Psychology... the poll

This is a discussion on Psychology... the poll within the Psychology, Risk & Money Management forums, part of the Methods category; Originally Posted by Splitlink Which emotion is encapsulated within a stop order, greed, fear, both or none?...

View Poll Results: Does psychology matter in trading?
Yes, without it, you are doomed to failure. 114 87.02%
No, it is overhyped. 17 12.98%
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Old Mar 24, 2008, 9:52am   #61
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Originally Posted by Splitlink View Post

Which emotion is encapsulated within a stop order, greed, fear, both or none?
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Old Mar 24, 2008, 10:01am   #62
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One more. How much 'psychology' does a fully automated system hold within it's structure?
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Old Mar 24, 2008, 10:33am   #63
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Which emotion is encapsulated within a stop order, greed, fear, both or none?
Fear, but pushed to one side, with stops, because I try to figure out where everyone else will put most of them. That is, certainly, not the spot to put one's own! So it must be in , what is potentially, a dangerous place. No sense in putting it closer, for obvious reasons, so it must be farther away. Where fear starts to overcome, then it is best to not to enter that trade, I suppose. Nevertheless, these stops are taken out so rapidly that if there is a reversal, your misery will soon be over, one way or the other. Hopefully, the price will bounce away from you.

I believe that fear is an emotion that should not be ignored. It is a good indicator of what you think of that trade, which can be reduced by reducing the size.

Lots do not agree with me. They believe that all these emotions should be eliminated but I believe in using whatever gifts God has given me.

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Old Mar 24, 2008, 10:52am   #64
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Originally Posted by Splitlink View Post
Fear, but pushed to one side, with stops, because I try to figure out where everyone else will put most of them. That is, certainly, not the spot to put one's own! So it must be in , what is potentially, a dangerous place. No sense in putting it closer, for obvious reasons, so it must be farther away. Where fear starts to overcome, then it is best to not to enter that trade, I suppose. Nevertheless, these stops are taken out so rapidly that if there is a reversal, your misery will soon be over, one way or the other. Hopefully, the price will bounce away from you.

I believe that fear is an emotion that should not be ignored. It is a good indicator of what you think of that trade, which can be reduced by reducing the size.

Lots do not agree with me, They believe that all these emotions should be eliminated but I believe in using whatever gifts God has given me.

Split
This, BTW, is not a method that I have always used. I used to prefer close stops but recent writings on these boards have persuaded me to put them farther away. So, yes, I have to contend more with fear.

Split
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Old Mar 24, 2008, 11:01am   #65
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This, BTW, is not a method that I have always used. I used to prefer close stops but recent writings on these boards have persuaded me to put them farther away. So, yes, I have to contend more with fear.

Split
Split, once your stop order has been placed, is there still 'fear'?
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Old Mar 24, 2008, 11:20am   #66
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Split, once your stop order has been placed, is there still 'fear'?
If I put my stop further away than all the others, I know that the odd spike could take me out, as well. I've got enough in the account to take care of any losses and keep on trading, but I am pleased when the market has taken its decision and I have a better idea of whether I am going to make a profit, or not. Perhaps, fear is too strong a word but some emotion is there and the longer the time that the market does take, then the worse the feeling gets.

The best is when the price moves away from your stop, at once. I'm getting better at that but I am, still, not an expert .

Am going out for a few hours, BTW, so excuse any gaps in posts.

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Old Mar 24, 2008, 11:28am   #67
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If I put my stop further away than all the others, I know that the odd spike could take me out, as well. I've got enough in the account to take care of any losses and keep on trading, but I am pleased when the market has taken its decision and I have a better idea of whether I am going to make a profit, or not. Perhaps, fear is too strong a word but some emotion is there and the longer the time that the market does take, then the worse the feeling gets.

The best is when the price moves away from your stop, at once. I'm getting better at that but I am, still, not an expert .

Am going out for a few hours, BTW, so excuse any gaps in posts.

Split

So fear is an emotion that has strong links to a traders ability to correctly 'read' the market?
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Old Mar 24, 2008, 11:56am   #68
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What does a trader fear most, themselves, the market or the system?
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Old Mar 24, 2008, 1:57pm   #69
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So fear is an emotion that has strong links to a traders ability to correctly 'read' the market?
No, fear, is an emotion that calls for prudence when reading the market. Anyone who fearlessly trades is like someone on a bike, as long as he doesn't go too fast he's ok. But what if he finds himself on a bend, going downhill, and it's raining? Having been in a situation like that I know that it is too late for fear, but I am not playing a waiting game on a bike. In front of a computer, looking at a chart, I am. I have time to think and fear the consequences if things go wrong. Any false move, and I can reconsider my actions and cut the trade, getting out too early but, the longer I stay in, the more my feelings need to be kept under control. The closer I get to my stop, which is further away than the rest and which may have already gone, the more edgy I become. The best is to shut the computer down for the day and say sod it but, if you do that, you will not re-enter, after being closed out. Then the whole thinking of the operation is for nothing.

Db said that he felt sorry for me for sensing fear! I don't feel sorry for myself, particularly. I've been trading for thirty odd years and know how to live with it. The story is that Nelson threw up every time he went into battle and they have put a monument up to him.

I tell you, I enjoy doing this for a few hours every day. It keeps the mind active but I, also, think that short term trading has a strong random element in it that is unpredictable, because news is unpredictable. News affects the markets, always.

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Old Mar 24, 2008, 2:20pm   #70
 
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Db said that he felt sorry for me for sensing fear!
Not exactly. I said "If you're still fearful after 40 years of trading, that's unfortunate". I might feel sorry for someone who's account was wiped out due to a clerical error, but that's not quite the same thing.
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Old Mar 24, 2008, 2:42pm   #71
 
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NT, how would you personally define the 'trading psychology' inherent within your method? Try not to answer my question with another question.
I wouldn't say that 'trading psychology' is inherent within my method, or in any method for that matter. Trading psychology, or the lack of it, is inherent in the individuals who aspire to become successful traders. The easy route, which is the one most often taken by aspirants, does not nurture the development of the correct mindset and skill required to trade successfully. Most people prefer to avoid the nasty and uncomfortable emotions associated with trading, most of them being the result of having to make a decision or dealing with a decision already made. I wonder if people take comfort in ‘mechanical’ systems because they transfer the responsibility of these decisions over to a piece of software...
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Old Mar 24, 2008, 2:46pm   #72
 
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Paul, you're asking some awfully good questions, but I can't give you any more points because of t2w's system. Anybody need 74 points? If so, post here:

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/t2w-...p-my-pips.html

Last edited by dbphoenix; Mar 24, 2008 at 3:16pm.
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Old Mar 24, 2008, 2:47pm   #73
 
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I wonder if people take comfort in ‘mechanical’ systems because they transfer the responsibility of these decisions over to a piece of software...
Sure. Just do a search for "doesn't work".
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Old Mar 24, 2008, 2:47pm   #74
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Not exactly. I said "If you're still fearful after 40 years of trading, that's unfortunate". I might feel sorry for someone who's account was wiped out due to a clerical error, but that's not quite the same thing.
Somehow, I knew that you would come back to me on that one!

Point taken, you said unfortunate. But I can live with it, otherwise I would not trade.

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Old Mar 24, 2008, 7:45pm   #75
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Paul, you're asking some awfully good questions, but I can't give you any more points because of t2w's system. Anybody need 74 points? If so, post here:

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/t2w-...p-my-pips.html

No probs. Thanks for the compliment.
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