Anyone heard of Day Trade to Win

No idea, but there's so much free information about on here and on the internet regarding every possible trading strategy you can think of thast you NEVER need to pay for a course.

Find a method that you think suits you and then either demo trade it or trade it for pennies and build from there.

If you're still unsure post here what type of trading you'd like to do...scalping, day trading, swing trading etc and someone will try and point you in the right direction
 
Courses like this, promsing effortless rewards through trading systems are -without exception- a complete waste of money. The information is generally basic, wrong, and can be found for nothing by a quick google. I have been in retail broking for over 10 years, and have yet to see one make money for anyone but the owner. They make money by charging for the course, taking a cut of the revenue you pay their 'moninated' broker or both.

If a website or mailshot uses the words 'effortless', 'free' or 'system' it's never going to be worth it. Banks will pay the brightest mathematicians hige sums to work out trading strategies; is it really likely ayou can beat them by paying a couple of hundred bucks for a 'system'?
 
Bought - tried to get a refund- still waiting

Hi All,

I bought this course in Jan 09 and traded a sim account on NT for a few weeks to see if it actually works.

The course is well structured and looks good but the stops are very wide, 6pnts with a
2pnt target. Needless to say I did not have a positive result during my trading. The worst of it all is that I asked for a refund based on his policy and I provied him with evidence. Still waiting for a response from him and it's been two weeks already.. Not holding my breath... Paypal also can not help me out as the item was not purchased from eBay..some quirk in their policy.

Anyway, ber very careful if you want to try out this system. I'm resigned to the fact that my $397 has gone on his new car and I won't see it again.

Courses like this, promsing effortless rewards through trading systems are -without exception- a complete waste of money. The information is generally basic, wrong, and can be found for nothing by a quick google. I have been in retail broking for over 10 years, and have yet to see one make money for anyone but the owner. They make money by charging for the course, taking a cut of the revenue you pay their 'moninated' broker or both.

If a website or mailshot uses the words 'effortless', 'free' or 'system' it's never going to be worth it. Banks will pay the brightest mathematicians hige sums to work out trading strategies; is it really likely ayou can beat them by paying a couple of hundred bucks for a 'system'?
 
Hi All,

I have been trading this system for a few months now. I did not buy the course but instead leased the indicator for Ninja for a month. Within a couple of days it became apparent that it is a simple breakout system so I did not renew the indicator. I paper traded through the new year and have been trading a real account since the first of the year. I was not comfortable with the 6 pts of risk for 2 pts of profit so I just use 4 pts. This has only failed a couple of times vs. the 6 pts risk. You'll notice from his website he only uses 5 pts risk for his performance chart but if you watch the videos he starts with somewhere in the 8-10 range when he gets filled.

For me, I'm happy trading his "method". In my two months approx that I've been trading this with real money I'm ahead which is great. I don't aspire to use this to provide my livelihood but as long as it is profitable I'm going to keep trading it.

I've never talked to John other than to pay for the indicator lease so I don't know how he is as far as customer service goes. Hope this might be helpful for anyone considering this system. I don't necessarily now that I am endorsing this method or not...I think I would consider myself neutral.
 
"Traderslab" has not basis for complaining, not a real trader

Hi All,

I bought this course in Jan 09 and traded a sim account on NT for a few weeks to see if it actually works.

The course is well structured and looks good but the stops are very wide, 6pnts with a
2pnt target. Needless to say I did not have a positive result during my trading. The worst of it all is that I asked for a refund based on his policy and I provied him with evidence. Still waiting for a response from him and it's been two weeks already.. Not holding my breath... Paypal also can not help me out as the item was not purchased from eBay..some quirk in their policy.

Anyway, ber very careful if you want to try out this system. I'm resigned to the fact that my $397 has gone on his new car and I won't see it again.

Bernie,

It seems you misunderstood the refund policy. "If after 30 days of using the exact methods that I teach" You did not wait 30days. You sent a half baked 2 week trade setup with 10 trades a day that you were trading on a Sim account with selective days???. I sent you back a Corrected excel spreadsheet and 12 charts as proof you do not know what you are doing when following my methodology. You also seem to enjoy posting negative remarks anywhere you can.
It seems to me you are a vendor and competitor "traderslab" and have your own agenda.
Instead of asking me for help and for guidance, you instead tried to bully your way for a refund, without basis. I will post your log here. What i teach is not to over trade. i teach to be consistent.
Let me set the record straight for you. you purchased the course in Jan 21, 2009. 30 days need to complete before you send me a refund request. That would be only after Feb 22,2009. I have taken the time to correct all the mistakes you made + sent you the charts as proof. So now i ask you to remove the negative remarks you have made because as you know you have no basis for your complaints. There are many clients that have posted true and accurate results on this forum http://www.trade2win.com/boards/seminars-tutors/44804-daytradetowin-22.html
If you have an agenda then lets hear it, otherwise if you want to become a better trader then i invite you to ask me questions to help you achieve that goal.
 

