Orderflow trading/scalping with OrderBookFX

This is a discussion on Orderflow trading/scalping with OrderBookFX within the Forex Net Trap forums, part of the Specialists' Corner category; [QUOTE=surferking;1655670 From what I saw 100-200% per year should be easily achievable with little to no drawdown in any one ...

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Old Aug 26, 2011, 10:57am   #17
Joined May 2009
Re: Orderflow trading/scalping with OrderBookFX

[QUOTE=surferking;1655670
From what I saw 100-200% per year should be easily achievable with little to no drawdown in any one day but as I keep saying, this is not set and forget, you need to factor in the screentime.

[/QUOTE]

Hi Marcus, orderflow is something that interests me a lot but find the above somewhat alarming.

Is orderbookfx a case of simply turning up with 20-30k and making the above? Nothing in life is that simple from experience. If it was then surely it's a case of saving up enough to live off for 6 months and then work 4 hrs a day?

I'm not doubting for one second that it could be a v good method but neither do I think it's a case of walking straight to the bank.

I'll definitely be having a look to see what they can do.
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Old Aug 26, 2011, 11:33am   #18
 
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Re: Orderflow trading/scalping with OrderBookFX

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Originally Posted by Dubai View Post
Hi Marcus, orderflow is something that interests me a lot but find the above somewhat alarming.

Is orderbookfx a case of simply turning up with 20-30k and making the above? Nothing in life is that simple from experience. If it was then surely it's a case of saving up enough to live off for 6 months and then work 4 hrs a day?

I'm not doubting for one second that it could be a v good method but neither do I think it's a case of walking straight to the bank.

I'll definitely be having a look to see what they can do.
I haven't traded this personally so all my figures are just a summary translated into the usual metrics people look at to decide if a method is worth their time - afterall sharing knowledge here is what helps keep our fund safer from the sharks.

From what I can tell, people who are professional scalpers do it by trading 'the ladder' which can be seen in the screenshot above. This is a list of orders either side of the current price - that is, more information on where future bids and offers are.

So current price and indicators are used to monitor trends and reversals and the orderbook ladder/indicator is used to measure the gravity of those moves and likely continuation of them.

I currently don't know of any other way to get that information on FX pairs for a price that us smalltime retail traders can afford than working on a proprietary trading desk like Reuters/ESP/Bloomberg etc with all the fees that involves.

This seems to be a solution to bridge that gap and make that data available to retail traders so that people can scalp on a level playing field at home, so in that respect it is certainly worth looking at - in the same way as computerised trading charts and analysis was worth looking at when that first became affordable for retail traders. It doesn't make trading easier, just more accessible and levels the playing field with the professionals.

I can't comment on what the average person could make with these tools because everyone is different so I'm just reporting what I've seen in the webinar and info I've gathered from other people trailing it and suggesting some broad averages.

I suggest a minimum level of manual trading aptitude is necessary for this and it is a very specific style of trading that is screentime intensive so to that extent it is not going to be a case of 'simply turning up' for most people, and judging by the various levels of trading knowledge here alone I'd suggest straight away it won't suit 70% of people in here. However for those that it does suit I see no reason why you couldn't do it for a living if you wished, plenty of people already do but it's just rare for them to show others how they do it - understandably.

Personally for me I like to learn and know everything about any subject I'm involved in so learning from this is valuable regardless.

As with everything 'buyer beware' and people will need to decide what suits their abilities, interests, other commitments and risk capital.

I do see value in adding opinions here from those it does suit on their results and those it doesn't suit as to why to help us all make more informed decisions so the more people looking into it the more informed we can all be.

(I was watching "A beautiful mind' last night - for anyone that has seen it, this is a good example of his adaption of Adam Smith's law on group behaviour - no-one goes for the blond and everyone gets laid )
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Old Aug 26, 2011, 11:43am   #19
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Re: Orderflow trading/scalping with OrderBookFX

This will be my third day in the live room now. Currently Nick's trading the London session, which I understand doesn't normally happen.

I will say, my understanding of orderflow used in conjunction with price action is becoming clearer the more I'm here. (unfortunately I think this is my last free day).

I don't know about just turning up with 20 - 30K and everything is rosy from there on, but in the few day's I've observed the trades in real time, the average annual returns he makes certainly seems possible.

