Trading with no rules

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Old Mar 16, 2010, 4:28pm   #1
Joined Sep 2009
Trading with no rules

I do not use any form of signals or any technical analysis for my trading, nor do I understand a lot of it. I simply stare at the prices all day and buy or sell when I get the urge. I trade full time and am in my fifth year of profit ( I make my living from trading). I only mention this so that other traders take this seriously (after they stop laughing !). The only area where I have rules is risk control. The reason I am posting this is I admit to feeling massive stress/fear trading this way when everything you read suggests I need to do more. I also acknowedge I am not trading long enough to be sure this will continue to work. I had no experience before I started trading. Anyone else trade in this way ?

Comments most welcome.
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Old Mar 16, 2010, 4:35pm   #2
Joined Dec 2008
Re: Trading with no rules

Risk control is probably the most important rule of all.

As for trading "rules", systems etc, well most systems (in my opinion) are no better (not as good in fact) as flipping a coin, or buying when the dog farts and selling when he falls asleep.
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Old Mar 16, 2010, 4:44pm   #3
Joined Dec 2007
Re: Trading with no rules

I think what you'll find (if you ever analysed your entries) that the 'urge' that you feel to enter a trade is simply a recurring pattern, likely to take you into profit, that maybe even you don't realise but is deep in your subconcious somewhere. So infact, you are actually trading with a type of subconcious system, just one that isn't written down and closely adhered to.

I trade with with very structured and well defined patterns. On very odd occasions I go into a trade 'on a hunch'. (I don't like to do it as it means I don't stick to my plan). I'd say more often than not, these hunches take me into a profitable trade.

Maybe it's luck, but I put it down to 1000s of hours of screen time that means some patterns are just embedded in my subconcious but I don't realise it conciously.

So your way of trading, combined with strict risk control is enough to give you an edge.

Just a thought ... and now I'm waiting for an experienced trader to tell me I'm talking b*****ks !!
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Old Mar 16, 2010, 5:01pm   #4
Joined Jun 2008
Re: Trading with no rules

Just a thought ... and now I'm waiting for an experienced trader to tell me I'm talking b*****ks !!

no you`re not---I`ve been trading for donkeys and do likewise. I select a few stocks/pairs and watch and watch more..As long as risk control is in place which is THE most important aspect of trading IMO. I do use TA but only as a backup to what I had planned to do anyway.
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Old Mar 16, 2010, 5:27pm   #5
 
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Re: Trading with no rules

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1984 View Post
I do not use any form of signals or any technical analysis for my trading, nor do I understand a lot of it. I simply stare at the prices all day and buy or sell when I get the urge. I trade full time and am in my fifth year of profit ( I make my living from trading). I only mention this so that other traders take this seriously (after they stop laughing !). The only area where I have rules is risk control. The reason I am posting this is I admit to feeling massive stress/fear trading this way when everything you read suggests I need to do more. I also acknowedge I am not trading long enough to be sure this will continue to work. I had no experience before I started trading. Anyone else trade in this way ?

Comments most welcome.
Hi,

I've been trading myself for around three years. I've blown a few accounts blah blah, I'll spare you the details. Basically it's come to a point where I've decided to test myself, over the course of a month I'm flipping a coin and using that as an entry signal based on the outcome. In addition to this I'm using the 3 Ducks method for discretionary trading and technical analysis to make my trades the way I would do normally on a seperate account to compare the two.

I've got the same Money Management plan and Risk Reward ratio in place for both. Needless to say, although it's only day 2 I am a whopping +130 pips ahead in the coin toss vs discretionary.

I am seriously.... and other traders may laugh at me here (especially after only day two) considering developing a strategy based on the flip of a coin.

I am beginning to think that all you need is a good Money Management plan and Risk Reward ratio to make money, and knowing when to call it quits for the week.



I'd like to know what RR and MM plan you use, also what lot size??
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Old Mar 16, 2010, 5:52pm   #6
Joined Nov 2008
Re: Trading with no rules

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Originally Posted by maiden22 View Post
Risk control is probably the most important rule of all.