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Real experiances with Day Trade To Win

Hello,

I am considering looking into this company: Day trade to win, I just don't wanna get scammed, do any of you experience Emini Traders have some input for me?

Here is the link to the site so you can see who I am talking about: Day Trade to Win Official Site, E mini S&P Futures Day Trading System, Strategy and Automation

There is a thread started which is very extensive and with real results from clients. I invite you to check out this thread.

http://www.trade2win.com/boards/commercial-systems/51820-anyone-heard-day-trade-win.html#post693328
 
Hi John,

Firstly let me be very clear. I do not have a hidden adgenda, nor am I a vendor or competitor.

Your refund policy as sent to me by you via e-mail is..and this is verbatim

"If within 30 days of using the exact methods that I teach, your trading
history proves you have not yielded a profit of at least the purchase
of the E-Course, you will promptly receive a refund. No questions asked. The
E-Course will be yours to keep!"

Where in that statement does it say that you have to trade for 30 days. The dictionary defines "within" as "Before the specified duration ends".

As for the trading results posted. It's a sim account used for testing new systems. So often the sim account shows a net loss becuase various systems/theories are being tested. The trading log has missing days because I could not trade everyday due to work commitments - It's not half baked and selective as you suggest. It also shows many trades per day and again this is expected as I try new theories and or systems. This is what a sim account can be used for and is used for by me.

As for bullying my way to a refund, well you could not be further from the truth. Lets explore this a bit further...Here is a summary of communication with you:

18th Feb (less than 30 days from purchase) - Sent you inital enquiry about refund
20th Feb - you replied with request for trading log
20th Feb - Sent you the log
21st Feb - Sent you e-mail to confirm you had recieved my e-mail
24th Feb - Sent e-mail again requesting confirmation of receipt of log
24th Feb - You replied "Got it"
3rd March - Sent you e-mail asking for update
4th March - Sent another e-mail
8th March - Reply from you
8th March - Sent you antother e-mail
13th March - Reply from you with "marked up" log and charts

As for the proof that I do not know what I'm doing with regards to your method and /or I did not follow your method. On the days that I traded I have very similar results to your posted results. As seen below:

Your Trades - From your web site


1/22/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
11:20 AM
SHORT
Winner
2 POINTS
$1,000
$2,000

1/23/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
10:00 AM
LONG
Winner
2 & 4 Pts
$1,500
$3,000

2/03/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
11:15 AM
LONG
BREAK EVEN
0 POINTS
$0
$0

2/05/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
10:15 AM
SHORT
LOSS
(-5pts)
-$2,500
-$5,000

2/06/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
10:50 AM
LONG
Winner
2 & 4 Pts
$1,500
$3,000

2/09/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
10:20 AM
SHORT
LOSS
(-5pts)
-$2,500
($5 000)


AT THE OPEN TRADE
11:50 AM
LONG
WINNER
2 & 4 Pts
$1,500
$3 000

2/11/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
10:25 AM
SHORT
WINNER
2 & 4 Pts
$1,500
$3 000

2/12/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
10:10 AM
SHORT
LOSS
(-5pts)
-$2,500
($5 000)


Your Total
-$500


My Trades

1/22/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
11:21 AM
SHORT
Winner
2 POINTS
$100


1/23/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
9:58 AM
LONG
Winner
2 Points
$100


2/03/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
11:16 AM
LONG
LOSS
(-6pnts)
-$600


2/05/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
10:13 AM
SHORT
LOSS
(-2pnts)
-$100


2/06/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
10:55 AM
LONG
B/E
0
$0


2/09/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
10:16 AM
SHORT
LOSS
(-3.75 pnts)
-$375



AT THE OPEN TRADE
10:45 AM
LONG
WINNER
3pnts
$300


2/11/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
11:15 AM
SHORT
LOSS
(-4 Pnts)
-$300


2/12/2009
AT THE OPEN TRADE
10:07 AM
SHORT
LOSS
(-6pnts)
-$300


My Total
-$1,175


So please lets have all the facts here. I've given you my simulations results and they are very similar to your results. I did not trade every single day due to other commitments. I tried to follow the method as best I could and for the most part I do believe that I did. I asked for a refund based on my results and based on a "within 30 days" policy. I was not having any luck with communicating with you hence I posted feedback on various website. Since the posting of the fedback you have been quick to reply to me.