However, he's been doing this for a very long time and know's exactly what he's looking at. Reactions to placing trades is split second. Sometimes there might be three or four trades all placed within seconds. Also quite a lot of hedging trades do happen. (It's not really hedging - it's netting out. A trade doesn't get closed individually, rather all the trades are merged to give a net position at the end of the day) And as lot size's are increasing / decreasing throughout several trades there's a hell of a lot to take in.

With out a doubt, you'd need a broker than gives you very fast fills and the lowest spread / commission you can find. I can see how this could go scarily wrong if you don't practice and learn on demo account first.

Even if you are in room it's not really just a case of following what Nick's trading. Because things can sometimes happen so fast you really have to understand the system and how Order Book works and learn to trade it yourself imho.

It is though one of the most impressive few days I've spent on learning / observing trading that I've experienced. And orderflow really does seem to give you that edge on 'what's about to happen'.

Last edited by runningdeer; Aug 26, 2011 at 4:35pm.
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Old Aug 26, 2011, 4:39pm   #20
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Re: Orderflow trading/scalping with OrderBookFX

Quick update on being in the live room today. It looked by the end of trading Nick had made around $250000 plus. He did happen to mention that it was an exceptional day!
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Old Aug 26, 2011, 5:09pm   #21
 
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Re: Orderflow trading/scalping with OrderBookFX

surferking started this thread Thanks for the update.

Don't tell him but I record it, just so I can watch it later so I'll be interested to catchup. And no I won't be sharing the video, it's gigabytes and I'm sure if you ask nicely he'd let you in the trading room for a 1 day trial.

From what I've read on brokers Dukascopy is the only real straight-through broker to do this with, so it's a £1,000 account opening minimum for those interested. But it is a handy account to have if you don't trust your broker and want to trade manually (or re-write EAs into JForex strategies). Their iPhone app is pretty good too.

The JForex platform is fast and perfectly useable for most people if you're not reliant on too many MT4 specific indicators so no concerns there.

Anyone else following this?
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Old Aug 27, 2011, 6:54am   #22
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Re: Orderflow trading/scalping with OrderBookFX

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Originally Posted by surferking View Post
Thanks for the update.

Don't tell him but I record it, just so I can watch it later so I'll be interested to catchup. And no I won't be sharing the video, it's gigabytes and I'm sure if you ask nicely he'd let you in the trading room for a 1 day trial.

From what I've read on brokers Dukascopy is the only real straight-through broker to do this with, so it's a £1,000 account opening minimum for those interested. But it is a handy account to have if you don't trust your broker and want to trade manually (or re-write EAs into JForex strategies). Their iPhone app is pretty good too.

The JForex platform is fast and perfectly useable for most people if you're not reliant on too many MT4 specific indicators so no concerns there.

Anyone else following this?
Hi Marcus, bigger brokers than Dukascopy if you dig deep enough. Deutsche bank Autobahn is huge. Marex Black has very deep liquidity. You can then obviously get into actually trading with banks such as Barclays etc. I have Marex black for testing and it's pretty good. Based on currenex platform.
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Old Aug 27, 2011, 9:03pm   #23
 
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Re: Orderflow trading/scalping with OrderBookFX

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Originally Posted by Dubai View Post
Hi Marcus, bigger brokers than Dukascopy if you dig deep enough. Deutsche bank Autobahn is huge. Marex Black has very deep liquidity. You can then obviously get into actually trading with banks such as Barclays etc. I have Marex black for testing and it's pretty good. Based on currenex platform.
Sure, don't think they'll be tripping over themselves for my small account though.

There seems to be some more info on their forum too for anyone interested:

http://forum.orderbookfx.com/
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Old Aug 30, 2011, 9:47pm   #24
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Re: Orderflow trading/scalping with OrderBookFX

I attended the overview webinar last night, lasted just under 2 hours. Viewing the webinar also gives you a days trial in the trading room, spent about 3 hours in there today (day off work).
It was quite an eye opener, clearly order flow is very powerful information if you know how to use it properly. Nick comes across as incredibly knowledgeable and is obviously making a success of his trading, to put it mildly.
One thing I have learnt though is that I wouldnt be able to take advantage of this, as mentioned by others in this thread its pretty intense constantly watching the charts, jumping in and out of trades, doubling up on positions... you would probably have to spend quite a while practising on demo before goin at it with real money. Being at work full time would make it very difficult to trade like he does, non the less it was very interesting and something to perhaps consider in the future.
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