APW Australia Portfolio Wines

This is a discussion on APW Australia Portfolio Wines within the Brokerages forums, part of the Commercial category; Originally Posted by alexwuk Hi, I Calling Eamonn or anyone else a fraudster is not helpful; I don't have enough ...

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Old Dec 23, 2011, 6:34pm   #101
Joined Oct 2006
Re: APW Australia Portfolio Wines

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexwuk View Post
Hi,
I

Calling Eamonn or anyone else a fraudster is not helpful; I don't have enough information to know if he is, but he has generally supplied the goods I purchased: that's more than I can say for every purported wine merchant out there. Whoever *sold* you wine was probably a shyster .

Alex W.
Egan worked for the company that sold them the wine. Are you starting to get the picture?
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Old Dec 23, 2011, 9:16pm   #102
 
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Joined Dec 2011
Re: APW Australia Portfolio Wines

Yes, I have received multiple, substantial deliveries of purchases from CellarLink UK. All were delivered from LCB Glasgow and all bore "Imported by Australian Portfolio Wines (UK) Ltd" stickers on each bottle, even in seemingly winery sealed cases. The wines were unquestionably genuine, and were exactly as advertised and invoiced; they showed no signs of poor storage or transit throughout their lives.

To clarify why I talk about "LCB Glasgow", given LCB stands for "London City Bond"; basically LCB expanded a lot in the last 20 years and now have 5+ major warehouses around the UK, in addition to their two London based ones (in Barking and Tilbury). So these wines do appear to be stored at LCB's Glasgow warehouse.

From reading this thread I'm obviously slightly uncomfortable in my position as a customer of CellarLink, but clearly a lot of people want just that - someone to buy their wine. I've offered some suggestions for how people can segregate and dispose of their wine in the open market and clarified this question of "tax" which seems to have been throw around a lot a vague and terrible thing, which I feel it need not be. I stand by my offer to consider buying, without tax, wine held at LCB Glasgow which was purchased from APW.
My email is the [first initial of my last name]@[my first name].me.uk

Best,
Alex W.

Last edited by alexwuk; Dec 24, 2011 at 9:57am.
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Old Dec 24, 2011, 1:28am   #103
Joined Sep 2011
Re: APW Australia Portfolio Wines

Well there seems to be a lot of chatter coming from Cellarlink which seemingly does not mention what I see as the main problem with them, and has always been my problem.

First may I say that Mr. Egan mentioned that the “burying” comment I made was taken out of context. Mr Egan appears not to even see that this was a facetious statement.

Getting back to what I see and probably many others may see. This is the fact that Cellarlink appears incapable of putting up invested wine for sale even for sale though an auction. This even occurred as mentioned in a previous post that this was going to be done to settle a debt on a liened account and never happened.

For me, this was never a matter that the value of the wine bought initially as an investment. I am perfectly aware as others that there are ups and downs just the same as there is on the stock market. I would think that a broker who ignored an instruction from a customer to sell his stocks forthwith would soon be in trouble if he didn’t and subsequently the stock dropped through the floor a week later. Not that this is exactly the same for wine, which takes a bit longer to organize.

This certainly puts into ones mind “why was the wine not put up for auction” even if it was to recover debt which Cellarlink was quite allowed to do according to the contract that is kept being thrown in our faces.

This being so it also certainly brings up questions in ones mind. “Why is this So” with the corresponding thoughts of why it may be so.

Cellarlink may bring up the argument that they were waiting for an upturn in the market. This belies the belief that while “waiting” for the upturn, costs and fees accumulated, eventually outstrips the value of the investment.
Right from the start when Cellarlink took management of my wine they were instructed to sell. If they had, and did the same for others the subsequent happenings and the continuation of this forum would never have happened. It would have died with A.P.W.

It has also been stated that wine put up for auction even at “no reserve” may have been “passed in” Generally this means that the bids have not reached the reserve price which is usually kept secret. This is not the case with no reserve. But! there are ways of making sure auctioned items do not get sold at a ridiculously low price. The seller can set a starting price which is disclosed at the start of bidding. This is not a dummy bid (Which is illegal in Australia) as the bid comes from the floor.

I guess we have to ask the question why “no reserve” generally this attracts more people to auctions in hope of getting something at a bargain price. “No Reserve” items invariably get sold.

Also generally when items such as wine are put up for auction to recoup a debt a starting price is usually set to cover this. For example if there is debt outstanding for say about $1000 this plus the cost of selling may be set as the starting price. If the worth of the wine is say $1500 to $2000 average in the market then this is OK. Bidders would be only to glad to get a good wine at a great discount. But if the wine is worth $10,000
And the starting bid is set the same as the example about. This is unconscionable.

Eamonn Egan attitude to you the forum members is a matter of treating you in a contemptuous manner especially in his quote “Passed In” This is not only bad internet netiquette as it is considered shouting at people. Most forums do not allow this.

Welcome to new members and your advice is welcome. I do not think that anyone in this forum has mentioned that his or her gripe is about buying wine from Cellarlink. As a matter of fact any problems in this area would be around like a flash and they would soon go out of business like others have done. It is also interesting that wine which I assume was sent to LCB by APW had these labels on then. Does this mean that they were originally sent to LCB and then moved to Glasgow?

