Trading Ritual

Hello,

I am new here but just like most newbies getting my feet wet in the world of trading. I lost my money during the boom years thinking I knew everything to trade stocks and only need a computer and an online account.

MY question is as a trader how do you go about a typical trading day?

I appreciate your feedback. Thanks.

Get up, make coffee, turn on PC, check overnight markets, check newsapers online,check emails, read any news reports out in relevant companies, have breakfast, be ready and prepared for mkt open (if time before open) log onto here)

goredskins said:

Hello,

I am new here but just like most newbies getting my feet wet in the world of trading. I lost my money during the boom years thinking I knew everything to trade stocks and only need a computer and an online account.

MY question is as a trader how do you go about a typical trading day?

I appreciate your feedback. Thanks.

Click to expand...

Turn on PC
Open charts
Click buy
Click sell.
Alternately dance the victory dance around the living room and curl up in the fetal position in the corner and cry (depending on trade outcome).

UKtradergirl said:

Turn on PC
Open charts
Click buy
Click sell.
Alternately dance the victory dance around the living room and curl up in the fetal position in the corner and cry (depending on trade outcome).

Click to expand...

More seriously though, it is important to have a plan of action for the day. Spend some time drawing on the charts, support/resistance lines etc, identifying key points that could be reached during the day and what i will do about them.

Thanks for the reply. I cannot watch the market during the day since I am working but listening to the radio and they talked about the futures being down and so expect the stock market to be down when it opens sort of thing. My interest was does anyone have any particular indicator they look at and will pretty much dictate how they trade at the opening or the rest of the day. Thanks again.

The best indicator is no indicator. Or at most one or two mas for direction or reflection (one day I will give up my ma addiction).

Perhaps we could start Indicatoraddicts anonymous. Would anyone like to suggest our 12 step path?


Hello, My name is John and I'm an Indicator Addict.

Its 5 minutes since I last glanced at a 21 ema.

nine said:

The best indicator is no indicator. Or at most one or two mas for direction or reflection (one day I will give up my ma addiction).

Perhaps we could start Indicatoraddicts anonymous. Would anyone like to suggest our 12 step path?


Hello, My name is John and I'm an Indicator Addict.

Its 5 minutes since I last glanced at a 21 ema.

Click to expand...

Yes - good idea! Get together over some drinks and come clean with the group - admit publicly that indicators can be misleading and imbue a false sense of security.

Despite what is said, I still believe you have to jump through the "indicators hurdle" to prove to yourself that you're better off without them. Perhaps though, it's more of a long tunnel than a hurdle?

goredskins said:

Thanks for the reply. I cannot watch the market during the day since I am working but listening to the radio and they talked about the futures being down and so expect the stock market to be down when it opens sort of thing. My interest was does anyone have any particular indicator they look at and will pretty much dictate how they trade at the opening or the rest of the day. Thanks again.

Click to expand...

There are several ways you can try to determine the 'trend of the day'. The 'inside bars' thread on here uses a line drawn at the open to compare prices to and determine if we should be entering long or short, although i'm not sure this would be any help to you as you cannot watch for subsequent movement in the markets.

In your situation you would need to place orders into the market before you left for work. Here is one (very rough) strategy you could use to do this:-

Use a 4 hourly or hourly chart and look for a period of sideways movement that has formed... i.e. the market is moving back and forth within a range with no trend. This is an especially good setup if the bars are constricting, or a triangle pattern is also forming.

Place two orders... a buy order 5 ticks above the high of the range... and a sell 5 ticks below the bottom of the range. Make sure these orders are OCO (one cancels other). As soon as one gets triggered, the other will cancel. Also specify stop losses- i suggest approximately a third of the range distance away. Also if you can do it protect your positions with a trailing stop loss.

This strategy aims to catch breakouts when they happen, in either direction. If you want you could filter this by only going long, or only going short, depending on the overall prior trend. (perhaps using a moving average).

The above is approximately what i do anyway during a trading day, it's just that i tend to make the decisions in live time and on shorter time frames. Simple price action on the chart is all i will tend to look at... and perhaps a moving average- i don't use any particular indicators most of the time.

goredskins said:

Hello,

I am new here but just like most newbies getting my feet wet in the world of trading. I lost my money during the boom years thinking I knew everything to trade stocks and only need a computer and an online account.

MY question is as a trader how do you go about a typical trading day?

I appreciate your feedback. Thanks.

Click to expand...

Basically, my trading day begins just as the market [FTSE] for my trades closes for the day. I then review the trades I've made and see whether my techniques were correct and if there's anything I can learn from my actions.

