• #20

Well as Dick is now running SFX at STA, and STA are not clearing Refco. I would say Schneider Trading is a viable alternative?........... And they are matching the Refco rates.