One year officialy day trading

This is a discussion on One year officialy day trading within the First Steps forums, part of the Reception category; Originally Posted by kwickwool Geez.......you have been trading all this time and still with a SB, sorry buddy but that ...

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Old Dec 28, 2012, 10:19am   #25
Joined May 2012
Re: One year officialy day trading

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Originally Posted by kwickwool View Post
Geez.......you have been trading all this time and still with a SB, sorry buddy but that is ridiculous, sort yourself out.
Nothing wrong with using a SB for any length of time,I've been using IGINdex for 14 years now,Mind you I am not a big trader.
But do agree trading anything over 1 lot should be done via DMA.

Also, SB's cannot skew their own books more than a couple of points, as this creates opportunities for arbitrage.
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Old Dec 28, 2012, 10:22am   #26
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Re: One year officialy day trading

Buddy, let me give you an analagy to sum this up.

Its a bit like saying that you are a professional rower, someone asks you where you do your training and you say the local hotel gym. If ultimately you are looking to be a professional you have to get out on the water and train professionally.

This is the same thing. If you are trading full time, and you are consistantly making money, you ultimately need to make that step at some stage to the professional stage, and if you are trading fulltime now for a year am surprised you have not already, but good luck to you.
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Old Dec 28, 2012, 10:26am   #27
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Re: One year officialy day trading

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Originally Posted by justtrader View Post
Nothing wrong with using a SB for any length of time,I've been using IGINdex for 14 years now,Mind you I am not a big trader.
But do agree trading anything over 1 lot should be done via DMA.

Also, SB's cannot skew their own books more than a couple of points, as this creates opportunities for arbitrage.
If you count yourself a fulltime trader there is everything wrong with using a SB, if you only trade small amounts like yourself and is mor eof a hobby than anything then yes a SB fits that demographic, but not a fulltime professional trader, simples.

And they do skew their own data which is why they state their data is indicative only, it is their legal get out clause for any difference between their data and the real market.
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Old Dec 28, 2012, 10:50am   #28
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Re: One year officialy day trading

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Originally Posted by samirs View Post
this SB v DMA seems to be an old debate and keeps coming up every now and then

there are several traders here and elsewhere who claim to be full time for years and still SBing (apparently successfully)....whereas there are several others who claim that SB is fools game....

so doesnt look like this debate will come to close in this thread
There is no debate, it is a bit like debating wether water is wet or not.

Simon, MD for capital spreads and one of the biggest and best SB's in the UK stated that the most a winning client has taken from capital spreads is £140,000. I am not demeaning that amount but that statement says everything. A professional trader who claims to be using SB's for years is not a professional trader, there is no debate, simples.
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Old Dec 28, 2012, 10:58am   #29
 
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Re: One year officialy day trading

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Originally Posted by samirs View Post
this SB v DMA seems to be an old debate and keeps coming up every now and then

there are several traders here and elsewhere who claim to be full time for years and still SBing (apparently successfully)....whereas there are several others who claim that SB is fools game....

so doesnt look like this debate will come to close in this thread
Agreed. A trader must be determined enough to find out for themselves. Very few are, most will be satisfied by someone else telling them they don't need to try DMA. Of course there are those that can't afford to open a DMA account, they don't have a choice.
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Old Dec 28, 2012, 11:01am   #30
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Re: One year officialy day trading

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Originally Posted by kwickwool View Post
There is no debate, it is a bit like debating wether water is wet or not.

Simon, MD for capital spreads and one of the biggest and best SB's in the UK stated that the most a winning client has taken from capital spreads is £140,000. I am not demeaning that amount but that statement says everything. A professional trader who claims to be using SB's for years is not a professional trader, there is no debate, simples.
The question is quantifying what a professional trader is ?
Is it how much a trader makes ?
It cannot be someone who simply trades full time as there are a lot of traders,who like myself do, but do not necessarily make much, I do not depend 100% on trading for my income , but its a nice bonus.
A lot of what kwickwool makes sense applied on a personal level.
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Old Dec 28, 2012, 11:31am   #31
 
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Re: One year officialy day trading

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Originally Posted by samirs View Post
questions
- is that £140k for their entire trading career or in a year? If for the entire career then there seems to be some misunderstanding. We need to ask Simon again to clarify that.
- I dont deny what you say. However, logically no one has come up with rational reasons why people cannot make money in SB. There have been analogies and similes. But no rational reason.

e.g. if one sold dow at 13300 at £10 per point and took similar trade on DMA. And lets say dow is at 13000.

What are the ways in which a SB can deny that profit to the punter.

If one is scalping then I agree it is a different matter.

I am not saying these things to challenge but to learn. So please go easy.

Happy Christmas Samirs and all,

There is little difference other than a few points here and there and of course 'out of hours' quotes - that's the most point of interest as it allows the SB to make whatever reasonable price they feel fit with little fear of arbitrage. Even still, they have to be sensible as futures traders and pairs traders will take advantage, using SB's and DMA

This argument has been going on since the word dot and will continue for ever more. I unfortunately have done this discussion to my death.

People have to understand that some will prefer DMA and some will prefer SB, there's no need for anyone to get on their high horse about someones preference. Scalping (trades within minutes) is generally a no for SB as they cannot hedge their books if needed. DMA is fine with this. Also scalping on SB will kill most on spreads as comms are ridiculously high compared to profit percentage. 1 pt spread on a 5pt gain equals 20% commission.

Longer term trades would be fine and by making many several points the odd point discrepancy against the underlying should not make any difference to your profit line, after all you are initially avoiding between 20 and 50% tax to start with - of course this only comes in to effect should one be able to make it in the first place - DMA or not.

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Old Dec 28, 2012, 11:32am   #32
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Re: One year officialy day trading

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Originally Posted by samirs View Post
questions
- is that £140k for their entire trading career or in a year? If for the entire career then there seems to be some misunderstanding. We need to ask Simon again to clarify that.
- I dont deny what you say. However, logically no one has come up with rational reasons why people cannot make money in SB. There have been analogies and similes. But no rational reason.

e.g. if one sold dow at 13300 at £10 per point and took similar trade on DMA. And lets say dow is at 13000.

What are the ways in which a SB can deny that profit to the punter.

If one is scalping then I agree it is a different matter.

I am not saying these things to challenge but to learn. So please go easy.
SB's have a market and certain demographic, for your example as a one off trade probably no difference to DMA But a regular winning trader there will be issues which we all know about.

Simon stated the £140k was the most from one account, therefore the most any client had ever taken from capital spreads, and for all the right reasons mentioned no surprise to this at all.

A professional athlete would not buy cheap trainers or use a hotel gym for the bulk of his training and it is the same here, there is quite simply no debate, all the best tools are required and SB are the hotel gym in professional trading world
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