Realistically, How much Money can I Expect to Make?

This is a discussion on Realistically, How much Money can I Expect to Make? within the New to Trade2Win forums, part of the Reception category; Originally Posted by Babyblush It would have been nice of you if you could state the answer for us here, ...

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Old Aug 7, 2013, 2:46pm   #61
Joined Feb 2012
Re: Realistically, How much Money can I Expect to Make?

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Originally Posted by Babyblush View Post
It would have been nice of you if you could state the answer for us here, anyways now that the link has been given will look into it to find out the answer.
He goes from saying "The majority of client trades are profitable" to "A minority of clients are profitable".

Does this mean that a small minority of profitable traders make the vast majority of overall trades? Or just that he's bull****ting a bit?
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Old Aug 8, 2013, 5:26pm   #62
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Re: Realistically, How much Money can I Expect to Make?

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Originally Posted by ryandj2222 View Post
He goes from saying "The majority of client trades are profitable" to "A minority of clients are profitable".

Does this mean that a small minority of profitable traders make the vast majority of overall trades? Or just that he's bull****ting a bit?
most traders loose money - doesnt matter what damn broker you look at

this game is hard and the brokers are desperate to keep people active ...........but if they are loosing money they will leave

A Brokerage house is not for the fainthearted and you need serious salesman promising riches to keep that client base topped up

N
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Old Aug 13, 2013, 11:12am   #63
 
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I tried my hand at trading CFD with online brokers that are springing up , my conclusion is people would be better off trading directly with exchanges , the spread which we loose to brokers is quite substantial. I think this forum is filled with majority who loose in trading and its not because of the skill ,its on account of the surmountable feat of costs.. Saving up to trade big lots rather than CFDs is the only way one can learn to trade. 1 Lot (big lot) risk appetite should be there otherwise its best to forget about trading. This has been my observation.

Another laughable thing i hear is "simulated trading" i mean trading live is THE only way i actually learned! Now in hindsight i feel i wasted 18 months in this bull****! If i had traded live straight away my learning curve would have grown exponentially , i am sure a lot of people will refute my comments.
Trading is not a business , trading is trading however teaching to trade is a business-- always remember that!

Last edited by timsk; Aug 13, 2013 at 1:53pm.
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Old Aug 23, 2013, 5:51pm   #64
Joined Aug 2013
You can make millions or lose everything (money and time)

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Originally Posted by T2W Bot View Post
SHORT ANSWER

Allegedly, 90% of all traders fail
This cliché is posted on the boards almost daily. It may or may not be true. Evidence to support this figure is mostly anecdotal, however, it’s certain that many who try their hand at trading quit with less money in their pockets than when they started. So, the balance of probabilities suggests that you would be wise to ‘expect’ to lose money rather than to make any. But hey, that’s a negative attitude and, besides, you’re not one of the 90% are you? No sir, let’s assume that you’re destined to join the elite 10% of profitable traders!

Now the good news
The positive spin on the ‘90% of all traders fail’ statistic is twofold:
1. Many of those that fail are ‘get rich quick’ punters who play at trading in the vein hope that they can turn £100 into a million in next to no time. If this describes you – here’s some great advice for you. . . If it’s money you can afford to lose and you want to have a laugh gambling, go to the races or take a trip to Las Vegas. It’ll be a whole lot more fun.
2. The good news is that the failure rate needs to be high in order to provide the mega profits for the 10% who succeed. In this respect, trading is a bit like the lottery. The jackpot is divided between those who have the winning numbers. The more winners there are, the smaller the cash prize that each winner receives. So, if you’re willing to put in the huge amounts of time and effort required to succeed – the upside is big. Huge. The sky’s the limit!