One may like to do a google search on “uvine” about a company that Mr Egan also used to work for before APW.

I have more to say but I will continue in a further post.

As it is now Christmas Eve I wish that all members have a wonderful festive season. A time to relax and enjoy life no matter how someone may try to change it.
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Old Dec 27, 2011, 2:09am   #104
 
3 Posts
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Re: cellar link

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eamonn Egan View Post
13,000 “houses” (aka wines) in the same row all up for sale at the same time, with NOTHING to differentiate them.
As a wine seller you got a problem selling 13,000 wines over 4 years period at no reserve? Even more so that you're also the general manager at APW, and I am sure many clients already instructed you to sell their wines since the APW era.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Eamonn Egan View Post
And of course then there are the taxes the client has not paid in advance to be paid for, so how would you propose that selling at ZERO reserve will in fact pay them.
As the tax will be very low for selling at low price, I do think many clients prefer to pay the low tax and stop wasting their money for cellar link's high fees since a long time ago. This too will be much better exit method many clients prefer than paying the ridiculously high fee for destroying the wines, which seems to be the only exit strategy offered by cellar link.

Look when we bought the wines, we've never been told about the ongoing expensive fees. We just expected the wines will be sold for a profit or a loss (but of course APW made us believe we'll make a profit), and that's it. The contract by cellar link is made when we already bought the wines, and we're given no option to enter the contract or send back the wines at a very high price. I foolishly entered the contract and believed that cellar link will sell the wines as instructed.

Again, Eamonn Egan is the general manager for both APW and cellar link.

Last edited by floater; Dec 27, 2011 at 2:37am.
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Old Dec 27, 2011, 2:22am   #105
Joined Oct 2006
Re: cellar link

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Originally Posted by floater View Post
As a wine seller you got a problem selling 13,000 wines over 4 years period at no reserve?.

Yeah and in Scotland too, that lot would be gone in two minutes if the Jocks got to hear about it.
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Old Dec 30, 2011, 12:02pm   #106
 
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Re: cellar link

"As the tax will be very low for selling at low price, I do think many clients prefer to pay the low tax and stop wasting their money for cellar link's high fees since a long time ago. This too will be much better exit method many clients prefer than paying the ridiculously high fee for destroying the wines, which seems to be the only exit strategy offered by cellar link."

is the VAT paid on the price its sold at (retail price), or what we paid for it (wholesale price). I did a quick calculation on the VAT and Duty payable for me to give the wine away to friends in the UK and it came to a reasonably scary figure. If you give it away, how would the VAT be calculated ?
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Old Dec 30, 2011, 12:04pm   #107
 
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Joined Dec 2011
Re: APW Australia Portfolio Wines

Quote:
Originally Posted by pboyles View Post
Have you actually personally received any of the wine you bought? I mean picked it up or had it delivered to you home?
yes, I've received everything stored in OZ reasonably quickly and in good condition,
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Old Dec 31, 2011, 1:56am   #108
 
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Re: cellar link

Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzyjohn View Post
"<snip> is the VAT paid on the price its sold at (retail price), or what we paid for it (wholesale price). I did a quick calculation on the VAT and Duty payable for me to give the wine away to friends in the UK and it came to a reasonably scary figure. If you give it away, how would the VAT be calculated ?
Hi ozzyjohn,

From reading the links below, I think the Import VAT is calculated on the purchase value as detailed on the original customs receipt at time of import by APW.

Here is a link to HMRC on Import VAT; scroll down to Import VAT.

HM Revenue & Customs: Customs Duty, Excise Duty and Import VAT: introduction

Also this might be relevant,



Hope this helps.

Regards,

Stormfront
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Old Dec 31, 2011, 2:04am   #109
 
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Re: APW Australia Portfolio Wines

Hello Eamonn,

Could you explain why no option has been offered to clients to sell the wines in auction houses such as the ones mentioned in a previous post eg Straker Chadwick?

Also, given the large volumes of wine available, why no successful trade sales have been made to hotels, restaurant chains or wine clubs? If they have, I apologise but I have not heard of any clients having this opportunity.

Regards,

Stormfront
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Old Jan 1, 2012, 4:48am   #110
 
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Joined Dec 2011
Re: cellar link

Quote:
Originally Posted by ozzyjohn View Post
"As the tax will be very low for selling at low price, I do think many clients prefer to pay the low tax and stop wasting their money for cellar link's high fees since a long time ago. This too will be much better exit method many clients prefer than paying the ridiculously high fee for destroying the wines, which seems to be the only exit strategy offered by cellar link."

is the VAT paid on the price its sold at (retail price), or what we paid for it (wholesale price). I did a quick calculation on the VAT and Duty payable for me to give the wine away to friends in the UK and it came to a reasonably scary figure. If you give it away, how would the VAT be calculated ?
Hi ozzyjohn,

Actually, my presumption is based on post #128, which quoted below. Based on that, the worse you have to pay for the VAt is £1.80 per bottle. But I do think with no reserve, the wines should sell more than zero and enough to cover the VAT.

You can also consider alexwuk offer too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexwuk View Post
Having read a little more, I can add the following:

Tax. Britain has two taxes on wine. One is a fixed price per bottle (duty) and is around £1.80 per bottle. The other is VAT and is a percentage of the sale price (20pct) if the sale price is low, therefore the tax is low...
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