By the time I've done this and had a few cups of tea (or something stronger if I'd been incredibly successful/unsuccessful), my eod data is in and I update my charts for the following day. I then plan my trade(s) for the following day - print out the charts and update records etc. I do nothing further until the market reopens, then I look at my planned trades and if they are going according to plan I make an entry. I keep a mental stop but always set a limit order so that if the trade goes my way I can be sure of getting something out of it without having to stay glued to the screen during trading hours.

Although I class myself as a a swing trader I'm usually in and out of the trade in one-day these days, so I find it useful to have a glance at the screen every hour or so if I'm in or perhaps every 2 to 3 hours if I'm out or travelling, thus allowing myself to get on with other things. This technique is especially useful if you're travelling and mobile broadband on a laptop give you all you need for this kind of trading.

I'm not sure that this technique would work for very short timeframes but I'm not a short timeframe person. However, if I can make a decent amount in 30 minutes or so, then of course I will take it!

I've developed my style and technique over quite a while and it meets 2 requirements:
1. it enables me to trade successfully.
2. it suits my lifestyle
I think the points above are very important, and very individual, which is why you have to develop them yourself and not slavishly follow somebody else's game plan.

In my view, the most important thing is to have a plan, stick to it until things go wrong, at which time the sensible thing to do is get out and have a big long hard think! In my experience the worst thing you can do is to just give your trading half your attention - that doesn't mean you necessarily got stick to screen all the time but when you are executing your plan you must give it full attention.

apologies for any typos or of the grammar - this was dictated with voice recognition software!

apologized to all who replied to my posts yesterday. It got busy at work yesterday and I was out doing chores all day today, I did not get a chance to be at the computer until now.

I am grateful for everyone who shared what you do, and so detailed, at that!, I printed your replies so I could read them and look at charts using what you outlined. Thanks again.

UKtradergirl said:

Place two orders... a buy order 5 ticks above the high of the range... and a sell 5 ticks below the bottom of the range.

Click to expand...

alternatively, research Toby Crabel's ORB strategy and set the buy stop and sell stop orders at the appropriate "stretch", ie that many points above and below the Open

The Stretch is calculated by taking the 10 period SMA of the absolute difference between the Open and either the High or Low, whichever difference is smaller.

For example, if the Open is 1250, the High is 1258, and the Low is 1240, then we would take the value of 8 for that day because 1258-1250 is 8 which is smaller than 1250-1240 which is 10. We then add together all of these values for the last 10 trading days and divide this by 10 to get the 10 day SMA. This value will then become the Stretch.
Using this strategy, the trader places a buy stop just above the Open price plus the Stretch and a sell stop just below the Open price minus the Stretch. The first stop triggered enters the trader into the trade and the other stop becomes the protective stop.

Crabel's research shows that the earlier in the trading session the entry stop is hit the more likely the trade will be profitable at the close. A market movement that kicks off a trend quickly in the current trading session could add significant profit to a trader's position by the close and should be considered for a multi-day trade.

Extending Crabel's research results it is obvious that as time passes and we are not filled early on then the risk increases and it becomes prudent to reduce the size of the position during the day. Trades filled towards the end of the day carry the most risk and the later in the day the trade is filled the less likely the trader will want to carry that trade overnight.

An alternative form of ORB is a ORBP (Opening Range Breakout Preference) trade which is a one sided ORB trade. If other technical indicators** show a strong trend in one direction then the trader will exercise a "Preference" for the direction in which to trade the ORB trade. A stop to open a position would be placed on the side of the trend only and if filled a protective stop would then be placed.

The calculation of where to place the "stop to open" would be the same as that for the ORB trade: For longs, the Open price plus the Stretch and for shorts the Open price minus the Stretch.


** I don't mean common indicators like Stochs or MACD but Market Internals as the TRIN or PUT/CALL RATIO to determine the "Preference"


My suggestion would be go research or find out about:
1. using Stop orders as Entries
2. trading brackets with pre-determined criteria for entries, stop-losses, targets etc(such as you can set up on most DOM price ladders - I use infinutyfutures's DOM, very easy to learn to use and operate)
3. Toby Crabel
4. ORBs (Crabel's or any other)
5. Market Internals

good luck, hope it helps

by the way, what are "gored skins" ? is that when bullfighters lose ?

Hello,

Thanks for your reply and I will certainly research what you mentioned. I googled Toby Crabel and some of the results show he has a out of circulation book that he published in the 1980's and the copies left are pricey. I also found a website that do trading stratey research that he founded. Also a discussion about his background and his work in a websited called Tradefeed. Apparently, his work show the influence of Victor Niederhoffer who we worked for at one time.

And you are right, I have to research stop orders as entries. I thought you have to place a buy or sell order first then put a stop order.

Incidentally, Redskins is the name of a professional football team I follow and root for.

goredskins said:

Incidentally, Redskins is the name of a professional football team I follow and root for.