Regards,
 
Hi All,

Since posting my last post I have been in contact with John Paul. I would like to clarify the situation.

In my opinion, the refund policy as stated to me via an e-mail from John, implies that you have 30 days to try the system and request a refund. However John has clarified the point that you should actually trade the system for 30 trade days and then discuss the possibility of a refund.

I can accept that and on reflection that is a reasonable requirement. I however did not trade the system for a full 30 days based on my mis-interprtation of the policy. I thought it was 30 calander days, of which I was unable to trade the system every single day.

Thus my results are not a true reflection of the system. To clarify the actual system all I can say is it is well written, very simple to understand and the results posted on the web site (in my opinion) are true and correct when checked against historical charts.

I am posting these comments as a person who is not affiliated with John Paul or daytradetowin.com. John, in my opinion is a fair and honest person and unfortunately in this instance my frustration due to a percived lack of communication lead me to post comments on this forum that perhaps should have been resolved via e-mail contact.


I hope this clarifies the situation
 
Would slippage have a sufficiently large impact to translate their hypothetical results into negative expectancy in live trading?
 
He promotes the use of limit orders to control slippage. I have always done that but I know from talking with my broker who handles a few others trading this system that some jump in at market or cheat the price by a tick in fear of not getting filled. Those two items could certainly have an impact on the results.
 
Refund obtained.

wow that seems like a quick turnaround considering your previous posts, Traderslab.


Message to all. John has refunded my purchase and I see no further reason to discuss the topic. Yes it took a while and yes it took some extreme measures, however John did honour the refund and I am happy with the outcome.

Regards,
 
Good

Hi All,

Since posting my last post I have been in contact with John Paul. I would like to clarify the situation.

In my opinion, the refund policy as stated to me via an e-mail from John, implies that you have 30 days to try the system and request a refund. However John has clarified the point that you should actually trade the system for 30 trade days and then discuss the possibility of a refund.

I can accept that and on reflection that is a reasonable requirement. I however did not trade the system for a full 30 days based on my mis-interprtation of the policy. I thought it was 30 calander days, of which I was unable to trade the system every single day.

Thus my results are not a true reflection of the system. To clarify the actual system all I can say is it is well written, very simple to understand and the results posted on the web site (in my opinion) are true and correct when checked against historical charts.

I am posting these comments as a person who is not affiliated with John Paul or daytradetowin.com. John, in my opinion is a fair and honest person and unfortunately in this instance my frustration due to a percived lack of communication lead me to post comments on this forum that perhaps should have been resolved via e-mail contact.


I hope this clarifies the situation


Wells said and it took great care to do what you did. I hope this settles everything.
 
New

I have not yet bought the system, but have been trading it on Sim for the past 4+ weeks. I am not a new trader, but a bit seasoned (4-6 years PT/FT). In my Sim account I have done very very well using 20 contracts and sometimes 5 contracts as a probe. Since I am not a new trader, I use other indicators on my charts and I have other info to help guide me in the best direction for the market. On average, I grossed $25,000+ a week using the Sim account with tight stops and sometimes 5pts stops. For the Newbie trader I recommend this system, but also give a warning that you should use this system to supplement what you are currently doing. Use continue education to help better your system of doing things. No system is fail proof, but John appears honest if you listen to him and read these post. But don't go off that. Study about trading the E-Mini and find your own style and then use his together to better your odds. There is nothing wrong with him trying to make a buck. Capitalism. KISS. Need I say more? Have you ever tried running a business from an idea you got? Do you know how hard it is to sell that idea and profit and give customer service? Put yourself in his personal shoes?

Again, I haven't yet bought the system, but feel that just with the free 3 chapters, and my experience, it was more than enough. To give a peak into how I was able to use his system to do that well in the Sim, I will share a bit below to validate that it works.