As for trading "rules", systems etc, well most systems (in my opinion) are no better (not as good in fact) as flipping a coin, or buying when the dog farts and selling when he falls asleep.
sshhh...you tried reversing that?
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Old Mar 16, 2010, 7:47pm   #7
Joined Dec 2008
Re: Trading with no rules

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Originally Posted by black swan View Post
sshhh...you tried reversing that?
lol
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Old Mar 17, 2010, 9:41am   #8
 
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Re: Trading with no rules

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Originally Posted by 1984 View Post
Anyone else trade in this way ?
Pretty much, yeah. Your subconscious is better than your conscious at so many things anyway, that once you can get it in tune with a market makes decisions easier.

Most useful, in my view, is a very occasional uneasy feeling, in which case I get out
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Old Mar 17, 2010, 10:04am   #9
 
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Re: Trading with no rules

maybe we should call this the jedi school of trading
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Old Mar 17, 2010, 10:18am   #10
 
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Re: Trading with no rules

Quote:
Originally Posted by 1984 View Post
I do not use any form of signals or any technical analysis for my trading, nor do I understand a lot of it. I simply stare at the prices all day and buy or sell when I get the urge. I trade full time and am in my fifth year of profit ( I make my living from trading). I only mention this so that other traders take this seriously (after they stop laughing !). The only area where I have rules is risk control. The reason I am posting this is I admit to feeling massive stress/fear trading this way when everything you read suggests I need to do more. I also acknowedge I am not trading long enough to be sure this will continue to work. I had no experience before I started trading. Anyone else trade in this way ?

Comments most welcome.
If what you say is true, then you should make this your last post and last visit to this forum.

You are more experienced and more succesful than 99.99% of the members of this site.

With this in mind, the most you can hope for is that they don't bring your profits down too much.
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Old Mar 17, 2010, 11:01am   #11
Joined Nov 2001
Re: Trading with no rules

A rule is only there to help you make up your mind, anyway. I firmly believe that most of the investigating types on this site like that more than they do trading. Some explanatory threads are so longwinded that I go to sleep long before the dog does.
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Old Mar 17, 2010, 3:57pm   #12
 
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Re: Trading with no rules

I bielieve that you can trade with feeling, and if you done it long enough, you start send us signals before getting an heart attack. On the other it is nice to have a plan with constructive srategy and stick with it. Like that you will have a free stress trade.
You have many places where you can learn mentored by a trader, you should try tradetheeasyway.com

I mean the most important is the pips at the end of the day.

Happy piping
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Old Mar 17, 2010, 9:37pm   #13
Joined Nov 2001
Re: Trading with no rules

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Originally Posted by papapips View Post
I bielieve that you can trade with feeling, and if you done it long enough, you start send us signals before getting an heart attack. On the other it is nice to have a plan with constructive srategy and stick with it. Like that you will have a free stress trade.
You have many places where you can learn mentored by a trader, you should try tradetheeasyway.com

I mean the most important is the pips at the end of the day.

Happy piping
I have stress free trading because I use reasonably close stops and I don't really care.

Not using rules is a whole new ball game. The only one I have is to try to trade a trending market.

You can use all the rules that you like but the experts tell you to not forget the stop. If that is the case, they can't be all that certain

I think I enter where my common sense dictates. That's good enough for me.
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Old Mar 17, 2010, 11:18pm   #14
Joined Feb 2009
Re: Trading with no rules

1984,..
There's a study out that states, the mind takes in 14 million pieces of information per second, but consciously only 40 pieces.
The point being,.don't knock the hunch, it's far more reliable than flipping a coin! : )
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Old Mar 18, 2010, 1:32pm   #15
Joined Sep 2009
Re: Trading with no rules

1984 started this thread Thanks to everyone for replies to date. I was expecting a bit of a battering!

As I said I have misgivings myself about trading this way but believe I must keep doing it until the market proves it does not work. I should point out that when I started trading I placed a number of, what I now realise to be incredibly risky, bets. I was lucky and these bets came right. This gave me a cushion which allowed me to cover the numerous subsequent mistakes. While my trading is very loose I am hugely aware of risk and become more so every day.

By the way I use the word bet advisedly.
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