How can you start on oil at a prop firm???

I know i may sound like im trying to run before i can walk, but i like to go direct to what i want.

Im dont really like this idea of having to do the SII securities & derivavtives exam and then try to get a job in a prop firm trading whatever Secs n Dervivs are...,
when i have absolutely zero interest or enthusiasm in them whatsoever, but spending a year or 2 being trading specifically at them, just so i can get it on my CV and then try looking for a prop firm that will teach me and then let me trade oil instead!!


I do have an incredibly huge amount of interest and enthusiasm in oil though!!

Dont know why exactly but i just always have ever since i was 8years old.


And its when i was 8years old, lil kids, got my mum to invest all my future savings money in oil.

Took all the cash out last july with a £2500 profit!!


:cheesy::cheesy::cheesy:



But so how can i give myself the maximum chance of being able to start in a prop fim learning exactly how to and then trading oil???

Or is it just too risky for any prop firm to offer??

(I am 18, just finished my A-levels at college, non market related as i didnt even know the job of trader even existed till 4months ago!!
But have spent the last 4months reading and reseraching all about trading, practisng trading oil,aud/usd, and ftse mornings on real account to start then demo account now, while running my own online business earning av £250 per week, and while still being a fulltime college student!!)




And is there an exam i can do in commodities instead of securities and derivatives???

Because so far the best i can find is this exam from SII- Certificate in Securities & Financial Derivatives / Certificate in Securities & Financial Derivatives - Retail


That is multiple choice, and can be done within a few weeks of studying for it..,
But whats the commodities equivalent to it please??



Thanks

Pretty sure the Certificate in Securities and Financial Derivatives is for people on the sell side, so wouldn't be relevant to a prop trader.

I think most prop traders trading oil would trade the futures, and futures are derivatives.

the chances of you being allowed to trade crude at a prop trading company as a new starter are probably about the same as elvis coming back to life and doing a duet with john lennon

its just too volatile, it may look ok via a spread betting platform, but bring up crude, nat gas etc on TT and it will make your bumhole shrivel up to the size of a pinhole

as crude lover said you could put up your own cash, but in all honesty, if you were able to put up £25,000 ( and i doubt that would be enough) and started trading it without the experience a contract like this requires and deserves then i would expect your account to be done and dusted within the day !

i know this post sounds negative, but you can do a great deal of damge to your account with oil.

I think I read somewhere on this forum that STA are teaching new recruits calendar spreads on oil - that's probably not what you have in mind though.

fifty2aces said:

I think I read somewhere on this forum that STA are teaching new recruits calendar spreads on oil - that's probably not what you have in mind though.

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I heard they where taught the calenders where too volatile for them and to do the flys only....

black-star said:

I heard they where taught the calenders where too volatile for them and to do the flys only....

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Actually, I think you're right there - either way, it's probably not going to be outrights.

Are there any prop shops with an established trading record on ICE yet? I have experience trading the crack and am looking around. Does anyone go direct through clearers like Fortis?

you won't be trading oil, you'll be trading oil futures, which as somebody pointed out, is a derivative. the SII exams will give you a basic understanding of the market as a whole so i suggest you do them.

both marex and Futex trade oil derivatives and will train you if can meet their criteria.

Schneider Trading Associates (they are doing Oil Fly's) thats what I heard

toxictrading said:

the chances of you being allowed to trade crude at a prop trading company as a new starter are probably about the same as elvis coming back to life and doing a duet with john lennon

its just too volatile, it may look ok via a spread betting platform, but bring up crude, nat gas etc on TT and it will make your bumhole shrivel up to the size of a pinhole

as crude lover said you could put up your own cash, but in all honesty, if you were able to put up £25,000 ( and i doubt that would be enough) and started trading it without the experience a contract like this requires and deserves then i would expect your account to be done and dusted within the day !

i know this post sounds negative, but you can do a great deal of damge to your account with oil.

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I trade oil futures all day, every day. I work off 1 minute charts as they present a handful of great low risk high reward trades. Like any contract though its not the only way to trade as I guy I work with trades off the 60min chart and takes a huge number of points. My advice, don't be put off by the obvious volatility.

Hi Gooseman, btw Elvis died.

Hi Police, Thanks for the advice.

I actually found a potential trading house, but am looking for a comparison so I don't get Hobson's choice. I am looking for a company with risk managers who are experienced with ICE, and which has reliable IT. Any help appreciated. General rant and results of my search to date follow:

Marex- told me in early 2007 they have no interest in my spread trading ICE futures
Futex- based in East Sussex, I need a London office
TCA- no interest in me on ICE

I spread traded Eurex profitably over 4 years, but when profits were declining, a visit to Orc software revealed the potential of the "algo" traders. At the time, Orc required massive fees beyond the reach of any independent trader other than the great Rotter.

I decided to get a job in an investment bank, but in the interim I had the joy of trying out ICE at Curvalue, and made money in the crack.

I am surprised by the quantity of places out there still having a crack at spreading Eurex. Its like King Canute futures, or with reference to Wikipedia, Cnut futures for short.
Canute the Great - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

bigballs said:

Hi Gooseman, btw Elvis died.

Hi
Marex- told me in early 2007 they have no interest in my spread trading ICE futures
Futex- based in East Sussex, I need a London office[/url]

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Futex have offices in London and Woking ( I was not aware they have one in Sussex too)

Hi Police

thanks, I will look into Futex then as they apparently have been around since late 90's

Police,

Perhaps they don't want to tell you.

Grant.