Overdoing it

This is a discussion on Overdoing it within the General Trading Chat forums, part of the Reception category; When I read some of the threads on here I find myself going back to Arb's pit stories thead for ...

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Old Apr 5, 2008, 8:58pm   #1
 
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Exclamation Overdoing it

When I read some of the threads on here I find myself going back to Arb's pit stories thead for a dose of realism... http://www.trade2win.com/boards/trad...es-thread.html

Whether those mentioned in those stories were profitable or not thats who moved the markets. They are also no different to those trading and moving the markets these days I imagine.

I really cannot fathom any of those guys sitting at home at night reading books on NLP, or worrying about pyschology 24/7 nor thinking about where the moon is!

Is it because the internet gives us time and an escape to waffle about bizarre theories and things that don't matter filling our heads with un-needed crap?!

Trader_Dante made a great post the other day about what all the guys at his office do to make large amounts of money... study price and buyers and sellers and market participants.

So why is there so much discussion about something that is essentially so simple. Buyers vs Sellers, bugger all else to it!

IMO, next time you think of elobarate and time wasting theories, take a read of that thread and see who you are competing against!

Keep it simple and trade the participants....
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Old Apr 5, 2008, 10:38pm   #2
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wasp View Post
When I read some of the threads on here I find myself going back to Arb's pit stories thead for a dose of realism... http://www.trade2win.com/boards/trad...es-thread.html

Whether those mentioned in those stories were profitable or not thats who moved the markets. They are also no different to those trading and moving the markets these days I imagine.

I really cannot fathom any of those guys sitting at home at night reading books on NLP, or worrying about pyschology 24/7 nor thinking about where the moon is!

Is it because the internet gives us time and an escape to waffle about bizarre theories and things that don't matter filling our heads with un-needed crap?!

Trader_Dante made a great post the other day about what all the guys at his office do to make large amounts of money... study price and buyers and sellers and market participants.

So why is there so much discussion about something that is essentially so simple. Buyers vs Sellers, bugger all else to it!

IMO, next time you think of elobarate and time wasting theories, take a read of that thread and see who you are competing against!

Keep it simple and trade the participants....
Can't really argue with that. But human nature being what it is ........................ take football: quite simple actually - get the ball in the net = score a goal. All you need is more times than the other side. So why do we have hours and hours of discussion on TV / radio / workplace?

It's got to be something to do with entertainment value and the quest for the holy grail. We all know in trading that if you can find the end of the rainbow and dig up the pot of gold, then you're home & dry. Simple.

Those who can, do............most of the time !
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Last edited by 0007; Apr 5, 2008 at 10:56pm.
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Old Apr 6, 2008, 11:04am   #3
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[QUOTE=wasp;415544]... study price and buyers and sellers and market participants...



...And at what price they want to do business...

Sorry, forgot to mention, the participants do like to play games at times, be careful.

Last edited by Paul71; Apr 6, 2008 at 11:13am.
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Old Apr 6, 2008, 11:57am   #4
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wasp View Post
When I read some of the threads on here I find myself going back to Arb's pit stories thead for a dose of realism... http://www.trade2win.com/boards/trad...es-thread.html

Whether those mentioned in those stories were profitable or not thats who moved the markets. They are also no different to those trading and moving the markets these days I imagine.

I really cannot fathom any of those guys sitting at home at night reading books on NLP, or worrying about pyschology 24/7 nor thinking about where the moon is!

Is it because the internet gives us time and an escape to waffle about bizarre theories and things that don't matter filling our heads with un-needed crap?!

Trader_Dante made a great post the other day about what all the guys at his office do to make large amounts of money... study price and buyers and sellers and market participants.

So why is there so much discussion about something that is essentially so simple. Buyers vs Sellers, bugger all else to it!

IMO, next time you think of elobarate and time wasting theories, take a read of that thread and see who you are competing against!

Keep it simple and trade the participants....
The pursuit of knowledge wasp I think is what drives people to question the essence/nature of what it is they are observing .

Speculate from the latin speculari meaning to observe.

If one can or manage time to position oneself to engage in speculation (observation) then one can learn about his opponent, competitor, enemy, the market money pushers.

Dont know if you have read The art of war, or whether you would rank it as time wasting theory, but worth a read if one wants to study and plan for the War of profits.I dont think human nature has change since Sun Tzu's time.. The 6 th Century B.C.


