Can you be long and short at same time?

This is a discussion on Can you be long and short at same time? within the Discretionary Trading forums, part of the Methods category; Originally Posted by kimo'sabby Hypothetically, in principal, it's workable. But, you need to be able to overcome various negating factors. ...

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Old Apr 26, 2013, 6:49pm   #31
 
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

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Originally Posted by kimo'sabby View Post
Hypothetically, in principal, it's workable. But, you need to be able to overcome various negating factors.

Within what market times do you place most of your orders?

Oh come on guys,are you real. We are talking about taking one position in the market one way and one another,someone kindly explain how this can work without arbitrage or using different contracts. Please explain these negating factors and how it can work. I remember having the same argument with Black Swan and sadly people were believing him. I really surprised at how anyone can find a way this can work.
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Old Apr 26, 2013, 7:32pm   #32
 
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

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Originally Posted by Atilla View Post
I'll try and post 2 x live trades next week when there's likely to be lots of news.

EURJPY may be a good candidate in couple of weeks time as it's likely to see/have some big moves.
I still cant see this atilla even with news the positions stay the same and you are in danger of being stopped on one and then the market reversing. Even if you have targets at the point the target is hit you are level and then 50/50 from that point on.
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Old Apr 26, 2013, 7:34pm   #33
 
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

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It's a hedging strategy of sorts, the benefit of which is that I don't need to use stops (other than 'cato' stops) and, I have the potential to turn a profit on the pullbacks as well as the main trend. I admit that putting it into practice isn't as easy as I make the theory sound, but I think the idea has merit and will continue with my experiments on a demo account.
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Old Apr 26, 2013, 7:48pm   #34
 
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

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Originally Posted by Shakone View Post
Why wait? Just choose a hypothetical move, however you want the price to move and show how it would be helpful to be both long and short.
I agree it is not a general trading systerm but can have its uses that's all.

Came out of working on BB breakouts and I think Timsk prob remembers thread I tried out a few ideas.

This sys works best over market OB n OSold tops and bots. News usuallyadds weight to continuation or reversal.

But as mentioned not a regular trading system. Needs patience for setup.
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Old Apr 26, 2013, 7:52pm   #35
 
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

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I still cant see this atilla even with news the positions stay the same and you are in danger of being stopped on one and then the market reversing. Even if you have targets at the point the target is hit you are level and then 50/50 from that point on.
Best to show rather than describe it.

Will try live soon when the opportunity rears its head
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Old Apr 26, 2013, 9:02pm   #36
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

I go long and short sometimes on the same market.

Two types of trades.
Swing(24 hours or less), trying to go longer on some trades
Scalp(15 seconds or less)

Swing is taken on a 1 hour chart, working down from monthly, weekly and daily.
Scalp is taken on a tick chart with S/R on a 1 min chart.

Using stops or money management on both swing and scalps.

I do this on the FTSE, DAX and ASX.

Swing trade is a smaller trade done in A$ on each market with SB account.
Scalp trade is done in the local currency and 5 to 7 times larger size than the swing trade and done on a DMA account.

I also swing trade on the DOW, but sleeping when the DOW is open so no scalp trade's.
Also on occasion hedge markets against each other, but that is another story.
Never done on Forex, but guess it would work.
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Old Apr 26, 2013, 9:48pm   #37
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

The old lulz are still the best.
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Old Apr 26, 2013, 10:38pm   #38
 
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

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Originally Posted by bustech View Post
I go long and short sometimes on the same market.

Two types of trades.
Swing(24 hours or less), trying to go longer on some trades
Scalp(15 seconds or less)

Swing is taken on a 1 hour chart, working down from monthly, weekly and daily.
Scalp is taken on a tick chart with S/R on a 1 min chart.

Using stops or money management on both swing and scalps.

I do this on the FTSE, DAX and ASX.

Swing trade is a smaller trade done in A$ on each market with SB account.
Scalp trade is done in the local currency and 5 to 7 times larger size than the swing trade and done on a DMA account.

I also swing trade on the DOW, but sleeping when the DOW is open so no scalp trade's.
Also on occasion hedge markets against each other, but that is another story.
Never done on Forex, but guess it would work.
Nothing wrong in what you do
Because you take say 1 position short for your swing trade and then say 10 long for your scalp,you are effectively going one way with 9 positions and not really therefore taking trading both ways.

Would you ever go 1 contract long and 1 contract short in the same index? Im sure your answer is no but tell us anyway
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Old Apr 26, 2013, 10:54pm   #39
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

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Nothing wrong in what you do
Because you take say 1 position short for your swing trade and then say 10 long for your scalp,you are effectively going one way with 9 positions and not really therefore taking trading both ways.

Would you ever go 1 contract long and 1 contract short in the same index? Im sure your answer is no but tell us anyway
Never go 1long and 1 short on the same market. No point.
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Old Apr 26, 2013, 11:13pm   #40
 
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

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Originally Posted by bustech View Post
Never go 1long and 1 short on the same market. No point.
thats all im trying to say
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Old Apr 26, 2013, 11:24pm   #41
 
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

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thats all im trying to say
Was beginning to wonder but I'm so glad you've clarified that Flash.
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Old Apr 28, 2013, 2:57pm   #42
 
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

There seems to be zero use of the long and short at once method. Except for your psychological state it is a total waste. No arbitrage possibility there either, a buy is a buy, whether to go long or cover a short, it will take you just as long to get filled. And the same goes for the short side. I see no benefit.
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Old Apr 28, 2013, 5:30pm   #43
 
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

Crazy idea. Going long and short at the same time just means you pay twice as much for the spread and commission. Its like sitting on the fence but paying for it. Either stay out of the market or take a direction.

There are 3 ways to trade:
1) Long
2) Short
3) Neutral

Naturally it has its uses, ie, a long term long and a short term short for example using the same instrument but being long and short on the same time frame on the same instrument does not make any sense whatsoever. The only people that would promote this way of trading are brokers as they are the one's who truly profit in this scenario.

Lee
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Old Apr 28, 2013, 6:56pm   #44
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

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Crazy idea. Going long and short at the same time just means you pay twice as much for the spread and commission. The only people that would promote this way of trading are brokers as they are the one's who truly profit in this scenario.

Lee
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Old Apr 28, 2013, 7:03pm   #45
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Re: Can you be long and short at same time?

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