But . . . (there’s always a ‘but’!)
But here’s the rub. The secret to trading success is not to focus on reward, but on risk. You must minimise risk and keep your losses small. Coupled with this is the need to focus on trading really well, rather than the money you’ll make if you do. In this respect, good traders are like the best premiership footballers. First and foremost, footy stars have to focus on their training, fitness and how to excel on the field of play. The fame, money and beautiful WAGs come second.
There are LOTS of ways to make a lot of money, including but not only trading. The secret is that whatever you do, you MUST LOVE it. Eat it, drink it, sleep it, breathe it...Follow your passion. And don't do it for the money.
Get support, go rent a desk for $500 a month and work amongst successful traders, get trained and coached and helped. IF you like it, many don't, even the ones who get it sometimes decide it's not the way they want to live their life, and you get to be one of the 5% who win, the answer will depend on how much you start with and your ability to weather volatility and sleep at night.
If you start with $10,000, you'd be truly outstanding, top 1%, if you trebled it every year, so Year 1 $30,000, Year 2, $90,000 etc. The better route is to go to a prop place or successful trader / arcade who will back you. That way you get to trade much bigger size much faster, and keep 50-80% of the profits. Then you might make $1m within 3-4 years IF you were really good, focussed, supported and really loved the process, not just the money !
Decide WHY you want to do this, what you are prepared to give it in terms of hours per day and money.
Good luck.
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Old Sep 5, 2014, 11:33pm   #65
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100% of traders lose money. It's inevitable. I've never met a person and I'm sure there never has been a successful trader without a drawdown. However, I think there is a study showing 80% of people give up on trading before recouping their losses, thus saying 80% fail. To me, the key to success is expectation. I believe Tom Sosnoff explained it best. If Tiger Woods challenged you to a game of golf, you would have very little expectation of beating him. However, it's the opposite in trading. Every body thinks they can turn $10k into $10MM over a year even though professionals aren't even doing this. I've been sucked into unrealistic expectations. I'd hold stocks longer than I should wanting them to go higher when I'm really just sitting there letting a good winner turn into a loser. The first thing any trader should do is understand that no plan will be 100% successful, no plan will make you 1,000% returns, and losses are perfectly acceptable. I've seen guys come up with some strategy they found on YouTube, make a few bucks, then lose. They call the strategy stupid and move onto another, sometimes multiple different strategies a week. They aren't going to find a 100% success get rich setup in trading, and they won't be successful until they realize that. When I began, it always all about big trades. I needed to make $1,000 a day. I'm going to buy GOOG, TSLA, and all of these high cap stocks and get rich on $1-3/share scalps. I got burned out pretty quickly. Now I focus more on getting 10 successful trades in a row, even be it $10 profit. It builds my confidence and allows me to analyze the market more on my knowledge rather than emotion. My goals in trading has changed dramatically. I've begun to enjoy trading the more I begin to do it for win streaks and being consistent rather than the dollar amount I make from it.
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Old Sep 6, 2014, 9:21am   #66
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Quote:
Originally Posted by T2W Bot View Post
SHORT ANSWER

Allegedly, 90% of all traders fail
This cliché is posted on the boards almost daily. It may or may not be true. Evidence to support this figure is mostly anecdotal, however, it’s certain that many who try their hand at trading quit with less money in their pockets than when they started. So, the balance of probabilities suggests that you would be wise to ‘expect’ to lose money rather than to make any. But hey, that’s a negative attitude and, besides, you’re not one of the 90% are you? No sir, let’s assume that you’re destined to join the elite 10% of profitable traders!
interestingly what this demonstrates is "survivorship (or graveyard) bias" ............the ability for people to ignore all the relevant data pertaining to a situation

in truth we need to understand the definition of TRADER in this context

opening an Live account for $x
trading for 6 months live ?
trading for 1 year + live
the list is endless

compare this to becoming a 5 handicap golfer and the % of golfers that achieve this in their lifetime

if you use the criteria of people who join a golf club as beginners then what would you say the % is in truth ?

I think the cliché does need to be more quantified as personally the % for me of people who try trading and achieve consistent profitability eventually is very very low in % terms ..........and for pretty much the same reasons as those that never see a 5 handicap

N

Last edited by NVP; Sep 6, 2014 at 9:25am.
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Old Mar 25, 2015, 6:24am   #67
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Originally Posted by NVP View Post
interestingly what this demonstrates is "survivorship (or graveyard) bias" ............the ability for people to ignore all the relevant data pertaining to a situation

in truth we need to understand the definition of TRADER in this context

opening an Live account for $x
trading for 6 months live ?
trading for 1 year + live
the list is endless

compare this to becoming a 5 handicap golfer and the % of golfers that achieve this in their lifetime

if you use the criteria of people who join a golf club as beginners then what would you say the % is in truth ?

