Diff platforms - Diff Ticks ??

tomkit66 · Aug 16, 2005

Hi all,

I am currently testing VT Trader which gets it data from CMS and MetaTrader 4 where the data comes from FXDD I think on demo accounts.

Please look at the attached charts.

While MT4 ticks a few times each sec, VT Trader always stalls and jumps a few pips at once a little bit later.

Also the CCI looks completely different. I doublechecked the settings which are similar.

Anyone with same experiences?

Thanks
Tom

Trdr · Aug 16, 2005

There's no exchange thru which all forex trades are cleared.
Online fx brokers are market makers and take the other side of your trade, and also control in various ways the quotes seen and traded via their order entry/charting program, resulting in differences in price data and price bar formation from broker to broker.
eSignal collects price data from 200 'contributors': http://www.esignal.com/international/forex/default.asp
Bottom line is the quotes that count are those you trade — your broker's quotes.

Anonymous · Aug 17, 2005

Personally I feel CMS platform isn't user-friendly. Too complicated. Many features are simply not used in real life trading.

tomkit66 · Aug 17, 2005

Trdr said:
Bottom line is the quotes that count are those you trade — your broker's quotes.

Thanks for the good explanations ! :idea:

I started trading with the SP Emini ... so you know why I asked ...

Thanks & good trading
Tom

tomkit66 · Aug 17, 2005

Anonymous said:
Personally I feel CMS platform isn't user-friendly. Too complicated. Many features are simply not used in real life trading.

Well, I do like VT Trader too, but you are right - some things aren´t user friendly, especially those seperated windows using a multimonitor setup.

What charting platform do you prefer?

Thanks & good trading
Tom

Anonymous · Aug 17, 2005

always stalls and jumps a few pips at once a little bit later.

I was thinking that is what I think it is so I tried the demo on the CMS, but I don't see any difference for hours.

I don't trade by chart. Some basic charts like Netdania and Futuresource are sufficient for me. For FX medium to longer term plays I just look at the multi points and put an X mark the spot. For arb I try to find what other platforms may have different quotes from what I use.

tomkit66 · Aug 17, 2005

Anonymous said:
For FX medium to longer term plays I just look at the multi points and put an X mark the spot. For arb I try to find what other platforms may have different quotes from what I use.

Could you explain what´s medium and long term is for you? I didn´t watch Forex long enough to make my mind up but it seems that there are always nice trends on the daily chart. I wonder how deep the pockets must be to trade those trends? I think many people come to Forex because of the free quotes and charts and none commissions. But if you see the spreadsand knowing that many brokers cook their own soup ....

Anonymous · Aug 18, 2005

An intraday for me is: after entry, within an hour should decide whether I win or lose.

For forex by one platform alone, I don't see sufficient certainty intraday to enter too often (other people may not think so), so I aim for those multi-months or multi-years high/low as entry targets. If entry point filled and is right, I shift the stop, but I have a bad habit of taking the profit too soon instead of shifting (last month because of taking a 10-15 pip profit too soon I lost out on a 200 pips if I had simply shifted the stop).

Risking about 1-2% of capital per trade should be enough for trading trends. If risk 2% a time a trader has about 50 tries before capital is finished (which makes it more likely to win long term than risking say 10% per trade).

SvenFoster · Aug 18, 2005

tomkit66 said:
Could you explain what´s medium and long term is for you? I didn´t watch Forex long enough to make my mind up but it seems that there are always nice trends on the daily chart. I wonder how deep the pockets must be to trade those trends? I think many people come to Forex because of the free quotes and charts and none commissions. But if you see the spreadsand knowing that many brokers cook their own soup ....

If you get a broker that allows flexible trading lots or at least mini lots then you can pretty much scale the risk to a comfortable level. Of course the rewards will be scaled too.
A lot of FX traders seem to use longer timeframes weeks,days,4hr,1hr and they do appear to be less noisy.

Also brokers ability to cook will be significantly reduced over a period of hours/days rather than minutes and obviously spread will have less of an impact.

...maybe i should take some of my own advice.

tomkit66 · Aug 18, 2005

Risking about 1-2% of capital per trade should be enough for trading trends. If risk 2% a time a trader has about 50 tries before capital is finished (which makes it more likely to win long term than risking say 10% per trade).[/QUOTE said:
Okay, I understand the 1-2% of capital per trade but what´s about the trading range in the given period. Doesn´t this effect your Stops as well?

tomkit66 · Aug 18, 2005

SvenFoster said:
If you get a broker that allows flexible trading lots or at least mini lots then you can pretty much scale the risk to a comfortable level. Of course the rewards will be scaled too.
A lot of FX traders seem to use longer timeframes weeks,days,4hr,1hr and they do appear to be less noisy.

Also brokers ability to cook will be significantly reduced over a period of hours/days rather than minutes and obviously spread will have less of an impact.

...maybe i should take some of my own advice.