I wait until 7:30am (PST) and watch a 60, 30, 15, etc... charts with my MA. I also have charts of the Bonds, Gold & ViX glaring at me. Then I have the TICK, TRIN, ADV vs DECL, INDEX"S, PUT CALL RATIO'S etc... on a quote screen using E-Signal. That along with a bit more (I have 18 monitors in my home office), I was able to use critical thinking (experience & knowledge) to make the best guess on market direction. I make sure there is a perponderance (if spelled correctly) of evidence before pushing the NT button using John's parameters. Meanwhile, 9 out of 10 times, the market went well. If I failed, I was quick to use NT Rev button and go the other direction, again due to what I stated above. I was averaging $5,000 a day or more. Finished. John's methods 90% of the time was profitable and I was done before 9-10 (PST). I was using $10,000 in the SIM account and sometimes ($50,000). So again, I used it every single day PERIOD. And still use it. I will be going live with it soon, but wanted to check everything out before I proceed, and I recommend you to do the same. Do your due diligence on anything & everything, and expect what you put out is what you will get. Do the homework, put in the time, be consistent. Study. His price is reasonable and I guess if you work hard at it, it will pay for itself in the first week, if not, the first day! Study people! :idea:


PS.

The other dude, who was complaining, to season traders, its obvious you don't know what your doing. You seem like the type that looks for the bad in things first, and don't do your due diligence prior. Trading is a business (to me). Treat it very serious or get back on the freeway like the rest of them!
 
I have not yet bought the system, but have been trading it on Sim for the past 4+ weeks. I am not a new trader, but a bit seasoned (4-6 years PT/FT). In my Sim account I have done very very well using 20 contracts and sometimes 5 contracts as a probe. Since I am not a new trader, I use other indicators on my charts and I have other info to help guide me in the best direction for the market. On average, I grossed $25,000+ a week using the Sim account with tight stops and sometimes 5pts stops. For the Newbie trader I recommend this system, but also give a warning that you should use this system to supplement what you are currently doing. Use continue education to help better your system of doing things. No system is fail proof, but John appears honest if you listen to him and read these post. But don't go off that. Study about trading the E-Mini and find your own style and then use his together to better your odds. There is nothing wrong with him trying to make a buck. Capitalism. KISS. Need I say more? Have you ever tried running a business from an idea you got? Do you know how hard it is to sell that idea and profit and give customer service? Put yourself in his personal shoes?

Again, I haven't yet bought the system, but feel that just with the free 3 chapters, and my experience, it was more than enough. To give a peak into how I was able to use his system to do that well in the Sim, I will share a bit below to validate that it works.

I wait until 7:30am (PST) and watch a 60, 30, 15, etc... charts with my MA. I also have charts of the Bonds, Gold & ViX glaring at me. Then I have the TICK, TRIN, ADV vs DECL, INDEX"S, PUT CALL RATIO'S etc... on a quote screen using E-Signal. That along with a bit more (I have 18 monitors in my home office), I was able to use critical thinking (experience & knowledge) to make the best guess on market direction. I make sure there is a perponderance (if spelled correctly) of evidence before pushing the NT button using John's parameters. Meanwhile, 9 out of 10 times, the market went well. If I failed, I was quick to use NT Rev button and go the other direction, again due to what I stated above. I was averaging $5,000 a day or more. Finished. John's methods 90% of the time was profitable and I was done before 9-10 (PST). I was using $10,000 in the SIM account and sometimes ($50,000). So again, I used it every single day PERIOD. And still use it. I will be going live with it soon, but wanted to check everything out before I proceed, and I recommend you to do the same. Do your due diligence on anything & everything, and expect what you put out is what you will get. Do the homework, put in the time, be consistent. Study. His price is reasonable and I guess if you work hard at it, it will pay for itself in the first week, if not, the first day! Study people! :idea:


PS.

The other dude, who was complaining, to season traders, its obvious you don't know what your doing. You seem like the type that looks for the bad in things first, and don't do your due diligence prior. Trading is a business (to me). Treat it very serious or get back on the freeway like the rest of them!

So you haven't brought the system but have managed to SIM trade it. Interesting.

You have the free ebook (available to only a select few) which has no details on entries & exits but you felt that was enough to trade it.

The first three 'free' chapters of this course do not give any hint as to what the system is. All the free ebook tells you is what the futures market is, what commission is, what Ninja trader is. As a 'seasoned trader' I am suprised you learnt anything from this.

I am impressed that you are making money from an opening range breakout system when that system is not described in the free ebook. Even on a SIM account - it is quite amazing. Must be those 18 screens :whistling

Really though - how can you say the system works without having brought the book & traded it ?

I can understand you being succesful - but you are promoting something you admit you haven't read & trying to use your 'success' as an endorsement.

What's your cut ?
 
Feed Back

So you haven't brought the system but have managed to SIM trade it. Interesting.