I think the cliché does need to be more quantified as personally the % for me of people who try trading and achieve consistent profitability eventually is very very low in % terms ..........and for pretty much the same reasons as those that never see a 5 handicap

N
The statistics are indeed open to interpretation. What exactly does 95% fail mean? Does a fail mean the trader lost money, broke even, made money then lost it, wiped out their account!

You will have those who fail spectacularly blowing their accounts, those who lose a little and give up, some who break even, there will be a few who make money and give up, some will consistently make a small profit and then you will get the few who do make good consistent profits.

I imagine 95% to not make money, 3% make a little money and 2% making consistent profits. That is only my view!
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Old Mar 25, 2015, 8:19am   #68
 
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So, "realisitically" the answer is £0 or even more realistically a loss.
That does not mean its not possible to make a profit, but your expectation is to be one of the 95%.
To be one of the 5% and CONSISTENTLY take money from the market requires years of diligent study and self development, which not many people are prepared to do.
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Old Jul 9, 2015, 9:20am   #69
Joined Aug 2013
for novice - 5% profit per month - great result
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Old May 3, 2016, 2:50pm   #70
Joined Jan 2011
I think lthiough we have certain fixed target daily based, but not always we can fulfilled our target, sometime loss also as one part that also need as consideration in trading, if only focus on profit and less attention with risk, one mistake can causing big loss I think
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Old May 6, 2016, 10:28am   #71
 
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Originally Posted by Mat_Corp View Post
for novice - 5% profit per month - great result
What matters is consistency, not the amount of profit, isn't it? At least that's what I always hear from experienced traders.
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Old May 6, 2016, 1:06pm   #72
Joined Feb 2016
It depends on the market i think. How much did you invest on the market. If you invest big amount of money and for low invest low income. So, it's much difficult to appreciate.
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Old May 9, 2016, 2:25pm   #73
Joined Jan 2011
Yes, sometime trend market support to making maximum profit, if trader get this best opportunity hence they can let profit run, but if likely the trend on sideways hence small profit target is better than larger target because often movement only on range timeframe
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Old May 10, 2016, 1:08pm   #74
 
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The 10% success rate seems quite encouraging to me

Yes, it may seem a low figure, at first sight but…think about it…

To stick with the example of dentists, which seems quite apt: imagine if people started to practice dentistry without any proper training: how many of them would make it through to become full time dentists? How many mishaps would be made along the way? How many people would be sued for malpractice and lose a lot of money?

I think that, if out of 100 self-starter dentists 10 managed to become well known and respected dentists that would be a great success.

To take the example a step further: what would happen if a dentist student focused only on the money that he / she would make after becoming qualified? They might have perspective incomes at the back of their minds but, first and foremost, he / she need to focus on learning how to make fillings, perform extractions, etc. etc.

Similarly, a would-be trader should focus on learning the trade, not on how much money they can make.

In conclusion, considering that to try and become a “retail trader” all you need is the willingness to try and an amount of capital that is within the scope of “normal savings”, I would say that 10% doesn’t sound that bad.
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Old May 10, 2016, 1:27pm   #75
 
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Originally Posted by Max_Antax View Post
Yes, it may seem a low figure, at first sight but…think about it…

To stick with the example of dentists, which seems quite apt: imagine if people started to practice dentistry without any proper training: how many of them would make it through to become full time dentists? How many mishaps would be made along the way? How many people would be sued for malpractice and lose a lot of money?

I think that, if out of 100 self-starter dentists 10 managed to become well known and respected dentists that would be a great success.

To take the example a step further: what would happen if a dentist student focused only on the money that he / she would make after becoming qualified? They might have perspective incomes at the back of their minds but, first and foremost, he / she need to focus on learning how to make fillings, perform extractions, etc. etc.

Similarly, a would-be trader should focus on learning the trade, not on how much money they can make.

In conclusion, considering that to try and become a “retail trader” all you need is the willingness to try and an amount of capital that is within the scope of “normal savings”, I would say that 10% doesn’t sound that bad.
You are absolutely correct, except for one detail. 10% of traders is a bigger absolute number than that of dentists. So an actual amount of successful traders is even more inspiring.
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