Hi,

Since there is no Forex exchange in the terms like futures have it I thought about how brokers could "cook" their own soup

I always daytraded but watching the Forex I really have to think about dailies or 4 hour charts.

Following my own advise was/is always the hardest part

May I ask what kind of charting platform you use and what brokerage service? Right now I am on a Demo with PFG.

Anonymous · Aug 18, 2005

trading range in the given period

I am not sure what you mean by trading range.

When I see that the likelihood is high, because there is sufficient occurences of something happening, eg. within a day a contract price moves from the low to the high of 400 pips, if I risk about 15 pips in exchange for half of that 400 pips (ie. 200) it should be a risk worth taking.

That is, if I hit one of that 200 pips even after 5 cut-losses (5 x 15 pips = 75 pips) I could still break-even even if I don't make a profit.

Taking further into consideration the possibility of hitting the losing streak like 10 times cut-losses in a row, a 200-400 pips potential is what I look for, when trading reversals, medium or longer term.

JumpOff · Aug 18, 2005

Re:cms VT jerk symptom:

I looked into that demo platform a year ago, and at that time the demo platform hdw just couldn't keep up with the all the client requests (at least that's what the techie/sales guy said). He said the live server is smoother and you don't get the "can't find server" "out of range" messages..

JO

Anonymous · Aug 19, 2005

stalls and jumps a few pips at once a little bit later

Such occurences can be interpreted as divergences.

If there are 4 banks: Bank 1, Bank 2, Bank 3, Bank 4, quoting the same contract. If Banks 1, 2 and 3 quote something very similar to one another's quotes, but Bank 4 quotes something different from the other 3. Bank 4's quote could be treated as an obvious mispricing.

Such divergences can be profitable trades, assuming the company doesn't later refuse to be bound by its trades claiming things like "misquotes".

tomkit66 · Aug 19, 2005

Anonymous said:
I am not sure what you mean by trading range.

When I see that the likelihood is high, because there is sufficient occurences of something happening, eg. within a day a contract price moves from the low to the high of 400 pips, if I risk about 15 pips in exchange for half of that 400 pips (ie. 200) it should be a risk worth taking.

That is, if I hit one of that 200 pips even after 5 cut-losses (5 x 15 pips = 75 pips) I could still break-even even if I don't make a profit.

Taking further into consideration the possibility of hitting the losing streak like 10 times cut-losses in a row, a 200-400 pips potential is what I look for, when trading reversals, medium or longer term.

Sorry for my bad english - it´s not my motherlanguage. I´ll try to explain.

If you say you are willing to risk 15 pips don´t you have to make sure if those 15 pips are enough to cover the markets hourly-daily-weekly range?

If you look at dailies and the daily trading range is 400 pips, risking 15 pips might cause losses because the amount is too tight for the market and/or time period and you get stopped out to soon even the trade would have been right.

tomkit66 · Aug 19, 2005

JumpOff said:
Re:cms VT jerk symptom:

I looked into that demo platform a year ago, and at that time the demo platform hdw just couldn't keep up with the all the client requests (at least that's what the techie/sales guy said). He said the live server is smoother and you don't get the "can't find server" "out of range" messages..

JO

Hi,

Yes, that´s what they´ve told me as well. There are many threads on other forums as well who are complaining about that and discussing how smart it is to drive potential customers away putting them on sloppy demo servers...

I am testing PFG Forex - a nightmare so far. Charting would be beautiful but the Client freezes and the order screen won´t update at all.

What combination of charting and brokerage do you use?

tomkit66 · Aug 19, 2005

Anonymous said:
Such occurences can be interpreted as divergences.

Interesting !

In that case I was just pointing out the difference between the 2 Demos (CMS/VT Trader and MT 4).

While MT4 was updating a few times each second, CMS would just stay at the same price to fill those ticks with one jump after a few seconds.

Anonymous · Aug 19, 2005

hourly-daily-weekly range

If you look at the chart using different time scales, eg. 1 min chart, 1 hour chart, 1 day chart, etc., you will see different things.

If you look at a particular contract eg. EURO/US$ quoted by different brokers there is a bid-ask difference. Some brokers may quote 3 pips spread, some quote smaller like 1.5 pips spread.

I use the 15 pips for situations where the bid-ask spread is 3 to 5 pips wide, so that after opening a position the price fluctuation does not hit the stop too soon.

400 pips

I say that amount because that is what I observe happens, when the price is measured from the day low to the day high. Sometimes, during a 24 hour period it goes down 200 pips then reverses to starting point and goes up 200 pips from starting point, so 400 pips. It happens once in a while, quite often.

The 400 pips is the Reward that I think my entry point has the potential of attaining if I enter at the correct point. Because I cannot be certain if I can be right using such a method, which is why I look for large Reward potentials before Risking 15 pips.

It is a method different from arbitrage by which the probability of win is substantially higher.

Diff platforms - Diff Ticks ??

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