Full time trading does it really pay

This is a discussion on Full time trading does it really pay within the General Trading Chat forums, part of the Reception category; Originally Posted by fayalac You main problem is that you sell when you "think" it will go down, the rigth ...

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Old Jan 16, 2011, 9:38am   #64
 
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Re: Full time trading does it really pay

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Originally Posted by fayalac View Post
You main problem is that you sell when you "think" it will go down, the rigth question must be what makes you think it will go down when it goes up and viceversa, maybe you are not using the rigth indicators or maybe you are not interpretting your indicators information at the rigth way.
By the other hand, these is a market, some will win, some will lose.
I agree. You should be using the 'UP' indicator (green one) when you are thinking of going long and use the 'DOWN' indicator (red one) when you think you should be going short. You can't lose!

kin ell, its not rocket science, bless
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Old Jan 16, 2011, 9:45am   #65
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Re: Full time trading does it really pay

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Originally Posted by brettus View Post
The market has suited your strategy recently aswell.
Your last sentence attracted my attention. Going with the market is the most important part of it. If you can't do that then OP's title question answers itself.

I know that I would not be able to do it. It could be because I am elderly but, nevertheless, a few hours are enough for me. Sometimes, when I have a good morning and I am free all day, I carry on into the afternoon but it ends with, at best, leaving a stop and switching off. I do not do that often.

So, actually, The question is not only if it pays, but if you can do it every day'
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Old Jan 16, 2011, 10:36am   #66
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Re: Full time trading does it really pay

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Originally Posted by brettus View Post
It's decent, but in reality you won't make £100 a day(not you). Some days you will, but not everyday. Just realistically it's not possible for 99% of traders. You can't always be right. Also the psychological pressure, due to the fact that you have to make money. In theory it sounds easy.
Another T2W group think myth rears its head. 100 quid a day trading FX from a 20K account is poor. I stress "on average" yet you home in on the 100 quid everyday each day which is not what I stated..

Still at least it's a departure from; "But that'd be 10%+ per month, if you compounded it you'd be as rich as Soros inside 5 years, even the top hedge funds can't do/don't do 10% returns per month!!..." Another version of Godwin's Law..

I'm beginning to slowly reach the conclusion Dionysus Toast reached some time back, hardly anyone on this thread or this site trades and those that do have such bad circuitry and issues they'll never make it.

You quote 99% of traders could never make a living off 20K, actually 99% of successful traders I know could, however my definition of a successful retail trader is very different from most and I only know a handful personally, none met through T2W btw..

Let's finish this with a question, what kind of capitalisation do you *think* is necessary to trade FX in order to draw down an above average salary each month? How much do you think you need in order to draw down 1K per week? Oh and btw, if you only risk 2% per trade (max) what would you suggest donig with the other 98% whilst it *sits there*?

Last edited by Black Swan; Jan 16, 2011 at 10:43am.
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Old Jan 16, 2011, 11:00am   #67
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Re: Full time trading does it really pay

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Originally Posted by Splitlink View Post
Your last sentence attracted my attention. Going with the market is the most important part of it. If you can't do that then OP's title question answers itself.

I know that I would not be able to do it. It could be because I am elderly but, nevertheless, a few hours are enough for me. Sometimes, when I have a good morning and I am free all day, I carry on into the afternoon but it ends with, at best, leaving a stop and switching off. I do not do that often.

So, actually, The question is not only if it pays, but if you can do it every day'
Hi Split good post, two issues your post highlighted for me and these points are not subjective to you, but mainly answer the OP's original question; unless you absolutely have to make trading work for you (as a full time job) you'll never make a success at it, you need the desire/the need for the money to make it work.

The myth, that's been successfully peddled for years, of seamlessly moving from profitable part time trading, to full time, having acquired 50-100K along the way to give you the nec. capital and confidence to then trade is never going to happen. Thats not to say part time (difficult to define) can't make regular money, they can and do, but as I've always maintained if you're making circa 20K part time and keeping down a job then simply carry on carrying on...

Secondly part of making it work and being able to take wages out of the market relies on discipline, being there or finding a mechanism to make yourself available to take the opportunities to trade (as and when they happen) is crucial. Yes we're all going to miss opps. when we're asleep but otherwise you have to either have set hours, in day trading, or adapt your trading to the lifestyle choice you have to make if swinging and or position trading.
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Old Jan 16, 2011, 11:33am   #68
 
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Re: Full time trading does it really pay

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Originally Posted by HowardCohodas View Post
That's 6.1% for the life of the trade which ranges from a couple of days up to 60 days. Otherwise it is not possible to have my account increase from 7% to 15% per month.

You have given me an idea of another statistic to provide in my report. Average lifetime of a spread. Thanks.
Average life of a spread: 17 calendar days. However, that mixes weeklies and monthlies. Another time I will separate the two.
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Old Jan 16, 2011, 11:45am   #69
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Re: Full time trading does it really pay

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Originally Posted by HowardCohodas View Post
6.1% of capital at risk.
So tell me Howie, if someone were to risk say 2% of their account per trade (2% being the capital at risk), the average winner produces a whopping 0.122%? Is that right?

Somebody who risked 10% of their account would get average wins of 0.61% and so on?
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Old Jan 16, 2011, 12:42pm   #70
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Re: Full time trading does it really pay

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Originally Posted by Black Swan View Post
Another T2W group think myth rears its head. 100 quid a day trading FX from a 20K account is poor. I stress "on average" yet you home in on the 100 quid everyday each day which is not what I stated..

Still at least it's a departure from; "But that'd be 10%+ per month, if you compounded it you'd be as rich as Soros inside 5 years, even the top hedge funds can't do/don't do 10% returns per month!!..." Another version of Godwin's Law..

I'm beginning to slowly reach the conclusion Dionysus Toast reached some time back, hardly anyone on this thread or this site trades and those that do have such bad circuitry and issues they'll never make it.

You quote 99% of traders could never make a living off 20K, actually 99% of successful traders I know could, however my definition of a successful retail trader is very different from most and I only know a handful personally, none met through T2W btw..

Let's finish this with a question, what kind of capitalisation do you *think* is necessary to trade FX in order to draw down an above average salary each month? How much do you think you need in order to draw down 1K per week? Oh and btw, if you only risk 2% per trade (max) what would you suggest donig with the other 98% whilst it *sits there*?
Point. 10 ticks a trade on average it can be done swing trading. I still think realistically thats pushing it, but it would make you 25k a year off 20k. Trading intraday is the same thing just more trades and lower average tick gain. I think you should be aiming for a drawdown less than 20% and i don't think this is possible off 20k.

Going by own experience, i have reached a leverage i'm comfortable with that will only allow me to make between 50%-75% of my account value a year. I earn a salary from trading also, but not from proprietary trading, more like risk management.
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