You have the free ebook (available to only a select few) which has no details on entries & exits but you felt that was enough to trade it.

The first three 'free' chapters of this course do not give any hint as to what the system is. All the free ebook tells you is what the futures market is, what commission is, what Ninja trader is. As a 'seasoned trader' I am suprised you learnt anything from this.

I am impressed that you are making money from an opening range breakout system when that system is not described in the free ebook. Even on a SIM account - it is quite amazing. Must be those 18 screens :whistling

Really though - how can you say the system works without having brought the book & traded it ?

I can understand you being succesful - but you are promoting something you admit you haven't read & trying to use your 'success' as an endorsement.

What's your cut ?

This is my first time ever commenting on any online Forum or Boards. I guess I am coming of age. Sitting day in and out, making profit in my Live accounts (trading Forex & Equities also), you get a little bored. Using money management & time management... I feel I am on top of things. I read 2-3 trading books a month and now I have read over 50 books so far and counting.

It felt weird to see someone comment on something I thought of out of no where. I went with my gut. I guess your right in a way, but look at it from the big picture. First I am just like all other serious traders, always looking for more ways to be better than I already am. Second, I don't get a "cut" from no where except the markets. Hehehehehe. Your funny. I used to read other posts where people blame a person in some way for being a part of the company. Now its me, and I'm laughing as I write this. It just feels good to have someone comment after you say something, and receive a email stating such.

Again, you raised some valid points, but again "caveat emptor". Look it up if you don't know what it means. I just was adding my 2 cents to anyone who had mind to take a look. Again, it must be all my screens because I am ordering another 24 in June to set up my options trading and expand. I like to see charts and prefer to see them layed out. Meanwhile good luck with what ever trading style and type that you trade. Thanks for the reply! :clap:

PS

I don't tell everything on how I trade in the post. I learned something when I ran my other companies in the past, which was, "don't tell all your business otherwise there will be competition". If there is a lot of competition, then it won't work out soon. That said, I didn't go into great detail how I chose my entry and exit. But if you get John's free chapters, you can see some of his setup using NT. Tweek them a bit (based on experience). If you know how to trade, you know your own signals of when and where to enter. Too many to discuss here. But all that I have said, should give a clue to wise traders that I know what I am looking at and can make a good decision of when, where and how to enter. Dicipline using NT and John's parameter should give you the exit. If you don't move your stop's and be a man about them, then you can honor the exits (move them up if you have to). So... again there I go again. Thanks again for replying. If John is reading this... I keep getting your emails, and no I haven't pushed that button to stop sending them yet. I am like a spider in the web watching, thinking, learning, waiting. With patience I with ACT, with a plan that is. Good strategy too when trading. As a seasoned trader, you know that you probally have learned a lot and seen the same thing over but in a different format. What I find out now is that as I continue to educate myself, I might go through a book, seminar, webinar or even a website in a mater of hours. From all of that I might just gleam just one simple small thing (even a sentence), that I can add to my building roledex of information. If your new to trading, you try to take it all in and that can over load your circuits. Success is based on Warfar, therefore get in there fight and try to find that angle that gives you the edge. That's my story and I'm sticken to it!
 
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With 42 screens, I just hope your trading returns are higher than your electricity bill !
 
Be Serious! WERE TALKING ABOUT PEOPLE'S MONEY!

You gotta be kidding me. The cost to run one screen in a 24 hr period is $0.13 or for 12 hours is $0.07. I don't keep them on for either. I have them all on in the morning from 6:30am (PST) til around 10:30am. Then again on from the evening around 5:00pm til 7:00 pm. Total hours run about 6 hour a day and they are all off on the weekends and at night (Sunday exception). That comes to $0.42 per monitor x 18 at a estimated cost of $7.56 to run my business. Cheaper than any employee (if you ever hired one before). Take that along with my operation costs (you know exchange fee's data fee's etc... @$30 per day x 20 days), is not bad. I trade 20+ days a month plus the cost of my other electric usage, therefore my electric cost should be at least $151 mth minimum, right? Well my bill is under $100 per month! My electric bill is reasonable as I am earth friendly and don't waste. I don't waste in my trading, life and daily habits. Again, Time Management along with Money Management. You sound now "facetious". Be real when you challenge someone.(n) One serious trader to the next.

PS.

Besides $75 to run my work equipment (trading) monthly, would you believe it if I told you that I make 10 x that per day (the minimum)? You gotta be kidding me! :LOL:
 
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