Something wrong...

kimo'sabby · Jun 6, 2011, 6:01am

Quote:

Originally Posted by donaldduke

And this is supposed to be traders forum?

Speculative trading is like no other business, except one..

As a trader you are supposed to be 'The Casino'.

The Casino owns the roulette table and it is trivial to show the
black or double black provides the casino with a mathematical edge and
so the casino is definitely not gambling. Even though the outcome of a single
spin of the roulette wheel is uncertain for the casino (i.e. even the casino is gambling based on the strict dictionary definition quoted in a previous post) the long term outcome, over hundreds of spins, becomes less and less uncertain.

Now as a trader you are supposed to have an edge that exploits supply and demand imbalances in the market.
While you can never 'prove' in a mathematical sense that you have an edge you might be able to back test it (either with a computer or by paper trading).

And if your real forward trading profits matches your back tested expectancy then i would accept that during your profitable forward trading (this has to be over hundreds or thousands of trades) then you *were* 'The Casino'.

You could of just of been lucky, but over hundreds of trades this is very unlikely and even more so given the transaction costs and slippage you incur as a trader.

You would also need to show your edge isn't about dodging big bullets (eg selling potentially explosive Options), that you were making lots of small trades.

Of course there is no guarantee your edge will continue,
and if it permanently breaks down and you continue to trade long after that point,
you are no longer the casino and you now just another gambler.
But even casinos will stop using roulette tables that might have developed a negative bias in them.

Basically if you have been long term profitable (over 100s or 1000s of small risk trades) you were not gambling. You might become a gambler in the future, but you can either stop or you can find another better strategy. And if you continue to be profitable you can continue to claim that you haven't been gambling.

And if you are profitable for long enough other people might actually accept you are not a gambling.

Is a professional gambler a gambler, or not?

TheBramble · Jun 6, 2011, 6:48am

Quote:

Originally Posted by donaldduke

And this is supposed to be traders forum?

Ha ha ha ha….you kidder you….

Quote:

Originally Posted by donaldduke

The Casino owns the roulette table and it is trivial to show the
black or double black provides the casino with a mathematical edge and
so the casino is definitely not gambling.

That would be an edge for sure. Most of the tables I’ve seen have the zero (and double zero) as a green. I’m guessing being colour blind doesn’t detract from the enjoyment. “Put it all on the purple”.

Quote:

Originally Posted by donaldduke

Now as a trader you are supposed to have an edge that exploits supply and demand imbalances in the market.

Rather narrow definition of an edge, but OK, one potential area where opportunity can be assessed and acted upon.

Quote:

Originally Posted by donaldduke

You would also need to show your edge isn't about dodging big bullets (eg selling potentially explosive Options), that you were making lots of small trades.

Of course there is no guarantee your edge will continue,
and if it permanently breaks down and you continue to trade long after that point,
you are no longer the casino and you now just another gambler.
But even casinos will stop using roulette tables that might have developed a negative bias in them.

Basically if you have been long term profitable (over 100s or 1000s of small risk trades) you were not gambling. You might become a gambler in the future, but you can either stop or you can find another better strategy. And if you continue to be profitable you can continue to claim that you haven't been gambling.

And if you are profitable for long enough other people might actually accept you are not a gambling.

DD, you of all people surprise me in that you seem to have got hung up on the quite pointless (IMHO) chase for a definition of gambler and trader.

The trader that loses his/her edge isn’t any more of a gambler than they were with an edge.

The punter (for what of a better term) who doesn’t trade the markets but does bet on sporting events having an edge of intelligent assessment of form, a network of contacts providing inside information and an understanding of basic probability, human nature and what’s “going on currently” in their sector of the industry, is no less a gambler on a winning streak than a losing one.

A consistently successful and intelligent gambler is no different in terms of what they do to a consistently successful and intelligent trader. They’re both working with the action to get a positive result base don what they know and how they use what they know.

DashRiprock · Jun 6, 2011, 6:50am

DashRiprock is a:

gambler
punter
cuntflapper
trader

delete as appropriate

TheBramble · Jun 6, 2011, 7:03am

I've taken out the last one.

forker · Jun 6, 2011, 8:23am

DashRiprock is a cuntflapper that gambles like a punter but calls himself a trader

BeginnerJoe · Jun 6, 2011, 8:27am

Can you add cuntflapper to the financial terms thread ? I am new to these advanced trading terms.

forker · Jun 6, 2011, 8:30am

Quote:

Originally Posted by BeginnerJoe

Can you add cuntflapper to the financial terms thread ? I am new to these advanced trading terms.

better check if DashRiprock hasn't trademarked it first

Jun 6, 2011, 6:50am	#51
DashRiprock Banned Member Since Jan 2011 1,669 Posts	Re: Something wrong... DashRiprock is a: gambler punter cuntflapper trader delete as appropriate

Jun 6, 2011, 7:03am	#52
TheBramble Banned Member Since Jul 2003 8,426 Posts	Re: Something wrong... I've taken out the last one.

Jun 6, 2011, 8:23am	#53
forker Legendary Member Member Since Jul 2008 1,225 Posts	Re: Something wrong... DashRiprock is a cuntflapper that gambles like a punter but calls himself a trader

Jun 6, 2011, 8:27am	#54
BeginnerJoe Legendary Member Member Since Jun 2011 3,320 Posts	Re: Something wrong... Can you add cuntflapper to the financial terms thread ? I am new to these advanced trading terms.

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