Click to expand...

so what do you chant at games "for skins"... "for skins" .... "for skins" ..... ?

goredskins said:

Incidentally, Redskins is the name of a professional football team I follow and root for.

Click to expand...

and no, professional football is played in Europe and South America with a round ball. What you refer to as "football" is actually girls' padded rugby

goredskins said:

Hello,

I am new here but just like most newbies getting my feet wet in the world of trading. I lost my money during the boom years thinking I knew everything to trade stocks and only need a computer and an online account.

MY question is as a trader how do you go about a typical trading day?

I appreciate your feedback. Thanks.

Click to expand...

First thing I do every day is say to myself, I must not get sucked into daytrading. Seriously, I do. Daytrading has cost me, possibly as it has you from what you say, so much money over the years. All because the execution is so easy - point and click - its not even real money in folding notes!

These days I am a swing trader. I know you're ve prior experience in the markets, but don't dismiss swing trading - it takes a lot less time to plan your entries and manage your positions, and the risks are more readily visible.

That said, I am interested right now in trading reversals of the opening range so I suppose tomorrow I shall be glued to the screen right after breakfast (muesli and a pint of tea). Actually, my trading day starts the night before, when I match the chart against my preferred 7 entry patterns and see which fit. If none fit, I wouldn't even open the screen - though they cover all foreseeable scenarios so this has never happened yet, but the entry point is not always reached by the day's actual price action. I try hard to never force the situation to fit my analysis, it should be the other way round.

And now I'm rambling.

Good luck tomorrow!

Start of trading session routine for me is

* Update fibs and previous swing hi/lo areas accomodating the period since my last trading session ended.
a. Note y/days hi/Lo and overnight hi lo
b. Determine price action conditions on the intermediate and trend time frames.
c. Check whether any trend on the above t/f's is co-existant or contra the longer time frame trnd.
d. Note the potential support/resistance/sbr/rbs areas on the trend time frame, keeping an eye on the most immediate area on the intemmediate time zone
e. Note any fundamental data realeases due and any overnight/pre-session developments that may be affecting market sentiment.

This and coffee puts me 'in the zone' and ready to commence a new trading session.

rathcoole_exile said:

so what do you chant at games "for skins"... "for skins" .... "for skins" ..... ?

Click to expand...

No, we say "go skins".

In the states, they are what is called a professional football team. Except for the last few years or so, soccer was not much of a sport played here that I am aware of.

Today we have a professional soccer league and they created a big splash recently by bring beckham to play in the states.

tomorton said:

First thing I do every day is say to myself, I must not get sucked into daytrading. Seriously, I do. Daytrading has cost me, possibly as it has you from what you say, so much money over the years. All because the execution is so easy - point and click - its not even real money in folding notes!

These days I am a swing trader. I know you're ve prior experience in the markets, but don't dismiss swing trading - it takes a lot less time to plan your entries and manage your positions, and the risks are more readily visible.

That said, I am interested right now in trading reversals of the opening range so I suppose tomorrow I shall be glued to the screen right after breakfast (muesli and a pint of tea). Actually, my trading day starts the night before, when I match the chart against my preferred 7 entry patterns and see which fit. If none fit, I wouldn't even open the screen - though they cover all foreseeable scenarios so this has never happened yet, but the entry point is not always reached by the day's actual price action. I try hard to never force the situation to fit my analysis, it should be the other way round.

And now I'm rambling.

Good luck tomorrow!

Click to expand...

You are right on, it is the convenience of point and click which is the same as paying your purchases by credit cards. It is sooo easy.

As for "experience", what I learned is I know nothing and I have to start from the basics before I even put a penny into trading. This is my first foray in Forex or futures and I know nothing about it only that I will be able to trade it at night or early morning in my corner of the world-Eastern Standard time (not sure about the exact times yet).

Your comments about swing trading and the comments about adjusting the time frames on the chart for longer periods might just be the right medium for me.

Would you care to share the entry patterns that you mentioned? Thanks.

bbmac said:

Start of trading session routine for me is

* Update fibs and previous swsing hi/lo areas accomodating the period dince my last trading session ended.
a. Note y/days hi/Lo and overnight hi lo
b. Determine price action conditions on the intermediate and trend time frames.
c. Check whether any trend on the above t/f's is co-existant or contra the longer time frame trnd.
d. Note the potential support/resistance/sbr/rbs areas on the trened time frame, keeping an eye on the most immediate area the inetemmediate time zone
e. Note any fundamental data realeases due and any overnight/pre-session developments that may be affecting market sentiment.

This and coffee puts me 'in the zone' and ready to commence a new trading session.

Click to expand...

Wow! you have my head spinning.

I have to get used to the terminology used here and know what they are. I think I have to print the charts and start drawing by hand the support and resistance levels just to get a feel for it.

What charting program do you use?

Thanks.