Thus we may know that there are five essentials for victory:

He will win who knows when to fight and when not to fight.
He will win who knows how to handle both superior and inferior forces.
He will win whose army is animated by the same spirit throughout all ranks.
He will win who, prepared himself, waits to take the enemy unprepared.
He will win who has military capacity and is not interfered with by the sovereign.
Victory lies in the knowledge of those five points. Hence the saying: If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles.
~Sun Tzu


This is me on the way to the office ready for a spot of GBPJPY trading whilst whistling Ryuichi Sakamoto's, Merry Christmas Mr Lawrence.

Click the image to open in full size.
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Last edited by Crap Buddist; Apr 6, 2008 at 11:59am. Reason: time
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Old Apr 6, 2008, 12:08pm   #5
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Originally Posted by Crap Buddist View Post
The pursuit of knowledge wasp I think is what drives people to question the essence/nature of what it is they are observing .

Speculate from the latin speculari meaning to observe.

If one can or manage time to position oneself to engage in speculation (observation) then one can learn about his opponent, competitor, enemy, the market money pushers.

Dont know if you have read The art of war, or whether you would rank it as time wasting theory, but worth a read if one wants to study and plan for the War of profits.I dont think human nature has change since Sun Tzu's time.. The 6 th Century B.C.


Thus we may know that there are five essentials for victory:

He will win who knows when to fight and when not to fight.
He will win who knows how to handle both superior and inferior forces.
He will win whose army is animated by the same spirit throughout all ranks.
He will win who, prepared himself, waits to take the enemy unprepared.
He will win who has military capacity and is not interfered with by the sovereign.
Victory lies in the knowledge of those five points. Hence the saying: If you know the enemy and know yourself, you need not fear the result of a hundred battles.
~Sun Tzu


This is me on the way to the office ready for a spot of GBPJPY trading whilst whistling Ryuichi Sakamoto's, Merry Christmas Mr Lawrence.

Click the image to open in full size.



I didn't know you were an imperial stormtrooper?
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Old Apr 6, 2008, 1:41pm   #6
 
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Can't really argue with that. But human nature being what it is ........................ take football: quite simple actually - get the ball in the net = score a goal. All you need is more times than the other side. So why do we have hours and hours of discussion on TV / radio / workplace?
Exactly, and when was the last time we won a world cup?! For all our talking and analysis, we actually get worse!
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Old Apr 6, 2008, 1:44pm   #7
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Exactly, and when was the last time we won a world cup?! For all our talking and analysis, we actually get worse!



Excellent!
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Old Apr 6, 2008, 1:54pm   #8
 
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Talking Re: Overdoing it

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Exactly, and when was the last time we won a world cup?! For all our talking and analysis, we actually get worse!
Maybe our competitors got better.
Maybe the the game of football is won or lost in the head, before the ball is icked.
Maybe the competition went from kicking the ball to being the ball.
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Old Apr 6, 2008, 2:09pm   #9
 
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Maybe our competitors got better.
Maybe the the game of football is won or lost in the head, before the ball is icked.
Maybe the competition went from kicking the ball to being the ball.
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Old Apr 7, 2008, 10:53am   #10
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I'm pretty sure you're right that everyday traders don't spend too much time considering personal psychology etc, they shouldn't do if they are any good, BUT if the implication is that personal psychology is not important I'd say you are so far off base that the base is not even in sight and that is because of your viewpoint.
I might be wrong about that and if so I'd apologise ,but at this point I don't think I am.

Clocking in and out of a place of work everyday where you are shuffling relatively small amounts of personal capital ,or indeed trading large amounts of other people's capital is absolutely nothing like trying to consistently manage your entire personal net worth and of course as you get older what that means to you also changes. When you're younger, taking chances to me anyway, was a completely different fish from what it is now.

When I say personal psychology is important it doesn't mean you spend your life navel gazing . It does mean that you never lose sight or awareness of what you are doing and why you are doing it. If I had a pound for every guy I have met who didn't do that and lived to rue it I'd be even more comfortable than I am....don't think the point is valid ? please email Victor Niederhoffer or get a medium to have a chat with Livermore...they're just two extreme examples of the many less exagerated cases that are there to be found everyday of the year. Let's not even talk about them as individuals ,let's call then Hedgies with very 'smart' people at the helm...well if they are that smart why are so many so flucked ? ...if putting on weight is just the small indisciplines that people take everyday then losing your shirt pushing that bit too hard is no different.

Market psychology of course is only personal psychology collectivised and I doubt many good traders are not looking at that everyday ? I know I do ,it's part of the game trying to read the price action to second guess where the stops and limit orders are as we of course cannot see them without the order book....if we werre not doing this then of course we would not spend so much time looking for action at points of support and resistance...this is psychology ,but perhaps we don't always realise it ?
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